I will just tell you an anecdote from a match yesterday.
Map was Dorado, I played support. We are getting rolled by good genji. I picked Baptiste and peel the diving genji and lucio. Match went on normally, we had bit less time left on our attackround than the enemy and go into the 3rd round.
I am being callled out for my healing stats and decided to focus more on healing.
Proceed to my entire team getting rolled by their genji and lucio. DPS wasn’t able to hit him. We lost.
My point here is:
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Even if you give evey support autoaim, the playersbase won’t learn to aim because of it. Problems persist.
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Even if you nerf flankers and mobility, the playerbase won’t learn to aim because of it. Problems persist.
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The support role has nothing to do with the problem of mobile heroes. Competent players on support can kill a genji/lucio/tracer better than any bad player on DPS.
You people act like we all not play with each other ingame. Most people placed in bronze-gold. Everyone can see with their own eyes in almost every match that a lot of people simply can’t aim, can’t hit flankers with their leftclick.
People on this forum use so much excuses and made up rhetoric to explain why they can’t hit flankers. I see absurd nonsense like “hyper mobility counters aim”.
My dudes, most everyone can play a mobile hero and experience for themselves that players lack the skills to peel for themselves.
I can queue gold right now, pick genji and have a extremely high chance to play against people that queued for the competitive mode of a fps, and that can’t get their crosshair on a flanker.
Drop your charade and excuses. We are playing the same game with the same Playerbase.
3 Likes
This is WHY people say hypermobility counters aim.
They can hit targets which don’t have hypermobility, but the SAME level of aim they have doesn’t work on the hyper mobility heroes.
Or to put it another way, hitting small fast moving heroes is harder than big slow ones.
The “mobility counters aim” is actually short hand for “mobility counters precision weapons.”
So, the answer to a hypermobile hero can’t be “just shoot them in the head” when you would be normally good enough to do so on regular heroes.
This is why mobility counters are things like turrets, and the like.
Because it removes the advantage which mobility gives them. - and brings them back to the same level as everyone else.
Relying on aim to deal with them, is naturally harder than relying on aim to deal with regular heroes, so it counters it.
TL;DR: aimed weapons are EXPECTED to have a lower effective damage per second against hyper mobile heroes, because more shots will miss for a persons given level of aim.
53 Likes
Do you not understand that a lot of people don’t have these problems you have in the same game you are playing? And still you try to look for the problems INSIDE the game.
Stop trying to implement your laziness into the game mechanics. People that practice aim have no problems against flankers.
Especially the past days, there are so many trash genjis now because of all the whining. They are literally free kills. How am I getting countered by them? Its obviously a skill matchup.
They have LESS problems against non flankers. Because they can turn that aim into consistent headshots, where they can’t do that against the hyper mobile heroes.
Again… they are expected to have a lower damage per second against the flankers than against regular heroes.
19 Likes
Yes, so whats the problem here? The person that can hit them despite, or the person that can’t?
I can go down to your level and start making up “counters” too. How about aim practice counters mobility? How about pushing payload counters losing?
they are expected to have a lower damage per second against the flankers than against regular heroes.
No. hits a binary. You either hit or you don’t. If you don’t, its your problem. Not the game mechanics.
The problem is that you balance the heroes based on their expected damage per second on them.
The flankers are going up against non mobile heroes, so their effective damage per second is higher than the reverse.
So, Blizzard puts in heroes which are designed to remove that advantage. They have area effect stuns and the like.
And the heroes are balanced around those things being in the game.
Right?
Now, you REMOVE those things, and then the hypermobile heroes become a LOT stronger. Their counters which they were balanced around, are gone.
So, now you have heroes which have the advantage of hypermobility, but NOT the counterbalance of the abilities which were designed to keep them from dominating the game.
24 Likes
No dude, a leftclick on a tracer is the same damage as on a reaper. This “dps” mental gymnastics you are trying to present is just bizarre.
You either hit or you don’t. If you don’t, its your problem. Not the game mechanics.
Right, but 5 left clicks AT a tracer is less likely to have the same damage as 5 clicks AT a reaper.
Because you are expected to miss MORE shots against the Tracer. Because she is a harder target to hit.
Your expected DPS drops, because people don’t have perfect aim.
A widow HITTING a Genji in the head does the same damage as her hitting a S76 in the head, but she is FAR more likely to miss shots against the Genji.
So her effective TTK is worse vs Genji.
20 Likes
DPS is not balanced around people NOT hitting the target. Do you not see how absurd your argument is?
BALANCE of DPS is based around the chances of them hitting the target.
Or to put it another way. If you ignore the requirements to hit, Widow would be the perfect hero.
So for balance purposes you take the difficulty of hitting with and against the hero into account when balancing them.
If you don’t think that is a thing, then lets give ALL of the supports blinks and double jumps and see how that goes.
18 Likes
I have a good question for you.
When people try out new heroes in practice range. Do you miss every 3rd shot intentionally if you want to get a impression of the DPS a hero can make?
Do the moving bots in practice range actively counter you?
When you are standing still and they move around, according to your logic the player is getting countered by the practice range bots. Can you see how absurd this is?
I had a match where I had to argue with someone over voice chat. We have an enemy Reaper literally camping our spawn cause no one wanted to deal with him except me as Moira. The 76 on our team claimed I sucked at healing cause my numbers weren’t as good as the Lucio on our team and I had to point out that he’s not helping kill the Reaper that keeps killing me. He complained about how high my damage was and I had to point out that my damage was tied with him so he must suck as a DPS and he didn’t like that.
6 Likes
Ok, then we have an answer for you.
Lets give all of the supports double jump and 1/2 their hitbox size, and say double their speed.
Since you think that won’t make fighting them any harder, you should be happy to see it.
You are still expecting to hit all your shots against them right? You wouldn’t see them as harder targets to hit, you wouldn’t expect your damage values to be lower against them in game?
22 Likes
Answer my question. Stop deflecting.
That is answering your question.
You don’t honestly expect you would be able to hit them as much, and THAT would effect your damage against them in matches.
16 Likes
Do the moving practice bots on the practice range counter a still standing mccree?
Not really, since McCree hasn’t got time pressures. You are not trying to get a certain amount of damage out each second against them because you are perfectly safe.
But, if you had a score about how many you could destroy in a minute, then you would find it harder to do so against faster moving ones, with smaller hitboxes.
13 Likes
colt you seem a bit too obsessed with people not hitting the obnoxiously mobile flankers…
14 Likes
A left click will hit a Reaper much, much easier and often than it will hit a Tracer. A flashbang cowboy was much more dangerous for a symmetra that for a Tracer.
No one has perfect aim. Not even pros.
There is a reason why Tracer dominated pro-play for years on end. Spammy combat mobility is the strongest survivability tool a DPS hero can ask.
14 Likes
Correct. Because mobility doesn’t counter aim. There is no hitchance when you press leftclick on an enemy. Its binary you hit or not.
The provided mechanics are plenty enough to hit any hero. The problem is on you.