Except lots of people take it seriously.
Same with the people who claim that Brigitte can win by “only pressing W+M1”.
Just because an argument is ridiculous doesn’t mean that a hate mob isn’t going to use it.
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These constant mercy rez posts are a blight on this forum. Mercy is boring, but balanced.
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In terms of Overwatch, “balanced” sounds like an insult, synonymous to “niche” hero.
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See I actually did ask Titanium what their goal was with these threads and they told me that it was not to advocate that mass Rez should return but to point out issues that they see with the character and the community’s attitude toward her as well as they can .
Even if Titanium does want mass Rez back why should it take away from the points they have made that aren’t directly linked to it. If they point out Valkyrie’s issues why does their stance on mass Rez invalidate those points.
As I myself have stated many times, I don’t want mass Rez back, but Valkyrie has its own set of problems and we shouldn’t pretend it doesn’t because of our feelings about mass Rez.
There are better options.
I play the game now and I played the game then and if you take a look around at the people that have played through all the changes the game has received there is a lot of backlash and for good reason.
Pointing out issues and asking for them to be addressed is what a community that does care about a game should do. Addressing these concerns is what the devs should do.
I’m not saying they should give in to what any one person or even majority is saying, but treating your community with silence is a surefire way to get them to stop caring about your game if they find issues within it.
Again many people don’t even want mass Rez back, they just see issue with Valkyrie and have enough faith in blizzard left to believe they can do better.
This is about discussion, maybe you should put forward how you think the game could improve instead of belittling those that put in more effort than you.
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Mercy is currently too weak to be a main healer and doesn’t have the utility to be an off healer. How is she either balanced or in a healthy spot?
To clarify I don’t think she should be buffed because ATM her kit is fundamentally flawed, Mercy has never been properly balanced and that is not a good thing.
Not OP does not equal balanced.
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If the goal is to discuss problems with Valkyrie is it necessary to complicate things with this thread regarding hyperbolic arguments that were made regarding how common Hide and Rez was?
Personally I would say no.
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I said the goal was to promote discussion, discussion can cover many topics. Including trying to get people to question more deeply what problems they truly had with an ability.
There are many issues with Mercy and many misconceptions from people who don’t play her.
Addressing these does attempt to get people to think a little more deeply.
At least people that are honest enough to think outside of their own assumptions.
I didn’t say that this post was to discuss problems with Valkyrie, I brought it up as the comment i replied to mentioned Titanium’s other posts and as it is a topic of discussion being discussed here. I did say that the post was meant to promote discussion in general, particularly about
and how that may skew the way the see and respond to discussion about her and any suggested changes.
I dont see how this topic regarding Mass Rez is necessary for any of what you described.
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including hyperbole like “Mercy is currently too weak to be a main healer and doesn’t have the utility to be an off healer.”
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A large majority of people above mid Plat do not consider Mercy a main healer, you will get many games where someone will ask for a main healer while you are playing Mercy. She is not considered a main healer in the game at the moment because her healing is too weak compared to Moira and Ana.
This is the only reply I am making to you, as I felt it was worth expanding. However you are a known troll and I am not going to get into another “factually” argument with you.
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Topic attempting to promote discussion about
I do not believe there is valid data to back up such a claim
There are people who like Mercy at every tier of play, and there are people who dislike Mercy at every tier of play.
She is picked in consequential professional matches, and several GM-level players main her. Some of these GM level players even produce videos demonstrating her solid effectiveness at very high levels of play
I have explained elsewhere that she has considerable advantages as a healer over Ana and Moira. Advantages that help ensure that I get gold healing almost every time when playing on a team that includes another healer - any other healer. I get that some people dont understand that, but one is not required to switch characters based one’s teammates lack of knowledge
I do not believe that I am a troll, nor do I believe that I have acted the part of one in this or any thread. I have responded to posts made by others with relevant facts and opinions, all within the rules of the forum, and I do not believe this constitutes the acts of a troll
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Don’t think you will see anyone defending this tbh, because nobody really likes this element of gameplay for those heroes which is more the fault of Sombra than the involved supports. If they’re caught in EMP, which is an AoE with no cast time (so you need to distance yourself from it to avoid it), Zen basically instantly dies and Lucio turns into a training bot.
Make EMP telegraphable and you will see more reactive plays instead of just straight avoidance.
Well, you are the only one I’m aware of who is doing it (I’m sure others would be capable to, but they aren’t doing it). That said, I think your topics are doing more harm than good these days, though that is my personal view that probably originates from my deteriorating respect for you. I’m only one disgruntled former player so my opinion on this matters little, if at all. I do wish these polarizing topics weren’t getting so much attention though due to the hostility that seem to grow within them.
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Pretty much this. In a lot of team compositions in OWL and Contenders, your observations are spot on, Cleo.
Mercy isn’t useful in a choke, because her healing is not enough in the poke wars in chokes and corners (Ana is more useful there). So the trend in the meta is getting first picks/kills on the enemy via Zen and Widow (the exception to this is PharMercy). The Valk ult is primarily useful in pressuring the enemy via damage boost or flying to DPS to pressure them with the pistol. I saw this A LOT in OWL, most team fights focus on getting the first kills on the enemy, then cleaning up afterwards.
The heals are useful only when it is coupled with her mobility – the most notable is when it’s quad DPS with single healer and single tank (Orisa). Her capability to fly to DPS holding different positions and top up an Orisa using fortify is that good (see: compositions in Contenders for 1st point attack in Route 66, I first saw it in Korean Contenders, team Stormquake used Mercy, Orisa, S76, Widow, Hanzo and Pharah). In most games where there is a Pharah in Contenders, Mercy is used a lot – compositions with a PharMercy is considered a decent counter to GOATS.
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Mass Rez and a whole bunch of math isn’t required to promote discussion about “the community’s attitude toward her.” The original post in this thread, as far as I can see it, was directed to a segment of the community that would make arguments such as “Hide and rez was happening every game! All Mercy’s hid and rezzed!” and stuff like that. These arguments really haven’t been brought up a lot at all recently around here.
“Revisiting” this topic is completely unnecessary if you’re “attempting to promote discussion about the community’s attitude toward her.” In fact, I would suggest that it’s sort of counter productive to that goal, as it over complicates the matter and introduces a lot of relatively irrelevant subject matter to the “discussion of the community’s attitude toward her.”
That said, this topic of Hide and Rez and how common it was has been done to death. Personally, I don’t see why it being common or not is even important to thee discussion. Furthermore, the methodology employed by the OP is terribly flawed. Trying to use healing numbers to calculate how common hide and rez was is a terrible approach. As Slyther said, the fact it was an SR exploit means it wasn’t common. Otherwise, it wouldn’t be an SR exploit, it would simply be par for the course. See? Simple. No math needed.
As you can see from how this thread played out, I don’t see this as a good way to “promote discussion about the community’s attitude toward her.” It was obvious from the start how this would all play out, and it was unnecessary to “revisit.”
Terrible thread.
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I don’t think so. I have reservations about Titanium’s approach too, but it did bring out interesting posts, so no, not a terrible thread.
What were the interesting points for you? I personally didn’t see any. Then, seeing the quality of the discussion that came from it, I’m compelled to believe the forum would’ve been better off without it.
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Well Jayne has repeatedly said she doesn’t, so there we have a very prominent and influential professional figure (with a massive public platform) arguing against that point.
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Let’s just do it here Titanium.
And then…
Remember that? So check out what I said about Mass Rez and 1:1-5 in your last big thread. Look at what I’ve said here… And respond.
Let’s talk about it. No worries about hitting a post limit here. And tbh, this thread of yours, pretty much exactly what I was referring to when I said “I see you more eager to pick low hanging fruit, arguing in ways you know most people won’t be able to adequately respond to.”
I think I adequately responded to your original post in this thread. Junk methodology, literally pointless exercise. So. Let’s talk about it.
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