In what world a support should be likely to win a 1v1 versus a DPS

[Ebookie-1527]

@fresquet-21215

The thing is that whenever I play Ana and a Genji jumps to me, I nade the floor and bait the deflect. It’s just easy to do, and Ana is my 3rd most played character. Genji’s damage is inconsistent and the Ana is able to 1v1 me and, if she gets peeled, it’s impossible for me to kill her.

This tells me only one thing: the Genjis you are fighting are bad at this game.

[MrSandvich-21925]

@fresquet-21215

His dmg and his shift do a lot too.

His Shift is literally the definition of a defensive self - sustain.

His left click on the other hand deals ideal DPS for a Main Support if you ask me at least…

[Zephrin-11143]

@fresquet-21215

Bap has got a faster fire rate.

faster firerate than genji, but not tracer. fan, because of it firing multiple shurikens at the same time, is likely to hit more often in closer ranges (where genji wants to be for the duel) than bap’s weapon.

@fresquet-21215

Ana has got a nade which doesn’t require skill to land on a flanker

not the core condition for ana’s peel, sleep is.

@fresquet-21215

and a sleep which requires skill but literally gets the flanker dead, with no opportunity to escape

again, that average 17% accuracy and and average 6 sleeps per match shows how the matchups are skewed towards flankers already for ana and yet you want to skew it further…

[Shadow-119113]

As a borderline flanker OT, this thread is hilarious.

[Silent-16912]

I don’t completely agree. I think with some skill, any support hero can put up a good fight (at the very least) against dps heroes. Getting flanked by reaper, or genji, or doomfist, or tracer shouldn’t mean that you just DIE. However, I do agree that supports are a little too much right now and need to be tuned down. Baptiste and ana feel like supports that do too much imo, I made a comment about this that I’ll quote below.

@Silent-16912

The problem with all these new heroes is they overkit them.

Think about Rein and winston. Simple kits. Monkey can jump and shield, Reinhardt can shield, charge, or fire strike. Now look at newer tanks. Orisa and Sigma compared to Rein and Winston. Both Orisa and sigma can harrass while their barrier is up (rein cannot). Both orisa and sigma have defensive abilities when their shield drops (winston and rein do not). Both orisa and sigma have crowd control (winston’s only cc is knocback on his jump which isnt much at all, and his ult which in the end is… an ult. Rein’s cc is pretty much a death sentence if not used on close ranged enemies or without a competent team).

Same thing with supports. Older supports like mercy, lucio, and zen all did fewer things than newer supports. Mercy was a great pocket and could not effectively deal damage and heal simultaneously, (Ana can). Lucio was great at aoe heals but his healing was never “great” his speed boost compensated for that by giving him another way to support his team. And zenyatta like lucio had not great healing but offered more support to his team in damage output with discord. Newer supports seem to cover so many things for their team, high healing, great CC, anti healing, literal immortality, mobility, 50% damage buff and damage reductions along with 250 healing on an ultimate, 100% more damage on an ultimate.

Older heroes may maintain some relevance, but newer heroes are spitting on what the game used to be. Every new hero has to be great at too many things now.

My two-cents anyway.

It’s less about whether ana or baptiste or brigitte are broken, and more about bringing attention to the differences between release heroes and post-release heroes. They do too much basically.

Flanking a mercy elicits one of two responses: Mercy flies to a teammate, or she says “No U” and whips out the glock to “try” to 1v1. Additionally she may just frickin’ DIE because she’s ignorant, but I think those two are the most common things. Flanking an Ana or Baptiste results in a cluster-bomb of responses. Maybe you get slept, or bio-nade’d (60 damage/anti-heal). Or baptiste “jumps the hell away” only to turn on you with his very fair and balanced damage. Which I only consider fair and balanced because of everything else he has in his kit: Literal immortality, vertical mobility, self healing. All that and he can also challenge your damage output with his. On hitscan mind you.

Let’s step back and take another look at flanking an original-release support. Zenyatta. Zen compared to bap. “Zen’s damage is pretty high though Snuggles, he’s not much different than Bap.” Right, except he has no escape, he has to charge and waste his ultimate if he wants to escape. And even though his damage may be high (for a support) he is NOT ONLY a projectile hero, but he also has the WORST healing in the game (debatable with lucio). So yeah, it’s requited.

Anyway to sum it all up, new heroes do too much. Yeh.

[SumoJedi-1949]

Support wins duel cause they outsmart you.
Simple.

[Axafekt-1863]

Please name a game where supports don’t defend themselves?

Apex
Paladins
Rogue
Valorant
Lol
Wow
Skyrim
I think even the paramedics in gta will swing on you.

You understand that in the real world combat medics do fight as well?

[Watsyurdeal-1478]

Simple answer…a player who has good aim and mechanics to out duel most players.

Assuming both players have equal skill, the DPS has a slight edge, but that’s kind of the point…they’re damage heroes.

[Axafekt-1863]

Every support player at all ranks knows which dps is the one you shouldn’t peek and which one you might be able to make plays on.

I am sorry you are in the latter. But thats a you problem not a fundamental issue with the game. Its like me blaming nikes footballs because I can’t throw.

[Akary-1113]

@fresquet-21215

If a support has got a high probability to win a 1v1 against a DPS, it means that Supp. role is just a better DPS role.

Not necessarily higher sustain doesn’t equal better dps, just like roadhogs higher sustain doesn’t mean better tank…

Take widow if she landed all her headshots no support would rival her 1v1 which would make her a DPS goddess.

[Axafekt-1863]

Seen kephrii clap frogger trying to farm him on lucio.

But you don’t need to be a widow God to easily win support 1v1s

Dps has so much variety if you are losing a fight against 1 particular support you can always opt to hard counter them.

[Akary-1113]

@Axafekt-1863

hard counter them.

if it is strictly 1v1 with no 1 else to intervene only hard counter would be sombra She does splendidly with most supports.

[Moira-21906]

@fresquet-21215

6s cd fade, self heal with RMB and if she’s got orb it’s just immortality for her, at least if the character I play doesn’t have a one-shot.

Well if you can’t kill someone as DPS in 6 seconds… in a 1v1…

Also your fault for 1v1 a Moira knowing she has orb if you can’t kill her, also this is a team game not a 1v1 game.

[YouNeedHeals-2384]

For example. Brig was supposed to counter dive, THEREFORE, she SHOULD win(Not necessary kill the opponent, just make them retreat works too) any 1v1 against a dive hero(excluding tanks because they are too tanks for her toothpick). Bap has a good gun, you need to be accurate, seems fair? Zen, great damage, need to be accurate, seems fair? Ana, good damage, need to be accurate, seems fair? Lúcio… moving on, mercy, you don’t fight, you run, Moira, is Moira, moving on, all support heroes can defend themselves either by attacking or fleeing, supports aren’t and shouldn’t be punching bags for you. So if you lost a 1v1 against a support hero, they outplayed you and deserve the praise. Just suck it up.
Edit: don’t even try to deny it, if you ever get into a 1v1 situation as a dps hero against a support hero, the odds of the support hero wining the 1v1 are way way lower than the odds of you as a dps hero winning it. If you consistently lose 1v1 against support heroes, that’s a you problem, not a support heroes problem.