I dont want to be a healthpack

General Discussion
21

At the minimum I would rather not have a passive that is completely useless in combat.

1 Like
22

Would you make other changes?

To me if healing goes down then I think supports should have compensation in other areas like improved utilities or mobility.

23

New Role Passive for Supports: when taking fire (being damage), Supports gain a 25hp/s recover that stops once they are no longer in the threat of taking fire.

Pretty much the reverse of what they have for the role passive.

24

I think the dev’s intent is make everything die faster to achieve faster games.

25

So just lower it in a way that allows Support to survive a little bit longer, but not too much. I’m assuming almost every basic form of healing (primary/secondary fire) are going to be lowered, so might as well give them a passive that converts what they’ve lost, instead of a passive that’s kind of encourages playing passively or is unimpactful.

26

I would personally like that change.

1 Like
27

That’s pretty much the entire reason for a tank and support, to try to deny or slow down DPS.

1 Like
28

Yep and there reducing both damage mitigation and healing to achieve their goal. I just hope supports get some kind of compensation.

29

But there isn’t much form of compensation that does not effect TTK in the way they want besides adding more damage. I hope they understand the hole they are digging.

1 Like
30

We may end up with supports that do more damage with reduced healing.

Maybe all roles will be some version of dps.

31

At that point you may as well remove the two roles, lol.

1 Like
32

A lot of people are likening this to Medic from TF2 because in their brains, anything that makes Overwatch more like TF2 is better.

Medic was the role you could never fill on your league team because nobody wants to spend the entire match crouched behind a wall waiting for their teammates to come by with crit heals so that you could maximize your ubercharge and maybe, if your teammates did a good enough job protecting you, then you would finally get your uber and be able to participate in fight for about six seconds.

I got guilt-tripped into playing that role for one season and I’m not doing it again–not in TF2 and definitely not in OW2.

2 Likes
33

This is an absurd take. Supports need a healing nerf. The change is a healing buff to out of combat healing (relative to how overwatch 2 supports would heal) not the inverse.

There is just no way you can have supports with current healing values with 1 less tank, the most resource intensive role, in the game.

34

I have a hard time taking this at face value. If you look at the previous PvP showcase, fights were not overlong and people were dying. This was before the healing nerf. If you look in Overwatch 1 in situations where both teams traded an off tank, fights don’t go on for too long and people still die. If you look at Overwatch 1’s 4v4 mode, fights are not overlong and people still die.

I’m not claiming that they weren’t seeing long fights, but I think that the claims of never ending fights are just hyperbole mixed in with their experimentation with a faster paced game.

However, even conceding that fights were going on too long in their build, the way they handled it doesn’t make sense. A Moira and a Bap on both sides pumping heals into a brawl style fight is likely to make it go overlong in the absence of an off tank. A Mercy and Zen doing the same is not likely to be a problem. Their combined healing is less than the dps of a Zarya with 0 charge. It makes sense to nerf sources of heavy healing and it makes sense to nerf aoe. It doesn’t make sense to nerf all healing.

One of the major consequences of nerfing all healing is that it messes with many interactions in the game that are completely agnostic to the number of tanks. Mercy needs a certain hps to keep her Ana alive when she’s being attacked by a Genji. This number is completely unaffected by the number of tanks on either side. Hitscan players need a certain amount of time to take down an opposing Pharah, and need to be kept alive during that time. This time doesn’t depend on the number of tanks.

If one thinks of healing as a pool of health that needs to be filled, then a global healing nerf makes sense. Smaller pools need less filling. Healing is not a pool though. It’s a box full of bottles. Some of the bottles are smaller than they were in Overwatch 1, some are the same size.

When adjusting healing numbers, the devs needs to take that into account or they’ll mess with much more than fight length. The solution they end up choosing has to be a much more subtle one that the ham fisted solutions they’ve been trying out.

I can see them nerfing the healing bonus on Ana’s grenade, I can see them decreasing non-ultimate aoe heals, I can see them removing Baptiste’s shift ability, I can see them rebalancing Baptiste and Moira so that they can’t vomit out mass quantities of hps at a whole team while giving them more power in the rest of their kit. I can’t see a world where Zen’s healing needs a nerf, or where Mercy can function with the hps they were trying out (or anything remotely close to it). It’s plain silly.

7 Likes
35

Let’s wait for the actual game to come out. There are new maps and new abilities so trying to argue about anything is pointless until we have playable gameplay!

36

Yup, seems so. Respawnwatch doesn’t sound fun.

1 Like
37

Supports may see their utility increased. Smaller teams may also encourage more grouping up, hopefully. I’m eager to see how balance ends up & how it feels to play as every role (I’m a flex player)

38

Sure, wait until it is too late for them to change anything to give feedback. Sounds like a super duper idea.

1 Like
39

The hero design of OW is so good that no one would become a healbot except Mercy, but Mercy is a good design for new player. The problem of OW2 now is the rebalancing of healer in 5v5, adding a debuff of 25% healing reduction is just too suck.

If OW dev team want to keep the performance of healer in OW2 same as OW1. They should notice that the damage produced by a 5v5 team is approximately 15% less than that of a 6v6 team. But there is 1 less hero to consume health packs of the map, the reduction rate of AOE healing could be larger (25% - 35%) in order to keeping teammates to use the health pack. In addition, blizzard should not nerf healers ultimate because the main purpose of healers ultimate is to stop burst damage. Ultimate cost of healer should be reduce by 15-20% to compensate the healing nerf.

So how to implement the change? Below are the proposals:

  1. Direct nerf: Zenyatta
  • Nerf Zenyatta healing (Orb of Harmony) to 25 hp/s and ultimate (Transcendence) to 250 hp/s with ultimate cost reduce to 1925.

Remark: Sorry for Zenyatta because his healing mechanism is too simple and no way could easily fix him.

  1. Energy regulation reworks: Brigitte, Mercy, Moira, Lucio

  • All of them now have 160 energy, regenerate 3.84 energy while not healing and reduce ultimate cost by 15%.

  • Brigitte need a huge rework if she want to imply energy system.

  • Mercy primary fire cost 11.428 en/s and secondary fire recover 21.875 en/s. Her ultimate will recharge all energy and didn’t use energy while healing.

  • Moria primary fire cost 16 en/s and secondary fire recover 21.875 en/s. Her E skill heal 225 health max (the number could be fine tune a bit because her performance is under average now)

  • Lucio healing aura heal 15hp/s, cost 10.285 en/s and speed up aura recover 21.875 en/s. His E skill cause healing aura cost 50% less and speed up aura recover 100% more.

  1. Others plan: Ana, Baptiste

  • Both of their fire time per shot and reload time will be increase because there is no way to add energy concept to their healing mechanism. Their ultimate cost will reduce 15% for compensation.

  • Ana fire rate will change to 1.136 sec/shot, reload time will change to 2.131 sec.

  • Baptiste fire rate will change to 1.433 sec/shot, reload time will change to 2.388 sec.

40

Never had an issue with that in public games. Only problem was players wasting ubercharge, but that was fixed by being more picky with who you use it on.

Main tool of TF2 Medic never was healing, it was overheal. Fully overhealed team is difficult to put down quickly, 50% extra health is no joke. Fully overhealed Soldier can survive critical rocket - something otherwise only Heavy is capable of.