Rank dependant.
Junkrat and Reaper run rampant in lower ranks, as Reaper is the ultimate tank counter and Junkrat is just RNG.
I agree, but it depends where you look. Most people point to Moira orb being RNG, and Bap’s damage being higher than Soldier 76.
However, I have seen the occasional thread asking for discord orb to have a cooldown.
I personally believe Rat is weaker with the smaller projectile despite the damage increase, but I suppose you are right. I guess my main point is that it is so negligible that the developers do not recognize that it exists which is fair enough.
Eh, they’re a lot less balanced than Hanzo or cree. A lot of DPS were buffed during goats meta to deal with absurd amounts of heal stacking and damage mitigation.
Now with nerfed versions of both of those we have overtuned damage heroes.
Between these two specifics, yes. Reaper’s balanced because armour counters him again, but Mei? God no.
In the 1v1, sure. She ain’t too broken, because she can fall victim to one shots and range. But in a team fight, just holding left click to slow down a target is enough to set up for a team wipe. I’ve had this happen dozens of times too. Her kit itself isn’t what is considered “overpowered/broken,” it’s the slow/freeze effect.
I haven’t seen healing creep get out of hand. In fact, I’d say the devs have intentionally kept healing low so the games don’t get drawn out too long.
3-5 minute fights are rare. Most team fights last 2 minutes.
I’d love to see the power creep scaled back a little bit. Stuff dies way to fast rn
I’d say nerf Reaper down to 30% lifesteal, and do these changes to Mei, then yeah, we good.
Ana, Moira, & Mercy all heal less now than earlier in the game’s life-span (Ana had +100% healing effect for nade & 1 second longer duration for it, Moira had 80 hp/s, & Mercy had 60 hp/s). Baptiste has a steady 72 healing per second, but is more difficult to heal multiple targets than Moira. Brigitte, Zenyatta, & Lucio all heal less than the other healers. Healing has not had any wacky power increases over time.
Damage on the other hand, specifically because of GOATS, got many ridiculous buffs to the point that the tanks & supports in a 2-2-2 world revolve around the damage picks. Like Orisa + Sigma was meta right when 2-2-2 started and still is because Fortify is a percent damage reduction against the insane damage in the game, & Kinetic Grasp eats all damage like Matrix can, plus he also has a barrier to use & combo’s with Orisa very well.
Both of you guys need to understand that it when it came to healing power and output, each successive hero introduced that could heal, was healing more than the past hero up until Brigitte’s introduction. Moira was effectively the last one in terms of healing output.
Those numbers have since been curbed, while healing has trended upward (as has mitigation) Blizzard has been adjusting the numbers down and evening them out since then. Today, healing is stronger than it was at launch, but remains manageable and balanced.
Up until recently, the problem was compounded with mitigation (ie barriers, fortify effects) Blizzard has finally taken noticed and curbed that recently with adjustments towards barriers and readjusting armor values. Expect a few more changes here, but as far as power creep goes in a general sense, there is none.
This is the wrong answer.
Adjusting projectile speed would probably be the best option. Slower charging speed wouldn’t affect much and would largely be inperceptible to most.
This is not a powercreep.
This is, again, the wrong answer and misconstrues what’s been going on with Overwatch as a whole. Every new Support up until Brigitte, was healing more than the last leading to a very perceptible creep. Every new Tank introduced also saw a creep in terms of mitigation and negation of damage that bleed through other heroes (Orisa’s Fortify effects being adapted into Roadhog, Defense Matrix being adapted into Sigma, Barriers being introduced into Supports like Brigitte and defense heroes like Symmetra).
Those trends led to a demand for greater power over sustain. Because Blizzard continue to downward trend damage output, it led to other heroes capable of one-shot attacks being of greater demand and towards Tanks who couldn’t die to one-shots, this eventually led to GOATS. Where utility and mitigation were more valuable that damage output, since most Tanks couldn’t die to one-shot attacks, and utility was presented in addition to powerful healing outputs in Supports.
Sustained damage output - a bulk of what Damage Heroes are capable of - was rendered irrelevant, since they were suspectible to one-shot kills and because both the Support and Tank groups provided similar and competitive levels of sustain without the drawbacks of one-shot kills.
One-shot kills have always been in the game, but there was choice, because healing output, crowd control and mitigation were minimal leading to a good sense of balance, but it was obvious since the beginning that Tanks were favored greatly given all their major perks (easier to heal, barrier mitigation, etc.). Supports enabled Tanks to be more unbalanced that initially perceived and when new Supports were added with utility that enabled them (ie Ana and Nanoboost), it became easy to see where the trends were going as each new Tank and Support were added to the game.
Sounds like the op just wants to spread the idea that healing creep is as big as an issue as power creep which is not true.
Healing has been consistently nerfed since the earliest versions of the game.
Damage has been buffed and some have been overtuned to compensate for particular metas that aren’t even able to be played anymore.
That’s the problem.
I feel that the three digit healthpools probably put some restraints on balance.
Welp, from what I can gather on this post and the entirety of the forums.
One side is saying Healing Creep isn’t an issue but Damage Creep is.
The other is saying Damage Creep isn’t an issue but Healing Creep is.
How about we nerf the whole lot, and I mean EVERY HERO!
So the healing creep started with Ana. It wasn’t a wide spread issue because Ana when she was released did not see much use and also she required aim and triple tank for that kind of healing output.
The easiest way to look at it is 50 hps single target mercy was a main healer and now she’s seen as an off healer.
Damage creep, if there ever was any, can always be mitigated by better positioning, movement or superior offense skill but there is nothing you can do outside of bionade to mitigate healing power.
That’s why healing creep is the actual issue.
Make every instance of damage a one hit kill.
Many don’t seem to understand that both are intrinsically related to one another… but it did start somewhere. Personally I think it already started with the addition of Ana. The implementation of higher possible hps than there was already in-game, combined with an ability that could boost healing kicked off the healing creep (I think survivability creep is a better word as it also comprises damage mitigation and self-survivability (self healing, escape abilities, etc…)) and damage creep quickly followed suit as a reaction. People seem to think that any kind of creep in this game is only a thing from the last 1-2 years, but it’s been going on for pretty much this game’s whole lifespan.
Mercy is a secondary healer because they nerfed her to oblivion not because new heroes introduced keep healing more then her.
Yes, and
So you agree Goats was caused by 1 shots. In fact, every single meta we’ve ever had has been anti-sniper - they drive the meta. That’s a symptom of how powerful they are.
You also agree that 1 shots are more powerful than sustained damage, meaning sustain damage needs to be higher to keep up… …which is why healing and mitigation went up.
Easy way to fix damage creep, healing creepy and one shots in a single move: Double everyone’s HP. Keep everything else the same.
Maybe in a case by case analysis you change some specific heroes, eg, I don’t believe Wrecking Ball need 1200 HP, he could stay at 1000.
No one is at one shot range anymore, and there is enough HP on squishy heroes that healers are able to react if they are busted down and seek cover in time. Still not enough healing to stay in the open taking damage full time.
I wouldnt put it past them to nerf Mercy again in some way. She’s too balanced for how easy she is to play.
No, this is wrong and the patch timelines can easily prove it.
The first balance patch introduced Ana, changed the way Defense Matrix worked to a resource meter and allowed ultimates to be charged through self-healing abilities. They also did the following:
Mercy:
Damage Boost
Effect will no longer stacks with bonus damage provided by another Mercy
Zenyatta
[Orb of Discord] and [Orb of Harmony]
[Transcendence]
The next major patch happened a week later to increase Ana’s effectiveness as she was seen as weak.
Developer Comments: While Ana has been very well received, she was showing to be a little bit weaker overall. In addition to helping her feel better to play, these changes should also increase her healing and damage output.
McCree
Developer Comments: McCree’s latest range increase helped him quite a bit, but it was a bit too much in the right hands. This change weakens his long range damage somewhat, but still keeps it stronger than it has been in the recent past. The other changes combine to allow him to land more alternate fire shots on targets that he has hit with Flashbang.
The major balance changes begin in September with the introduction to Eichenwald. Mercy receives a buff, Lucio’s Amp Speed is reduced, Zenyatta’s Discord Orb is reduced and his damage from an earlier patch is reverted.
This is not what I said. Demand for burst kills because healing and mitigation were becoming too strong drove down the need for sustained offense/defense. It did not help that when Brigitte was introduced, close-ranged heroes like McCree, Tracer and other such flankers were forced back due to Brigitte’s incredible burst potential and stun effects which has since been curbed.
Brigitte didn’t cause any sort of upward trend in mitigation or healing, but her sheer burst potential brought out issues that had long been there and that was issues of value contributions behind offense/defense heroes vs. Tanks and Supports.
Snipers were easy to handle - just bring a barrier or another tank - it was never truly an issue. What was driving out Offense/Defense were the value you could get out of Support and/or a Tank. Why bring Hanzo, Doomfist or Widowmaker, when you can bring Reinhardt who can kill everyone with 300 health and under with Charge and still supply a 2,000 barrier 500 health, and line-based AE Firestrike that halved the health nearly every damage hero and support? Bastion might be his only counter, but Roadhog, or Zarya or D.va easily take care of that with some teamwork.
Those patch notes prove nothing. Ana could very well have been INTRODUCED to counter heavy damage that already existed. As i said before, big healing is caused by big damage.
Yes, of course demand for burst kills goes up with killing stuff gets harder - people dont like doing difficult things. Note that barriers also make killing stuff harder and are a good soft counter to snipers.
Snipers have never been easy to handle because of their potential to get a pick or team wipe, but again, thanks for proving my point - bringing more barriers counters them, so we end up with GOATS. Snipers drive the meta.
And if you think Bastion is the only Rein counter or that Rein’s 1 shot is as good as Widow’s, i recommend actually playing him.