This change i think could make evryone happy and would help low rank.
The change is simple
Headshot multiplier upped from 2x to 3x
Damage per shuriken lowered from 27 to 20.
Just a thought i had what do you think of this change?
id say overall it would end up being too strong in high elo for the genji’s that arnt going to miss headshots.
One of the biggest reasons people whine about Hanzo and Kiriko is not that might never land those headshots often, but the fact that it can happen. At all, ever. Those headshots lead to upsets and those upsets are frequently not seen as skill, but a fluke.
Players are horribly, horribly inconsistent, but we are putting massive reward on landing a small target. The feast/famine nature of that is usually not very good feeling to many involved.
People had it because they feel robbed of life on a fluke. Others are going to dislike it when nothing happens because you keep missing shots leading to this famine or drought of something happening.
I’m always more in favor of more consistent damage sources. High fire rates, lower damage. Upsets happen not because you landed like 1 or 2 shots seldom, but because you can land shots repeatedly.
With him able to double jump and easily spread headshot? At the distance he does?
No.
So that he’s back to one-tapping a 200HP target and dashing away? Nobody uses shurikens on a primary fire, it is always a point-blank righ-click hoping to get the headshot. Getting x3 and 20 base would mean 20x9 = 180 damage, i.e. just enough to have the triple-headshot dash stuff back.
No. Let him be at risk just like any other flankers. Dash in, triple-HS, dash out is a cheap combo that requires disproportionally more effort to counter than to execute. Let him have to decide if he wants to use dash defensively or offensively.
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4 meters is how close he needs to be to hit all 3 in the head
yes but when genji lands a random head shot its 54 damage this would bring it to 60 not realy making that big of a diffrence for low ranks and his poke but it would allow for skilled players to get his combos and make him ever more reliant then he already is on combos.
ya but tracer would still be more consistant and it would reward skilled players that are good and punish bad players.
he can still head shot dash dash ways right now
its not hope its land the head shot
again he can already do that 27x6 is 167 letting him dash for 50 killing 20 was just the best number i could find that didn’t make it unbearable to get body shot kills in my testing
its not cheat he can still do it and his damage would need to be 24 with 2x to not allow that as well it’s a very high-skill combo
He can’t. Right now he will not dash + triple-HS a 200HP hero to 0 HP. He needs a follow up. That means the target can iframe or be saved otherwise. He can do a “one-shot” if he does triple-HS + melee but for that he needs to - surprise - be close to the target meaning it will already be alert of his presence.
The whole absurd with his triple-HS combo before the damage nerf was that it allowed for a “dash out of nowhere” → triple HS (kill target) → dash out. So because the target was not aware of wherever he was dropping in, it could not prepare and it was dead in a split second. Worse, the team couldn’t even punish him because he dashes away after CD reset.
At least right now the target has a chance to react or to be saved. Please, please don’t tell me you’re suggesting this change “just because”. It’s 100% to get that combo back.
I’ll take any genji buffs
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yes he will he does 27 per Shuriken times that by 6 you have 162+50 from dash is 212 damage.
Its still going to create the same feelings of feast or famine which many people do not like at all. It just makes the situation worse.
His primary goes from 92 dps to 68 dps.
Alt fire goes from 120 dps to 88 dps.
That’s going to make genji awful to feel to play when you miss shots, and simply infuriate many that died to a big chunk of damage.
What I feel more people would like is for him to lose his alt fire and empower his primary fire to fire at a faster rate and buff the projectile size. Genji has the very easy kill finisher with swift strike. Many people would feel more fairly matched against him if he too had to fire a straight shooting projectile at close range.
Sombra/Tracer are very annoying, but their reliance upon having to aim their weapon even at close range makes them want to not have people in their face. Genji wants to get into your face to make it hard for you to aim while he can alt fire and not have to aim as much.
no genji likes this ever they tried making his primary better and it was horrible to play genji is a close range fighter i would rather loose my poke then loose my combos
he needs to aim more what. have you played Genji at a high level aiming with Genji is harder than aiming sombra tracers difficulty is tracking with blink like tracking with genji and double jump and dash
The complaints with Genji are predominately low-middle tier.
You even opened as:
Sombra/Tracer players are not much of an issue at lower tiers because since they lack big meaty chunks of damage for people to complain about one shots. They have to track very well to abuse their hitscan. Its more common for fights to last longer as these characters miss portions of their damage. Genji’s easier hitboxes for low-mid tier gaming is more powerful at these levels.
Low-mid tier players don’t care about EMP or Pulse Bomb. They are afraid of Dragonblade. You have 3-4 seconds to get something done before you are dead with how consistent and easy blade is to pull off.
Why do lower tier players hate Torbjorn Turret? Its consistent damage.
Why do players at these levels disllke Moira? Her damage is consistent and pretty much unavoidable.
Why do players dislike Mercy? Her healing is consistent.
Why do people dislike Genji? He has consistent damage.
Less people are upset with Ana or Zen because its like, this characters have to aim most of their stuff. They are going to make mistakes. If I get shot by ana it doesn’t matter. She has to do it another 2 more times to kill me. Its not hanzo where he misses 2-3 shots, then finally lands a full health instant kill.
ya and this would help that because only accualy skilled genjis hitting 3 head shots in a row which is incredibly hard to do with a projectile while making body shots take one more shot to confirm the kill it would give low ranks more time to react and fight back
blade is only easy to pull off if they are standing still litteraly fan out and shoot the genji you will kill him emp gets more value then dragon blade in low ranks i have seen plenty of low-rank vods and dragon blade maybe gets a kill if that most of the time they die intently or get out healed trying to kill someone.
no they hate it because the thing never misses and is hit scan
ya and this would lower that by alot
no lots of people hate them because their abilities are so powerful and easy to land like purple and discord
ya and genji doesnt have that he cant one tap with out mercy he has to dash and head shot all 3 very close to geather or it will be healed over
There are two extremes here. Consistent damage that rarely every drops out and burst damage leading to feast or famine. These will vary depending upon the rank.
Sombra/Tracer turn into consistent and high burst damage the better your aim progresses which is why they scale into higher end content better. Hitscan is still busted in the game. While at lower tiers Genji’s generous hitbox methods scale better with the lower end.
You can say you see more EMP success, but not many will really believe you on it. Most of it is simply there are far more genji players than there are sombra players. EMP tends to flounder more often because it fails to get a kill.
Doing 80dmg for an ult? That’s nothing. Sombra has to shoot the remaining 120 hp that can get healed off? We have the gall to bring up the 120 DPS dragon blade or the 170dmg burst swing + swift strike getting healed off? No one is going to believe emp is a better ult for lower tiers. Everyone is afraid of the dragonblade.
Rightfully so. Securing even 1 kill and dying for it changes the whole match. Trading your life to take out a support is huge value. Even better if you secure a kill and make it out alive. Win the 5v4 fight. There are plenty of dragonblade high value kills because its much more difficult to shut down n a short period of time because Genji can guarantee a kill with virtually no mechanical skill failure.
If you get a kill, Genji can keep going and it becomes easier to get the remaining kills because each kill confirm resets dash and lets you keep chaining. As well as giving you fewer counters to the remaining duration. Its a very lenient and snowbally ult compared to EMP.
Your method of lowering his damage and boosting hs isn’t helping since it feeds into the feast or famine methodology. What people are going to want are longer duels where they can guarantee they might feel like they had a good shot at killing someone before dying.
at all ranks why do you think sombra and tracer are s teir while genji is b teir in bot hlow and high rank
emp is easiest of these 3 to use and have its value used by your team. genjis is next but you need to practice it and will usually get counter ulted and tracers is the hardest because its jank and will not lach for some weird reason.
doing it to everyone to start off a fight comboing it wil and other ult like rein is amazing like nano blade its a good combo ult not as goos on its own.
it does 110 and i have seen it ult blocked and out healed by ana and kiriko whe nthey suzu the target nade that target and heal everything i do and i get killed because i only have 200 hp.
emp is a more consistent ult then dragon
it can or it can be used and counter ulted or you just die while stuck in animation.
sure if they dont have a mercy that undoes it after.
or i could go reaper and get 3 kills on Avrage with beyblade
yes but that is a skill that needs practiced and you cant just have a new player pick up genji and expect them to get blade kills but i can expect the mto get some value out of emp.
its already like that with how low his damage is right now this will just make him more of a combo hero instead of a shot gun hero
ya and thats already a thing watch any low rank game
This seems like a horrible nerf and overall unneeded change, his headshots already do more than enough damage but this would completely ruin his non headshot damage. He couldn’t even full combo kill Tracer
If they make any drastic changes to Genji it should be, IMO, looking into removing nano blade from the game and adjusting him from there
Head hitboxes are massive in this game. How would this help low ranks?
No…we need to stop this low effort high value BULL we keep praisinfmg as if its a blessing.
That is a curse and stops many a player from expressing true skill off their entire hero kits.
I get what you’re trying to do with them - make it so he’s less spammy and rewarded for more intentional hits, so people will stop complaining about Genji - but…man, I feel like I would hate to have Genji on my team on Gold/Plat because they can’t hit headshots lol I don’t think Genji needs any changes
Nano blade should be removed agreed.
You still need to b 4 meters away and above the target to hit all 3 reliably.
This is high effort high value what are you on about.
Its just low ranks already suck at using him and only good genjis climb i thought this could help low rank have more time to react to getting killed