Forced roles are bad and unnecessary

[Jupiter-22679]

Here we go again…

222 isnt forced bud (you choose the role yourself, no one’s doing it for you), either you like it or not it’s going to stay. Threads like these are useless.

[NYMufasa-1229]

ah yes I remember every single game i ever played before role q having a minimum of 3 dps. no one ever ran 222 before role q. ever

Dps players are the majority of the player base so, before role lock its stands to reason that the majority of your teammates may have wanted to play dps. Flex players (like myself) were very rare and players who were to slow to pick their dps before the other 2 were picked, reluctantly filled tank or healer. With role queue, sure dps have to wait longer than other roles. However, every role gets played. The dps players don’t have to argue about who the better dps is, and who should get to play it. When you boot up Overwatch and your desire is to play dps, you’ll be playing dps.

[Megadodo-11847]

One thing I forgot to mention in my experiment which has been going on for a while now.
Is that if you had let’s say one team of six DPS against a team of five DPS and that last slot was a tank or healer, no matter if it was the weakest healer or the weakest tank in the roster, that team had an advantage over the team with six DPS heroes.
This was proven to me multiple times and it goes to show that even having one healer or one tank no matter how weak affects the game a lot vs not having one at all.

Personally I have seen 6DPS teams beat 222, 303, 132, and etc etc teams many, many times

Ive been on 051 teams (I was the 1, as a support main) that beat the other teams allegedly “better balanced” composition of 222 or whatever many times

[Polimorphism-1606]

forced 222 sucks

To you, to many of us it basically saved the game

implementing each one requires changing how the player base is allowed to play overwatch

This could be said about every balance change

and turns balance and matchmaking upside down for devs who are already bad at those things.

They are actually pretty good, and the change makes balance easier.

you are prevented from playing significantly more heroes with forced 222 than with a hero ban system .

Ah, the real point of this thread

I’m prevented from playing more heroes because of my hero pool, not because of either of those.

if you q for tank or support, you are only able to play 7-8 heroes out of 31 total for the duration of the game. but with a 2hero ban system you can play 29 out of 31 heroes for that game.

Potentially, but not many people do that.

And you are making it such that two characters can’t be picked at all. You’re comparing apples and oranges

now calm down just a minute. ok, so what if I also told you that there are other ways to stop 4+ dps comps or goats from being a thing again without role q ? yes it is true.

The benefits of 2-2-2 go further than this

this would be possible thru Role Caps , which would restrict the maximum number of heroes for any one role to be capped at 3, but also require that all roles be selected. so a 3-3 goats comp would not be possible. the only possible combination of roles would 222 or variations or 321.

Doesn’t prevent 3dps 1 healer or 3 dps 1 tank. This is an inadequate replacement.

[RobotWizard-116887]

good players would swap to second healer

Now they are not playing what they want. The people who wanted to dps, but ended up filling every game didn’t much like oldQ.

Now they can play DPS.

[ccarlo-1692]

can’t be any worse than the game is now when 2 people q for dps but you actually only have 1 or 0 dps.

This is just plain wrong though.

having a third good dps and two additional bad dps, was often better than only having 2 dps who weren’t even trying to counter the enemy team

There aren’t enough heroes in the tank and supp roles for hero bans to be viable, this has pretty much 0 chance of happening for years.

there are literally at least 7 heroes in each role, with multiple heroes that can fill a barrier tank or main healer. you’ve got me scratching my head with this one

222 isnt forced bud (you choose the role yourself, no one’s doing it for you), either you like it or not it’s going to stay. Threads like these are useless.

it literally forces 2 supports, 2dps, and 2 tanks only, and makes those players play those roles for the entire game. hence why it’s called forced. you become stuck on a role despite not seeing the map, your teammates, or the enemy team comp your are playing against (which are all incredibly important factors). prior to role q you could take on the role your team needed most and that you most wanted to play, but now you cannot. please refrain from commenting unless it is actually intelligent

Flex players (like myself) were very rare and players who were to slow to pick their dps before the other 2 were picked, reluctantly filled tank or healer… …When you boot up Overwatch and your desire is to play dps, you’ll be playing dps.

I was a flex player, most players at higher ranks were. how well you could flex to compensate for your team also allowed you to climb over players who locked themselves on heroes. see the response above stating why queueing for a role now was not as simple or beneficial as selecting a role after getting in a game.

They are actually pretty good, and the change makes balance easier.

i agree with you in that it makes balancing the game easier. but sigma was launched so long ago and we are in the 4th season of role q with overturned heroes just now being nerfed after about 7 months of bs stale metas[quote=“Polimorphism-1606, post:24, topic:452772”]
Ah, the real point of this thread

I’m prevented from playing more heroes because of my hero pool, not because of either of those.
[/quote]

call me biased but I flexed before role q existed. back when flexing was still a thing, it rewarded you and gave you an advantage over people who only played their mains

The benefits of 2-2-2 go further than this

The primary reason a majority of players on this site are in favor of role q is because 3+ dps comps died and players would no longer get left filling on healer anymore. I’m just trying to inform them that alternatives to the drastic decision of role q exist, and that forced 222 is not the only direction for overwatch. I agree role q had its benefits but it created more problems than it solved. I do not believe it is sustainable, and as queue populations go up the matchmaking keeps getting worse as we are seeing right now

Now they are not playing what they want. The people who wanted to dps, but ended up filling every game didn’t much like oldQ.

Now they can play DPS.

I almost never get to play the hero I want to play, even now during role q I pick the hero I think my team needs most. it was the same back then before 222 too. after filling a couple games, i would finally get to lock a hero i wanted to play for a round or a game, then go back to filling again. queuing with friends just negated the problem entirely because you could all just rotate roles around. unfortunately with role q queuing with friends is now a must if you want reliably decent games which is one of many reasons I want role q removed or improved

[Tiberium-21518]

there are literally at least 7 heroes in each role

Supp and Tank have off and main roles, banning a main tank or main support has an extremely drastic effect on viable team comps. It’s that simple.
The game requires more heroes for it to be viable, and that is also what Jeff stated when they talked about it.

[TobiasAlec-11572]

forced 321 sucks

you say it as if it exists

[ccarlo-1692]

you say it as if it exists

you say that as if no one has ever played on a 3dps/2heals/1tank comp before. spoiler: we have

and it would be hated for all the same reasons as forced 222, PLUS would require completely rebalancing the game around self-sustaining solo tanks. terrible

banning a main tank or main support has an extremely drastic effect on viable team comps

could i have a couple examples?

[Polimorphism-1606]

I agree role q had its benefits but it created more problems than it solved.

How do you even begin to quantify that?

I do not believe it is sustainable, and as queue populations go up the matchmaking keeps getting worse as we are seeing right now

How do you quantify that matchmaking is getting worse? Things seem fine to me

[Fizzbin-1581]

Forced roles are good and completely necessary.

[ccarlo-1692]

How do you quantify that matchmaking is getting worse? Things seem fine to me

tank q is shrinking each season while dps q stays longer. to compensate for larger queue population gaps the game is matching new bronze portrait players who only have one or two stars with gold plat and diamond portrait players who have 300+ more sr than them. balance of rank and portrait levels between teams is very lopsided. getting worse each season

[Polimorphism-1606]

Do you know what the word quantify means?

[zoopy-11314]

TFW that actually happened though…

As a support main I’d know.

[ccarlo-1692]

I don’t know how to tell you that significantly wider gap disparities in teammates’ level and sr (not including mmr unfortunately) are, in fact, numbers that are quantifiable and comparable to previous seasons

i could screenshot the 12 players in every game i play on multiple accounts for multiple months at a time, and then send the screenshots to you personally for you to compare and graph. if you would like

[Polimorphism-1606]

You can’t just admit that you can’t quantify it, can you? You can’t admit you don’t have a reasonable basis for your belief.

[jrg7777-1411]

this would be possible thru Role Caps , which would restrict the maximum number of heroes for any one role to be capped at 3, but also require that all roles be selected. so a 3-3 goats comp would not be possible. the only possible combination of roles would 222 or variations or 321. Not only would this system have not taken 2 years to develop like role q did, but it requires significantly less work to implement and would utilize a single sr system once again, thus making balanced matchmaking and q times light years easier to accomplish than whatever it is role q is devolving into.

SR was never a great way to make ‘balanced’ matches, especially when you’re able to pick any hero you want. Granted, it’s still not the best, but splitting the SR between roles is absolutely much more balanced than the old system OR what you’re implying!

[ccarlo-1692]

SR was never a great way to make ‘balanced’ matches, especially when you’re able to pick any hero you want. Granted, it’s still not the best, but splitting the SR between roles is absolutely much more balanced than the old system OR what you’re implying!

I strongly disagree. especially with the stale metas we have been stuck with the past 4 seasons of role Q. some people are a 3800sr orisa main who climbed due to meta and their skill with the hero, and can play road hog at a 3500ish sr level. but their skill with other tanks is closer to a 2800 sr level. role sr can be just as good/bad at representing someone’s skill with heroes at a rank than the pre-role q system was. but it sounds like you know this too. I’m aware players who can flex many heroes of the same role at the same level exist also.

but please understand, my problem is the game placing players like myself in games 300+ sr below what my sr is, most of the time! a 3400 sr tank plays the game significantly differently than players at 2800 sr so why are multiple of these plat players on my team? why are both my dps new bronze portrait plats when the other team’s dps are silver and diamond portrait mid diamond rank players? why does the game even place new players at plat and diamond ranks only for them to fall to their appropriate starting rank thru losses? this is the unacceptable matchmaking i am talking about

[Maxy-6374]

So whoever has the fastest load time gets their preferred role? I’m sure that’ll be well received

[ccarlo-1692]

can very easily be solved by locking all 12 players from picking a hero until about 6-7 seconds after the “arriving at [map]” screen