Yeah it does.
How in the world do you think “Not enough Tanks” has nothing to do with Tanks?
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You know that means 2-2-2 anyway.
Everyone will just pick that as a tank / support.
They should have an Overwatch sponsored headache relieving medication. Of course tanks have a significant effect, but DPS are often a pronounced peak.
If they were smart, they would run 3-3.
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Anti GOATS/3-2-1 with a Mei as the one required DPS measures are discussed in the other thread.
So true, but neither would help dps queue times :)!
Okay fine.
The real issue there then begins to be, either changing what SR means on a per role basis.
For instance, there is no reason a 2500SR DPS Is equal to a 2500SR Tank.
So they can that shuffle the population around in each role, such that the bell curves match up better.
Likely a mix of giving more SR to tanks, and less SR to DPS.
Alternatively they could completely ignore SR, and only match based on MMR.
Heck even when it was all the rage it wasn’t just 222…the point is the devs need to stop guessing
Do they want 222…132…qp or qpc…hero pools or not…Do people want to play map X or not…
Just stop…put it in the community’s hand and be done with it…They’ll never get it “right”
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But the dps be yelling about qtimes
If they requested 222 then GOOD…karma for not thinking things through…
If they didn’t…I sympathize BUT Matchmaking takes time be it with automation or not (lfg)…if you want structure time is required…at least with latter you have the choice to do so or not and don’t have it forced on you
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…Am I the only one unable to follow this conversation?
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What surprises me is how thoroughly disinterested supposed tank and support players are in having intentionally powerful shield tanks and healers to open up room for the DPS plurality or even majority of players, even with a three DPS cap in place and thus a guaranteed second tank or support! It shows how narrow-minded and selfish members of this community are, and how they need to be led by the nose. Despite the obvious conflicting interests on this topic no one takes a bigger, potentially reconciliatory perspective. Most of what you see are a bunch of snot-nosed posters spiting one another and the roles they don’t play.
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There is one possible fix within here I think is worth exploring and that’s the ability to personalise your SR spread, sort of like you can with LFG.
There are obvious costs to having a wider SR spread and players will likely be annoyed if the Devs widen it so much players frequently get poor match ups. We even to an extent have this where tanks (and to a lesser extent healers) always seem too be the highest or lowest SR member of the team. It’s not too bad but I don’t want to see it get any worse.
However if the Devs give you an ability to set your own SR spread, even if it’s just low-medium-high, then they can escape the backlash as it becomes entirely optional. If your happy with the long queue times it it means fair games then keep it as is or even lower. If you think screw it I want faster queues no matter what then set yourself a wide spread.
By making it our choice then it’s up to us to prioritise how we want to proceed and much harder to blame them (though people no doubt still would) as they didn’t impose the change, we did it to ourselves.
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That was not mentioned as a fix but as something the developers are likely to do in order to improve queue times at a cost. It’s also called small-think.
Troll Queue strikes again.
Bingo!
Because we know the answer is, have 4 dps take on one person then the other.
We also know how bad solo tank / support is.
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I think it is the easiest of all fixes though, at least “major” fixes. There is a bunch of minor stuff that might nibble around the edges, like the option to swap roles within the team between rounds could be nice.
The issues with the big suggestion you posed is if you make some support and tank heroes built to solo then they will inherently have major balance issues and be OP. Lets say the next hero is RoadOrisa and literally combines those heroes, so hook pulls people towards it, Fortify self heals and so on. Now this hero would likely be able to solo tank but also be a horror to fight and be stupid OP. Even if it wasn’t what about if you play them with a Sigma. I struggle to see how any hero built for solo use isn’t OP when played as a duo, its that simple.
The only ways to “fix” that are a unbalanced role q (i.e. 1-3-2) so they can only solo, a set group of solo heroes only available when someone is alone in their role or heroes to have 2 different builds, the solo build and duo build an they change depending on what situation your in. These imo all suck as “fixes”.
This may be a long shot but my hope is OW2 is 2-3-2, it may be unconfirmed an unlikely but its not too unreasonable for OW2 to go that way, like its a massive overhaul anyway so why not go to 7v7 as part of that, it could happen. In the mean time we get minor and frankly insubstantial fixes to tide us over.
There is a maximum of three per role, thus at maximum one role will be soloed. The whole point of the idea is for solo tank or support not to be that bad.
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I just don’t think people believe it will happen, and NO ONE wants the constant threads on “why are the tanks so OP”
For the Tanks / Supports, what is currently here, is pretty good. They have 0 faith that solo tank / support would be better - because 1, they have seen solo tank play before, and 2 they know what blizzard balancing will be like.
And 3, they know what in game “you picked the wrong tank, REPORTED!” will be like.
There is no way this ends well, so, like the DPS where when 2-2-2 was announced, the tanks / supports want none of it.
It will suck pretty hard, in a lot of ways, why would you sign up for that?
Hell, I don’t even Tank/Support these days, and I wouldn’t touch it.
Why not ask the people who used to tank/support but left, why they did so? You could get me back tanking / supporting so easily, but there just isn’t any heroes there which I would want to play.
All the ones I did were changed or mostly unplayable.
Mercy was the most played support in the game, bar none, and a LOT of them were also D’va players. Blizzard practically engineered their lack of tank / support base.
Overwatch was unique, in that you had this pvp style game, AND a support / tank which could focus on their own team, largely avoiding the enemy team as far as direct combat.
The heroes were reworked so that isn’t the case now, and you lost the players who were here for that.
To then go, oh man, we need to change the game in favor of the DPS, which is how they lost the tanks / supports in the first place, is a hell of a slap to the face.
Calling loosening SR spreads a “major” fix and shifting onto even more “minor stuff nibbling around the edges like swapping roles”, which is completely incompatible with role queue matchmaking, is the definition of small-think.
They may be OP, particularly in tanking, healing, and survivability, but they become part of the larger balance. The thread linked to in the opening post goes into specifics. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with heroes effectively performing important but minority tank and healing roles that are more difficult to kill. There is an assumption that all heroes need to be viewed equivalently that needs to be shed, not to mention this equivalency is really only understood within the established standard and hardly with great depth, i.e. it’s rather arbitrary. Counter-intuitive as this may be it has potential. Herein lies the greater fun and impact people have been asking for in roles that are deemed to lack them. 2-3-2 has been virtually dismissed by the game director.
Suspend the small-think, no matter how used you’re to it.
What is currently here is good for them, not for queue times and the largest group of the player population. Blizzard isn’t balancing things in this discussion, I am.
I don’t understand why people keep resorting to petty concerns like these.
…Did you visit the other thread at all?