DPS can't function if Tanks want their jobs

General Discussion
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At the end of the day, games of Overwatch are won by killing enemies or making them run from death, and if enemies aren’t dying or afraid to die, then your DPS teammates probably need to step it up.

Step up to where? How about a position where they actually have the firing angle to do their job without dying themselves. Who creates these positions? Tanks, at least in theory. Except so many Tank players approach their role like bigger, badder, glorified DPS.

In low elos, everybody’s mechanics suck and you should just have three DPS. In Platinum and beyond, Tanks tend to be the throwers. Players at that level are skilled enough to consistently punish mistakes like overextending, team separation, lack of peel, uncontested high ground, and all other manners of noobishness. Positioning is the common thread of these mistakes, and it is the central skill of Tank play, but Tank players were not punished enough to improve at lower elos - now these are game-losing mistakes, and they still will not learn.

Reinhardt positions in sight of the whole enemy team, gets hit with Shield Bash, dies. He charges in, gets a pin, dies. I don’t care if you pinned somebody, Reinhardt. Trading the main tank is not a trade at all.

Orisa wastes Halt for some trash damage, gets dived, dies. Won’t give ground to enemy brawlers, dies.

D.Va dives a DPS she can’t 1v1, dies. Worse, she barely wins the duel as baby D.Va, and now we’re down a Tank for the next engage. Just die next time.

Zarya goes in with bubble, gets 40 charge. Inexplicably decides that the dead center of a teamfight is the place to wait for her next bubble. Dies.

Winston uses bubble to shield trash damage instead of taking cover, dives without it, dies. Ults when his whole team is dead, feeds 1000 extra health worth of ult charge and dies anyway.

Wrecking Ball just dies, and dies. Have only seen about five of them that I wouldn’t trade for a Winston.

Roadhog is not a Tank, unless you count the way he tanks your ult economy by feeding charge to the enemy DPS so he can charge his own useless ultimate.

Don’t look at the Supports either. My job is not to heal you through these mistakes. Your job is to not make them in the first place so that I am safe and can provide utility beyond just raw sustain. I know you needed healing in the middle of five enemy Heroes. I’m busy trying to peel myself from the sixth one.

Successful Tank play is 20% carrying and 80% not screwing up. Be steady, don’t take risks, give your DPS space to work and don’t waste your Supports’ time with constant sustain. The better positioning you enable for your team, the more likely you’ll win fights without doing a single aggressive thing. Play your own role and let teamwork make the dream work.

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Playing poorly does not mean that person is throwing.

Throwing to me is like intentionally feeding endlessly, lobbing your body off a cliff, or just waving at the enemy over and over again.

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DPS CAN’T FUNCTION IF TANKS ARE THROWING

Fixed the title, your not carrying if you need healing or tanks.

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Good, how about you group up with me then? Or better yet, make use if the space I create?

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As a Reinhardt-main (oh you know this already, Golden :wink: ) nothing is more annoying than my whole team following me into a fight, then 5 seconds later they’re all gone and left me and our Moira alone together. Where did everyone go!?

Like, do I seriously need to keep checking behind me every 10 seconds?

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That’s playing tanks in Overwatch for you.

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First… there is no DPS that D.Va can’t dive.

Second… You missed the clause at the end of the sentence which reads, ‘while her team stands and watches, doing nothing much’, which is usually the case.

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Insert Reaper shrug meme here

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Fun fact: since this is a team game, no role can carry if one role is failing. It’s not unique to a single role.

I agree with the concept of the post-- just not the execution.

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Not really sure what the main thrust of this post is. It seems like OP is just pointing out ways in which tank players can play poorly.

The thing is, the entire game is based around synergy and teamwork. DPS can’t work without tanks/supports, tanks can’t work without DPS/supports, and supports can’t work without tanks/DPS.

A lot of the examples cited in OP’s post paint tanks as blood-crazed, high HP DPS-in-disguise, and while some might play this way, you seem to be completely discounting the validity of tanks playing aggressively.

To create space is to position in a way that says, “this part of the map is MINE and you’ll have to get through ME if you want to take it”. If a tank pushes too far and bites off more than they can chew, they’ll be punished for it and their team won’t be able to respond in time to save them, but when done well it opens up as much of the map as possible for the rest of their team to work.

This is why tanking is much harder than a lot of people seem to think. Knowing how far you can push, where to position, when to retreat, and so on are all crucial to tanking well and doing the most you can for your team. Sometimes the difference between an amazing tank that’s creating a lot of space and a dead tank that’s constantly being picked is just a few meters. It takes time and experience to learn that, so of course you’ll have people at lower ranks struggling with these decisions.

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So you think dps carry their games? This is a team game. You can say, dps can’t do their job well if their tanks aren’t doing well. But you can say that for every class. The only time a class carries is because they’re litterally better than everyone on the enemy team (ie a platinum vs a team of bronze for example).

Welcome to the team. If someone isn’t doing well, try to figure out why and no it’s not throwing if they’re just struggling and trying their best.

Don’t like your tank? YOU TANK.

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A lot of people seem to be fixating on the word choice of “carrying” and “throwing,” and fair enough, I should’ve avoided such charged terms in the first place, but I meant them more strategically.

To “carry” as a DPS is to output a lot of crucial damage and picks that lets your team snowball a teamfight, or stagger the enemy team. It’s not meant to imply that Tanks and Supports somehow come together to just enable DPS to win the game for them; those contributions themselves can be game winning, or as I said, game losing.

On the other hand, to “throw” as a Tank is to not create any space or opportunities for your DPS to make these plays because you’re basically trying to do their job instead of your own, leaving the more synergetic enemy team with an advantage.

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roadhog just got roasted lmao

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It was said before and I’ll note it again.

Playing badly is not throwing.

About half the times I play tank; when I die I’m finding no one advanced behind me. I died because dps went three ways and support followed them. You can’t make a hole if they don’t work as a team. It’s not always your tank at fault. Sometimes they get agreesive and feed but I’m betting most times they either advance without knowing the teams not with them or they’re not used to tank and they tried to play the role no one else would fill.

I mostly play support and I see a lot of common mistakes both dps and tank from that perspective. I make my own mistakes too. I’m not perfect.

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As a tank player, the title was the only part I agreed with.

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I lost count of how many Groans I hear over Mic when I switch off Orisa. “Oh Great, we lost our MT”

I’d gladly stay but I ain’t doing squat if It’s just me and Moira doing sheet damage in our little bunker that we can’t move up from because all our dps are trying to be flanking gods.

Might as well try to overwhelm with pure brute force and go dps.

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One of my favorite things is when a tank complains that the DPS aren’t doing their jobs (“i have gold elims, our dps is garbage”)… while the enemy team is fighting from behind a shield, and the tank who’s complaining is playing like a DPS instead of doing their job and making space for the actual DPS heroes.

Also, OP, I know you’ve already edited your title, but you should go over your post, too, because you don’t seem to understand what “throw” and “carry” actually mean.

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Roadhog is a Tank in the way that he is a BODYGUARD and his kit enables him to forcibly peel hardcore to protect supports/mvps

It’s just few people have considered this as “optimal” play for hog because everyone was busy going on dank flanks for 6 seasons…
If you’re not keeping an eye on your favorite teammate as Hog, you’re playing him dead wrong and will charge the enemy like the “ult battery” you are, no matter how many crispy hooks or grav hogs you achieve.

My homie just said what? Must be a lucky fight. Tanks need to be aggressive sometimes just not wantonly so. A completely passive tank is a losing tank against relentless aggression from the enemy team. C’mon, you’re in Plat on the same platform as me. You know what I’m talking about. I will agree that bad tanks are horrible but honestly when you’re using Orisa in high silver and the majority of gold using Halt! for trash damage literally wins games because your team is too mechanically unskilled to secure their own kills. I swear, if you group up with a bunch of silvers and low golds and play Orisa for them you will need to do a lot of the dirty work. I’ve had to do it before and it sucks because I’ve had to re-learn how to use my sucker and ask my team for followup yet I still find myself using my Halt! to secure a 1v1 or just to displace pharah for a moment without checking my team.

Or rezing a D.Va INTO a genji blade so she can die again.

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DPS need to learn to group up with the tank instead of invoking a mystic quest to visit the four corners of the map for some “sick kills.”

Pro tip: games in OW arnt won by killing. Unless it’s in deathmatch. They’re won by capturing points or staying on a payload. Guess what enables DPS to stay on Payload longer? Shields and healing. Tanks and healers. Because they’re protecting DPS from dying quickly from incoming damage.

Christ, I played one game as Rein, and here I am with my shield up, moving towards the objective while the enemy team opens fire at us. No problem I though. There’s 3 DPS with me. One to each of my sides, and one… oh in front of me. He’s dead. Oh, the one to my left peeked around my shield (???) he’s dead. And the Genji to my right ran to presumably go flank - or 1v6 the team by himself.

And that’s how tanking is.

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I understand OP’s point about Roadhog being the sort of hero who can very easily turn into an ult battery and nothing more, but you’re totally right about this.

As a Zen main, I’m always appreciative of getting peels, yet of the thousands of games I’ve played, only once did a Roadhog on my team say over comms, “I’m just gonna stick with Zen and peel for him”. I almost wanted to cry it was so beautiful. My team had been struggling with flankers, and that Hog made the difference and pushed us to victory. It is absolutely a big part of Hog’s strength.

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