If the consensus is that matchmaker doesn’t match MMR by role and then creates an uneven match…
Is that the MM failing or lack of balance on each roles impact to game?
A lack of balance of impact. Realistically if all roles were even then it wouldn’t matter what area your team was stronger or weaker in compared to the other team. Much like a football or basketball team having a strong offense or a strong defense.
This lack of role balance is the largest issue with comp ATM.
it hurts one’s ability to grow as a player since the game to game experience varies so drastically.
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I feel like it would make queue times worse.
This is a great point but the problem is it is much easier to change MM algorithm then to rebalance each role to have equal impact.
What do you mean by that? Rebalance roles how?
Balance so that a Good tank Bad support is = Bad tank Good support instead of one having an advantage .
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the opposite. you can have 4 silver tanks, 4 plat dps, and 4 gold supports all in the same game.
Yeah you can, but we were talking about something else. I would still prefer to have silver tank vs silver tank than silver tank vs high gold tank.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/overwatch/t/how-competitive-matchmaking-and-rating-works-season-24/550570/21?u=ryom-1460
The matchmaker needs retooled for role queue. It clearly matches by average TEAM MMR, and it needs to match by average ROLE MMR. A team-wide average was sufficient for open queue games where switches could happen, but is completely inadequate for a role-locked match. Platinum tanks fighting Silver tanks will never be a fair fight, etc. If your team has a DPS SR average of 2500, the opposing team should have DPS with an average of 2500 SR. This doesn’t happen and is trivial to verify.
Doing this adjustment for the matchmaker could actually DECREASE queue times as well by opening up the total SR spread for a team while keeping it intact for each role. So for example you could (in theory, and if necessary for the matchmaker to create a game) have Diamond DPS, Silver Supports, and Gold Tanks in one match… but the opposing team would have EXACTLY the same spread.
This gives the matchmaker more latitude to pull in players, without disadvantaging one side or the other with imbalanced roles.
It has some benefits and drawbacks…
One benefit is that lower ranked players get to see how higher rank players work, which should bring match quality up over time as lower ranks are exposed to better gameplay and strategies.
A drawback may be that the match could be frustrating for a higher rank role to get paired with a much lower one (diamond tanks getting silver supports)… BUT the opposing team would be working under the EXACT same condition… so ultimately the match is fair.
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Statistical analysis is a lot easier if they handle it within ranks. Otherwise you would have to calculate it for each SR separately or within SR ranges like 2200-2300 which leads to assumption that ranks what we have are used
I know, but it would make queue times longer. It would be nice to have but I dont want to wait for game longer.
Roughly this is the way it should work and also in case of teams it should match within roles as well.
I would like to wait for a fair game longer. “Fairish” has been implemented and they could really do a lot better.
You would, others not so much. Queue times for dps are already brutal.
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I do not understand what is the fun of getting ROFLstomped by 1 rank higher DPSses who team up with friend(s). If people just want faster losses then I guess it is the way it has to be :).
We have algorithms that promise asymptotic fairness. Basic naive sampling will get that job done. It’s so natural you can’t even patent it. And most people are taught how to keep/test things “fair” in gradeschool.
Tossing people into matches at random ensures fairness. But it rubs people the wrong way with streaks and randomly 1-sided matches and the like. But when you tell them the last 4+ years of live matches are ‘rigged’ in the sense of forced-knapsacking and cherry-picked teams to make matches “close”- they are instantly put off and disgusted by the idea. And your ladder becomes a meme despite schilled content attempts.
This is why the best compromise is naive sampling from 4-5 skill tiers (pools). People are binned by APM/aim calibration matches, and SR +/- that is hidden to the matchmaker. Matches then have an ‘average difficulty’ for that skill tier until you win/lose enough. It’s been hashed out in detail before, but they refuse to go that direction because it blackbox rigging keeps engagement up.
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So? If you are rofl stomped by enemy dps who is rank higher, your tank is probably rofl stomping enemy tank who is 1 rank lower so you can call it even 
I agree if this happening, but the 3300 Widow is owning and my diamond tank can’t kill as fast as the widow. H*ll they or me are still walking to reach the enemy while Ashe and Mercy already down in our team => thus match within roles to create more fair game.
This has to get fixed asap. Matches today have been HORRIBLE. one sided steamroll one after the other. i don’t like being on either side of these.