Do not touch Ashe!

General Discussion
1

Blizard Developers, you are completely biased towards this hero and you contradict yourself.

You make explaination each patch about why you took this or that power away
For instance APRIL 6, when you overtune Ashe made these buffs

  • Magazine size increased from 12 to 15 (1)
  • Shots no longer queue up the next shot if pressed slightly before recovery has finished
  • Unscoped shots to reach maximum spread increased from 4 to 6 (2)
  • Unscoped shots can now be fired much more quickly after firing a scoped shot (3)
  • You can now start reloading much more quickly after firing a scoped shot

Then you start doing this
JUNE 30

Dynamite

  • Cooldown increased from 10 to 12 seconds
    With recent improvements to Ashe’s weapon her overall damage output has increased significantly. Toning Dynamite down will lower her overall damage while keeping her damage output focused on her rifle.

Okay you took away the power from dynamite cause you give us 3 bullets (1) faster unscope animation (2) and better hipfire spread(3).
That was the 1st one.

Next patch AUGUST 31

  • Max ammo reduced from 15 to 12
  • Aim-down sights damage reduced from 85 to 80

That is the second one and third one nerf
That is minus 2 gun powers, and faster scope/unscope animation buff we left right? But now you don’t explain why you took away power, you just took it.
You took back 3 bullets (1) and we left spread buff(2) and faster unscope animation buff (3)

SEPTEMBER 24, 2020 you’ve said

Ashe is still a bit too powerful, but we’d like to keep her rifle feeling impactful so we’re taking some power out of her Dynamite ability.

  • Explosion damage reduced from 75 to 50

That was 4th nerf
No more words about switching powers from dynamite to gun or anything else, we just took away, no ult charge increase due 30% overall damage nerf, no no, we just took, we have no reasons but this
Ashe is still a bit too powerful
A bit was left. And you say you want to keep her gun POWERFULL right?
here we go :

Ashe being able to eliminate 200 health enemy heroes with one headshot while assisted by 30% damage boost became too dominant, especially when combined with the other improvements to her weapon. We are lowering the maximum damage but also the shot recovery time to keep her overall damage output relatively the same.

  • Aim-down-sights damage reduced from 80 to 75
  • Aim-down-sights recovery time reduced from 0.7 to 0.65 seconds

That was 5th nerf

Wow! Imagine! Two heroes was able to work together to decrease TTK to make its job done! Now, what is the point of this game? You can’t do your job solo, cause 0.65 ROF is very slight increase and you still have to do 3 or sometimes 4 shots to deal with 200 hp targets depends on range.
Now you can not kill mcCree at 31m, cause headshot + bodyshot is 225 then it starts fall off damage, so mcree survives with 2hp left. You can not do even one-shot combos via headshot+melee or hs+hipfire cause it will do 180 and 190 damage accordingly. And as soon range becomes more that 30m, you can not hs+bs either.

So, how is 75 damage gun is powerfull compared to her PTR release state when it’s done 85 damage per shot?
75/85 = 12% raw damage decrease
0.65/0.7= 7% RoF increase
150/175 = 14.3% damage decrease
10/12 =16.6% cooldown decrease which converts to damage from TnT

For 2 slight buffs left, which is spread buff (no damage changed) and faster unscope animation (no damage buff) you give Ashe 5 direct damage nerfs.
Overall, you’ve took away 42.9 % of raw damage output, increased RoF for 7%
how is that fair?
To make it fair, you decrease ult cost for 30%
To make it fair, you give additional +7% RoF increase for previous 5 damage nerf, so now Ashe shoots once per 0.6 second instead of 0.65 or 0.7, you give her mcCree’s damage, give her closer firerate tho, no half measures!
Also as now ammo consumption would be crucial and damage would be lower, you need to bring back 3 additional bullets to ammo capacity.
That is the ballance. Not how you do it, contradicting own points.

24 Likes
2

what is this actual hero bullying? First was cree, then widow, now Ashe? Damage role in GM is already the least impactfull. And you’ve done slap of the wrist nerf to actual problem BALL? You want us play soldier76 and got reported for not being able to do any dps job, cause other heroes are gutted so hard so you dont kill, you just do trash damage which would be converted into enemy support ult charge, and yall know what it does right?

6 Likes
3

Ashe was the most ballanced hero released. Then all of a sudden all of this unreasonable buffs come, which leads towards these nerfs, it feels like some conspiracy : “We overtune hero, to nerf it to oblivion after w/o any actual reasoning”

19 Likes
4

Tested it out in Ex.Card. I don’t feel any difference in RoF buff, it must be increased more, or Ashe is not worth to play anymore. Every target just runs away from LoS with low hp left, then I hear nano boosts, valkyries, baptiste angry french IMAX placed etc etc…

2 Likes
5

I really hope they don’t buff the fire rate. It’s the kind of change that can make a character oppressive with other buffs. Also, people are gonna complain about her feeling slow when it’s eventually reverted.

6

I honestly don’t mind the dynamite being weaker than it was, back when I started playing Ashe, I will admit, I cheese with dynamite a lot more and it is unhealthy for me who’s learning this hero. But her gun back then was really terrible and it was against her a lot of the time, now the gun is actually performing what it was intended, bar the 15 rounds (Personally i never liked that change, it eliminated her urgency to manage her resources entirely so I am happy to see it gone) the 85 to 80 is okayy i guess? I don’t really play with Mercy pocket a lot I feel fine, infact because of the good viper, I can actually have a chance to duel with Widow which is satisfying (before she got falloff and health decrease, of course)

but now the gun nerfed to 75 is just… iffy, it’s basically Mccree but slower, and Mccree currently can do everything the experimental nerfed Ashe can do plus several advantages like health increase and reliable cc… Which is just distasteful honestly. I too don’t like being pocketed so I don’t understand why Ashe gets nerfed because she was pocketed, as if Mccree with Pocket mercy or 76 with pocket mercy isn’t a trouble (They are, because Mccree has faster firerate and now thiccer to tank damage, and 76 is just very reliable rn, if you miss one or two shots against 76 as ashe 76 will just eat you quickly)

6 Likes
7

Nerfing and buffing heroes is never about “fairness.” Ashe isn’t “owed” a buff every time she gets nerfed; no hero is. These changes happen because the heroes require the changes. It’s not like Ashe or any hero released in some perfect state and so now every nerf needs a complimentary buff and vice-versa. Ashe got nerfed in this experimental because she’s proving too powerful – that’s it. And so they struck her directly where she was too powerful – her raw damage her shot.

There’s no contradiction here. They nerfed and buffed Ashe before based on how she was performing then. And they’re changing her now based on what’s currently happening with the hero. Months ago Blizzard may have tried “keeping Ashe’s gun powerful,” but that doesn’t make them sign a blood contract that swears them to an oath of keeping Ashe’s gun a certain power level.

I don’t know what else to say, there’s no unfair treatment here. Ashe was a dominant hero and her ability to one-shot with a damage boost was problematic for her health in the game. That’s all there is to it. Blizzard doesn’t owe Ashe any specific buffs, regardless of whatever they might have said about her basically a year ago. Blizzard identified a problem with Ashe, they’re addressing it with their fix: if she needs buffs after this, we’ll see for sure through how the experimental performs.

Ashe saw almost no playtime when she was first released, and certainly not at the top level of play. Her getting buffed at the time made sense for a hero that was underperforming right at release. Calling her the “most balanced hero released” is plainly wrong considering no one was playing her.

6 Likes
8

43 % of raw damage output NERF. What are you even talking about? It is even more than mercy amplifies!

That is definition of ballanced heroes in ow, nobody was able to get value, cause there was broken hanzo and widow, why would you even try Ashe in the middle?

1 Like
9

I’m talking about everything I just wrote out in that post. It doesn’t matter if “43% of raw damage output NERF”, she’s getting nerfed today because she has problems with her balance today. It does not matter how many nerfs she’s received in the past.

You have to realize that this isn’t how these numbers relate to one another, nor does that make any sort of argument against what I’m saying.

That is literally considered to be an imbalanced state lol. She was too weak at release and so she got buffed. Lots of things in the game have changed since then, so it’s time to weaken her. There’s nothing about “fairness” to do with any of these changes, these changes happen as appropriate responses to how Ashe is fairing in the overall game. Back then, she was bad; now she’s too good. Stuff like this happens in a game that gets updated like this.

3 Likes
10

That’s enough of an argument to realise something is wrong with dev’s team already.

4 Likes
11

Yep, this is why many hope that their hero never gets buffed because the incoming nerfs leave them weaker than before.

2 Likes
12

LMAO

I tried the new ashe change and I actually kinda liked the new change but idk

13

Its sad to see ashe getting nerfed over and over and over and over. The devs should just nerf mercy damage boost instead of butchering her every time

3 Likes
14

It’s easier to contain Ashe rioters than Mercy rioters. They have to choose the lesser evil here.

15

You are not really good in math, are you?
Dynamite is just a part of her kit, if you Nerf dynamite damage you dont nerf the damage from Ash, you nerf the damage of a part of Ash.

Example: If have a Village with 5 houses and you decrease the size of 1 house by 10%, you dont decrease the size if the whole Village by 10%

How to make a better comparison:

Ashs Dps of her gun before the nerfs:
121.43

After the Nerfs:
115.38

So: Her raw Dps of her Weapon got only reduced by 4.98%

You also forget something very important: Increasing Ashs rate of fire also increases her time to kill. As Ash you still need only 2 headshots and 3 bodyshots to kill someone, that means to kill a Squishy she needed before the Nerf 1.4 seconds, but now she needs only 1.3 seconds

So lets compare what happened to Viper:
. - 4.98% less dps
. - 10 damage per shot
. - No one shot with Mercy

. + Weapon is less clunky
. + 7.14% lower time to kill without Mercy
. + 7.69% higher firerate

Other changes:
Dynamite +2s CD
Dynimite damage reduced by 25

The changes to Ash without a Mercy pocket are in the opinion of the pros more of a buff then a nerf for her. The only thing wich changed is the synergie between Mercy and Ash

I also dont like how you manioulate your data toward your point, example:

I have a question:
Why are you not showing the decimal places of your first points, but then do show the decimal places of the last 2 numbers? Why are you so inconsistent with them?

If you look at the numbers you see why:

“75/85 = 12% raw damage decrease”

The actual number is 11.78,
but you round that number to 12%

“7% RoF increase”

The actual number is 7.69%, why do you round this number down to 7% instead of 8%?

“150/175 = 14.3% damage decrease
10/12 =16.6% cooldown decrease which”
In these 2 cases you do show the decimal places

Conclusion: You only show the decimal places of the numbers wich support your point, but hide ir manioulate the numbers wich dont support your point.

This shows us that you are not interested to have an actual debate, you only want to flame the patches and manipulate the facts slightly in hope nobody notices

1 Like
16

This is a terrible take because her ttk is 0 if she has the old damage and hits a headshot so the ttk is much slower

17

His suggestion was to nerf Damage boost instead of nerfing Ash, if you nerf damage boost her ttk is not 0 too

If my whole take was trash pls explain why, this was just 1 single fact from me

EDIT: I am sorry, I have mistaken him for someone else, he didnt suggested nerfing damage boost, I will add this point to the post above. Beside that, pls exaplain why my whole post is trash

18

You are trying to right off the new changes as a buff because she can kill targets with a double headshot or 3 body shots much quicker. The flaw here is that with a mercy damage boost you can kill them instantly and so this is a massive ttk nerf and you are writing it off as a ttk buff…?

1 Like
19

I will correct this, with “Pros think its more of a buff” I ment the changes wich are currently on the life server

(Reduced Viper damage and Dynamate nerfs for a less clunky weapon)

thx

I didnt wanted to say that all the Ash changes invluding the current one are a buff, I only disagreed with him saying it is a huge nerf for her and exoecialöy disgreed with his numbers

20

My fault I just don’t want my character to become unplayable and this will make her unplayable alot of people argue its a buff to her if she doesn’t have a mercy and the problem is that in the higher ranks ashe is only playable if you have a mercy