Man this post is long o feel like I’m reading a essay paper.
Detailed writing on why Role queue will single-handedly eliminate a sizeable chunk of the playerbase
They do play better that’s true. They know how to play the game, but that’s not what I mean. What I mean is whatever system they want for the game both the players and OWL pros have to use the same system. If there’s role queue then the pros play 222 if there’s ever a pick/ban system both sides of the community will get it.
There was already a hero limit implemented way back when and they both use it. The devs do not want the two sides to be play different games. Different patches? It happens because of time constraints, but never for long. But two different systems? Never going to happen.
Does anyone have cliffs of this nonsense?
But come on dude…the author used paragraphs AND bullet points.
Clearly he is in the know!
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I don’t come to the forums to read papers. I will have plenty of that in the future.
Detailed reson why role q is not bad:
I can play the role i want in a decent team.
Who said your team would be decent?
They could be playing their off role or just be bad at their job.
Balance is not dictated by 222
If my team feels the need to run 2 tanks, 3 dps, and 1 healer, id be moira since she would be the only one capable enough of covering the difference between 2 supports in terms of healing
Quad dps? Run mercy, she’s more mobile. Get a mobile tank as well.
5 and 6 dps comps can work all the same. You just need certain dps to cover the difference of other roles like mei for tanking, sombra for support.
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Would it change your opinion if he included pie charts?
Well idc if it could maybe work eventually if you drank a cup of tee before you qued at 6:43 am.
So far all games i played have been 100 times better than the mess i played before 2 2 2.
Even the ones that i lost.
So i will still claim it creates a half-decent team.
Half a decent team by only creating peace of mind.
Fair enough i suppose
might just be that. But in the end i dont care how my games get better if they just get better.
Lemme just tl;dr this for anyone scrolling past - I’m responding in detail to a handful of OP’s points, which meant this reply got pretty long. Sorry about that, and please do scroll on by if that doesn’t interest you.
Let me preface this by making it clear: I am on record as having argued against forced role queue when it was still just community speculation, and if you scroll far enough back through my forum history, you can find it (not recommended, though; I have written way too much on these forums). I was disappointed when I heard that role lock was officially being implemented.
That said, I still have substantial disagreements with a number of things you said here.
You are of course absolutely free to disagree with the decisions the devs made, but statements like this are in such incredible bad faith.
There is no way that Blizzard was unaware of how many people would kick and scream over role queue. There is no way that they didn’t consider the existence of flex players and goofy comps and how role queue would upend both of those play styles. Jeff explicitly said when role queue was first being announced that one of their big concerns was the queue times for DPS players.
It’s not that Blizzard didn’t consider the ramifications of their decision. They considered it, and knew there were benefits and costs to either implementing it or not, and they decided that 2-2-2 was better for the game.
There is a legit discussion to be had about whether or not this was the correct decision, but there is no way they just “didn’t weigh” it.
Because he’s not going to write an entire thesis to defend a decision that has already been made to a forum full of gamers who are just going to shout at him no matter what he says. This is also far from the only communication he has ever given in any context about the change.
Undoubtedly there is. Blizzard is a big AAA studio which means that there are all kinds of people weighing in on every big decision. This is not some tiny company with a singular lead dev who holds all the keys to everything whose word is therefore law. I can particularly remember a time where he commented on MH, saying that he was in favor of removing stacking from the mode, but people kept pushing back on that, and what do you know, MH has not had stacking removed.
This is a really huge generalization with no reasons given for it. Bringing heroes into rough balance with each other, i.e., making sure Mercy is no longer a runaway must-pick, could be argued to be homogenization, but I think everyone agrees that was ultimately good for the game.
No, because e-v-e-r-y-b-o-d-y has access to three roles on their one account. Those aren’t burner accounts meant to ruin games and then get banned. If they work correctly, those are things that a) allow people to play the role they actually want without being accused of wrecking their team’s comp; and b) allow people to play at higher tiers on the roles they are good at (i.e., they are fairly competing at that tier), while playing at lower tiers on the roles they struggle at (i.e., they are fairly competing at that tier).
[citation needed]
And boosting is already explicitly forbidden by the ToS and you can be banned if you get caught doing it.
As it shouldn’t.
Look, I have mostly played Mystery Heroes for the past I don’t even know how long, because I like getting to play a bunch of different heroes (including/especially DPS without getting yelled at), and I like not being tied down to a meta—which at my tier, looks like people who have simply internalized the notion that [X hero] is a throw pick, without understanding the game at all (like you said in one of your opening points). My preferred playstyle is varied and low-salt. The only way to get that experience was to play MH in the arcade, so to the arcade I went.
If the game is balanced around 2-2-2, people who continue playing free-form are going to run into hinky balance issues, just like happens in FFA, or No Limits, or Total Mayhem. Healers or tanks especially who are not OP in groups of 2 may be deeply OP in groups of 3 (i.e. GOATS). If comp is pivoting towards 2-2-2, that will of course take priority in balance (and I say this as a casual player), and not adding those restrictions to QP could lead to incredibly broken QP metas.
Deeply competitive people already had multiple accounts for learning new heroes and roles. Casual people (it me!) will not kill themselves to max out all three. OTPs aren’t playing other roles anyway. Flex/fill players, people who wanted to play more than one role anyway, either had to get a dedicated account to do it on, or resign themselves to only playing tanks and supports since the DPS slots always filled.
And this definitely does suck, and it has sucked the entire time that SR has been a thing. I have friends I love to play with but we can’t play anything other than QP/Arcade because our SR is too far apart, mainly due to me only having completed placements, like, three times.
There are people who are amazing tanks and dreadful supports. There are people who are great DPS but cannot tank to save their life. There are people who are god-tier supports who haven’t mastered a DPS hero well enough to contribute. Queuing into a match and getting stuck and/or volunteering for a role that is way above or way below your average SR is going to wack out the matchmaking.
Sure, but someone who is fantastic at scoring headshots on McCree can still be a garbage Ana, not because their aim isn’t up to snuff, but because they have no idea how to effectively apply those skills to supporting. Someone who is a terrific Symmetra could be a terrible Zarya, despite being good at beam weapons, because those heroes are fundamentally required to play in different positions and accomplish different things.
And this would be gosh-awful for tanks and healers, for reasons that I won’t unpack because I’m already typing too much, but I can in a separate post.
If they throw, the SR loss may not bother them, but the incoming suspensions against their entire actual account probably will.
People who care about grinding all the roles up to max SR will care. People who don’t care have no reason to play on an off role.
I have no doubt there will be throwers and trolls because, y’know, online gaming, but I cannot imagine a reason that someone who doesn’t throw currently would start throwing just because they can queue in an off role.
Well, for one, you might have gotten rusty, but for another, if you haven’t completed placements in an eternity, then you can expect that your SR is gonna be wonky. I haven’t completed placements in several seasons and don’t put much stock in being exactly maintained if I decided to dust off competitive again.
Already an issue. 2-2-2 won’t fix it (something I argued when I was making a case for why I didn’t favor role queue), but it does not create it, either.
Meaningless speculation. Blizzard has the full power to tell their pro players, “Hey, we’re changing the game, like it or lump it”. For them to make a pretense about voting does precisely bupkis to improve their public image about it, especially when there is a nonzero likelihood of OWL players going public with a “Okay we were called to a vote and then Blizz told us we had to vote yes or we would get fired” (especially if these players did subsequently get let go and therefore had no vested interest in maintaining a good rapport with the company).
As it is, every streamer I follow (pro or otherwise) has been gushing about how much better the game is for them with role queue implemented. So.
Blizzard has 0 incentive to make a change in the game that they think will be harmful for it. They have 0 incentive to implement a change that they believe will drive off their customer base. They have 0 incentive to strong-arm their pros into going along with a change that they don’t like and don’t think will improve the game.
Disagree with the call all you want, lay out the reasons why, but bad-faith assumptions of carelessness or conspiracy is utterly baseless.
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As i’ve been playing many competitive games in role que, i’ve realized that tanks and supports lack in skill. This may be due to the fact that they are awarded for play tanks and supports. People who don’t know how to play those roles can get free credits without ruining the placement they care about. Since many people play DPS, skill level in DPS seem to be very substantial compared to the other roles. Another reason may be that people simply try other roles they aren’t skilled at because they have nothing to lose. Because of the placement system, these people are placed way above their skill rating in specific roles. This is a crucial issue for Overwatch players so it must be resolved.
Despite launching the blizz app daily i forgot that even exists
Trust me it will die when the steam dies and people realize the game is empty.
oh…?
F
and they wont be able to add any expansions to it because it sounds dumb to add an expansion to a game thats supposed to replicate the past version.
Hello, may I transfer your article to the forum in China？ I will attach the original address.
True…but money.
Fastastic writeup my guy.