Competitive is too unstable an experience

General Discussion
21

Oh, I’m sorry. I forgot you are the exception to the system :slight_smile:

It’s ELO. Matchmaking is determined solely by your ELO rating/SR. Nothing else. Maybe an addition to toxicity, I don’t know. There is no “we will let you win 3 times and let you lose 3 times”. Have you ever talked to someone addicted to slots? You can’t imagine the amount of patterns those people see in their random images. It’s literally the same argument. The system doesn’t push you anywhere, you’re just unlucky. I’ve had several bad teammates in a row as well, and I’ve had several good ones in a row. Then I’ve had a good team and a bad team, then I was bad and after that I was good, etc., you get the point.

I can try and tell you why it feels that way, though. It’s because Overwatch is one of the most teamy games out there, also you can’t check how your team is doing and who is playing badly. But one bad player can lose you every game, just as one good player can make you win every game and make it look like you’re playing with 5 GMs. Overwatch has this weird feeling that if you lose, your team looks like they are Bronze, but if you win they combo ults like you’re in Diamond.

22

You said you climbed on multiple accounts, I took that as you were already GM when you played on some of the others. Otherwise it is irrelevant information.

The reason why things might seem more stable at your level, is that people play more reliably, which they don’t at lower levels. I dunno if you ever get pushed down to Masters or Diamond, but I don’t think it is as common at higher levels as down where I am.

Oh, and do you believe everyone has the ability to climb to T500 if they just put in enough effort?
Because I don’t. Alot has to be right: Reaction times, eye sight, quick thinking. Doing all the right things (positioning, game sense) is the things you can do something about, the first things are genetics-dependent and to a certain degree age dependent as well.

I don’t believe I should be GM. I know for a fact that I can match Diamond players, and that is where I percieve myself to be. And I don’t have ambitions for more. What I don’t understand, is why matchmaking makes it so volatile, that Im frequently pushed around 400-500 SR, and many matches, especially in Plat are due to really, really poor players.
It doesn’t make sense.

How do you know that? It would certainly be possible to implement something like that.

Blizzard looked to science when developing WoW, where they found the Skinner Box to get people playing. How can you rule out, that they have implemented something similar in Overwatch, maybe based on some research they found somewhere?
You can’t, because Blizzard is notoriously opaque about their system, and because they have ruled out 3rd-parties from running systems with Overwatch, you will never know.

I do believe in the long run, that you will climb to where you should be. But I don’t like how the system operates and how it seems to force losses from time to time.

23

How do you know your finger doesn’t bend when you put it in water? Because of reason.
There is no rational explanation for employing such a system. The work it would require for literally no effect. Let alone someone has to have such an idiotic idea: “Hey, we’re gonna let people lose 500 SR in a row, that would be great, wouldn’t it?”
Nope, ELO systems don’t work like this. The math behind ELO is complicated enough when it comes to team games, nobody wants to add a second variable to matchmaking to make it even harder.

And how would that variable work? ELO already describes skill level, so you need something that describes another skill level so that ELO doesn’t describe real skill level anymore (because why would you have 2 variables that do the same?). What is ELO for then? The whole purpose of the system is to match players equal in skill.

How can you rule out, that they have implemented something similar in Overwatch, maybe based on some research they found somewhere?

The same way I can rule out my finger is actually being bent under water. Context. Which, by the way, is the same way I can rule out slot providers programming patterns into their machines.

(sorry for the edits)

24

how do you know? If some research shows that people will not accept losing more than 5 games in a row, and that they get a dopamin-high from winning 3 games in a row and can take some losses after that - how can you say that it “makes no sense”?

Im not saying this is how it is, because noone knows - including you.

What I am saying is that matches are irrationally unstable, and that Competitive MatchMaking feels managed.

Lol, no. You know, it may be the purpose on the surface, but it barely ever happens. At all. I barely play a game where there is not either a smurf, a person that is far, far out of their league or both.

25

Ok keep making excuses I guess :man_shrugging:

I can understand dropping 100 - 200 SR to bad teammates but 500 SR it is clearly your fault.

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26

Do you want me to repeat myself intentionally?

The same way I can rule out my finger is actually being bent under water. Context.

Sure, you can argue that your finger is actually being bent when you put it in water, but I will continue to laugh at such a hilarious statement while knowing that it is because light reflects differently in different fluids. You can keep asking “BUT HOW DO YOU KNOW?!?”, and I will keep laughing.

What I am saying is that matches are irrationally unstable, and that Competitive MatchMaking feels managed.

I understand you feel that way. Just like addicted slot players feel that way. Do you know about the dude who has been hit by lightning 7 times or so? No, actually there is no god hammering him every few years, it is mostly chance.

Lol, no. You know, it may be the purpose on the surface, but it barely ever happens.

Because it’s impossible. Total skill equality needs an infinite amount of players. Since Overwatch, obviously, does not have an infinite amount of players, matchmaking can never be perfectly equal. The purpose is to approach perfect equality and also to make queueing times not unbearably long. The compromise is that matches will not be equal. But if you play an infinite amount of matches in that system, the ELO differences will end up as a bell curve around exactly zero. 100 People playing 100 matches will end up in a bell curve slightly off of zero. Statistically you will end up playing equal matches on average. Of course you can be the one exception which lands on the far left side of the bell curve, but you probably aren’t. Some games will be on the far left side, some on the far right side, some in the middle. That’s just how it is, that’s how it has to be.

27

The matchmaker is extremely bad right now because of queue times and role specific SR not living up to its promise. This can make games seem very spotty and sometimes the result it is out of your control. However, the only thing you CAN control is your own play, so you should always concentrate on that.

28

Funny how the higher level players stopped talking about it once performance-based SR was removed for Diamond+. There has not been a peep about the competitive system since, and people like you come here and tell everyone living in the system daily, that they should just gitgud.

What I am discussing was discussed alot in the past. Somehow it is impossible to discuss it anymore.

I mean, you are a gold player on the border of silver, putting up straw men about “bent fingers” (are you alright?) that you can shoot at.
Waste of time.

29

You feel managed? Don’t be pathetic. Get better at the game.

30

More excuses, I was level 59 first season, stayed in plat with a few dips in gold for over a year, then in diamond for 6 months then masters for 6 months too.

You don’t climb because you don’t learn how to play the game properly, I’m 33 and under anti depressant all day so my reaction time is super long still I made it to GM because I have a brain and I use it. I suggest you put yours to work on something that actually matters instead of trying to find issues in the system.

If you’re not in diamond it’s simply because you don’t deserve to.

31

Wow.
You are the best human being ever. I hope I become like you in my next life. I especially would like that big brain of yours.

32

Until they resolve player credibility and make it so every match has LESS impact on SR It wont ever resolve.

WoW Arena was this way too. The impact of matches are too much. Sure, a ladder that allows a person to climb or descend fast is NICE. BUT it also means that it won’t help those that get large quantities of POTATO team mates.

33

I just told you I’m far from being a FPS god and still managed to get to GM, anyone can, it’s not all about being mechanically gifted.

34

I see there is no point in talking to you, you don’t seem to grasp the simplest concepts. Have fun being delusional then :slight_smile: Some people just cannot be taught, a sad truth of life.

35

Excuse me, but what does it say about you and “cannot be taught” when you are down on the border to silver?

Maybe practice before you preach?

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36

I just wanted to get to Diamond and be done with ranked.

I mained support and it was the only class I played in comp at a 2800-2950 sr range. When I peaked at 2960ish - after having a winning streak of about 5 or more games (8-2 in my replay list) - I started to lose all of a sudden right before Diamond.

Not just one loss. There were multiple. I kept playing after the first two, but they kept coming and I dropped over 150 sr down to 2800.

There is no way that that is fair after grinding so hard. I managed to get back to the 2950 range multiple times, so there’s no luck involved in that. But I’m just done with the randomness of this system and won’t put up with it anymore.

Spare me with your focus on your gameplay and you’ll climb crap. That’s what I’ve been doing for the past few seasons anyway. Plat, especially high Plat, is too random and full of smurfs, that it’s just a pain to play there.

I had a Doom in almost every game, that’s usually a nightmare for supports. Had to pick up Moira and Lucio to even stand a chance against this monster.

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37

What does my rank have to do with that? Have you ever looked at how much I play this game? :slight_smile:

But that’s besides the fact, I could be Bronze and tell you your understanding of statistics is less than optimal. Those two things have nothing in common. You saying that simply proves your inability to grasp simple concepts once again.

A doctor doesn’t have to have had cancer to tell you you should get chemotherapy when you need it.

38

I feel this. I wanted all my roles to hit masters before I settled in and only played support, and grinding tank to that level was awful. I’m telling you, I hit 3490 at least five times. Won game, loss game, won game, loss game, won game, loss game.

OOF.

I could think it was my fault if I just kept losing, but the back and forth made me convinced that the losses weren’t often my fault.

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39

There is this obvious pattern, where after you win 2-3 matches in a row, you slowly get worse and worse team mates, and usually you will get stomped after two games, and then you can look forward to 2-3 match loss streak.

i begin to lose 10 consecutive matches in a row

Wow. Three people with three different “obvious patterns”. It’s almost like it’s random. But I forgot, Blizzard manually programmed those patterns to suit every individual player. Because you just can’t know that that’s not how it works, right? :smiley:

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41

Hey, I’m not saying my pattern was obvious or even real, I was just taking the opportunity to complain about my own experience with leavers and throwers every other game on the verge of masters, lol. Though, it was a rather hilarious experience in hindsight.

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