I’m trying to say that is a colossally bad idea.
Flat out, yes they will.
YES! Where have you been? Anytime any of these are good people complain at the top of their lungs. The only reason you don’t see complaints are when they aren’t very good.
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Yes. Which is why venture got nerfed after their release, reaper was terrifying during the first years of ow and still dominates low elo lobbies, bastion is always complained about due to the amount of damage he can deal in assault mode and mei and her icicles of death are always an issue when she even tries to be meta.
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This is my idea. I see it’s starting to take.
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People complain about widow, roadhog, tanks doing too much dmg, supports doing too much dmg, ana CDs, immortalities, hypermobility, and everything else currently in the game. If complaints were the litmus test for why we should or shouldn’t do things, OW would already be deleted.
The point stands that reworking tanks into DPS has the following benefits:
- It makes tanks more broadly fun, like DPS, which alleviates the queue bottleneck.
- It makes the game overall less stale-mate heavy, which appeals to DPS players and probably draws a bigger crowd.
- Supports are a mixed bag and will probably be the next bottleneck, but probably won’t be as severe as the current tank bottleneck (because many supports are DPS-like) so relatively an improvement.
- And most important of all: I, personally, will like the game more
Cons? Idk it makes OW less unique? Which i don’t really think is a downside because striving to be unique for it’s own sake is foolish. And I don’t even know what other titles OW becomes a clone of even in my proposed format? Tf2?
I disagree on this point. I don’t think it does.
Again, I disagree. It makes it more death match heavy and less teamwork oriented which makes it no longer Overwatch. Why even play this game anymore if we do this?
And then they have to fear being reworked against their will into DPS too.
Yes it will.
And I will dislike it more. I guess we cancel each other out.
There would be absolutely no reason to play this game anymore and it will die. I’m not being hyperbolic. It wouldn’t last a year.
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But dps aren’t fun… i only play tank and support because i don’t really like playing dps. My faves are reaper and mei on dps. And dva, zarya and orisa on tank due to them being able to both protect their team and punish stragglers.
It might make the games faster, but the situation right now is on the verge of too fast.
I liked ow1 because it was slower, made intelligent plays feel better than just strafe m1:ing at all times.
The way ow1 differentiated from all cods and similar, was the slower pace.
I’d hate it if an entire match is suddenly decided if a single player gets killed.
The faster game rythm with a single tank already feels like it’s made snowballs worse, i’d hate to imagine how horrible it would feel when there isn’t a tank standing between you and the widow oneshot.
If a game is punishing to play, it doesn’t feel good, the amount of damage and dps passive already make ow feel punishing to play. Which is why the amount of tank players dropped sharply the moment that the dps passive was introduced.
The passive is why i feel that oq 3tanks 2 supps or 4/1 comps are the best. No dps passive. Let the tanks run wild while i juggle my heals on them and make sure no one dies.
It comes down to skill when there aren’t any handihats to nerf your gameplay because the enemies didn’t know how to play as a team.
A 3v1 should be won by the 3. Right now the 3v1 is winnable by the 1. It’s not right.
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I agree completely with your observations, but I come to a different conclusion. Allow me to explain:
There is nothing that turns the tide of a teamfight in OW more then getting a pick. However, normally to get a pick, you have to put yourself at risk, which opens you up for a revenge kill. If you die getting a pick, the fight is still even because you only traded.
As you bring up, widow is a major cheater because she can kill without risk on maps where she can play angles that no one else can contest except herself. But OW2 introduced another cheater: the tank role.
It is not uncommon for a raid boss tank to punish a squishy for over-extending or diving into the backline to pick a support. Most DPS, can also do this, but the difference is that DPS put themselves at risk of being revenge killed, while tanks do not. It takes an extraordinary amount of skill to go positive on a trade for a DPS or support, but for raid boss tanks, it is expected. This is why OW2 feels more snowbally then OW1. In OW1 tanks were less stat-padded so they more frequently traded for kills.
What makes this even worse is that OW2 tanks can be revenge killed more consistently with counterpicks. But there is no counterpick against every tank choice. So, tank players who can switch everytime they get counterpicked can perserve their “unfair” immunity to being revenge killed while tank players who stick to one “favorite” get outvalued. Its not even fair for the tank players themselves.
Precisely, but right now its the tank that is the “1” and the non-tanks that is the “3”.
All heroes in a match need to be equally “killable” so that revenge kills keep fights balanced for longer and prevent early blowouts we often see from raid boss tanks getting “free” picks on squishies.
If unique without fun, it’s just a plain garbage.
But if it’s fun without uniqueness, then it comes into the play how much polished it is, and it’s actually one of the biggest strength of Blizz.
Blizz traditionally was not the pioneer. They copied successful games, made it much better and achieved much bigger success. They ofc tried to be unique but afair, it was more fail than success. Tanks in OW not much different. It was more a unique headache rather than unique fun. OW in its prime time, few people played tanks and people often play without tanks but people had fun and it was huge success.
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I meant this purely as 2 supp and 1 damage versus 1 damage.
An out of position tank dies really fast though. The armor changes made them a little tankier against some dps, but generally, armored tanks die faster.
If 2 people see the tank over extend, that tank is dead. 2 supps can’t outheal any dps dealing damage, on top of that there’s a second person dealing free damage and the tank melts (I’m in gold 3).
The only tanks that get in and out relatively scott free are hamster and doomfist. Any tank with a lifeweaver, but that demands teamplay.
Ow2 to me feels snowbally because of possible skill differences between tanks, and flankers have more free reign because there isn’t a second tank to keep them in check and the dps haven’t yet realized that it’s their job to kill the enemy dps. Preferrably starting with the one that’s killing the supports.
A counter pick can give you an edge over the other tank, but it’s not worth it if you don’t know how that tank works.
(All tanks can be countered with skill and awareness, but all tanks also have counter picks)
The counterswapping is an issue, but it’s also an issue that all dps are not viable all the time.
Same issue, same cure. The impossible to reach balance.
Even dps and supports can counter swap tanks, at which point it’s the other team’s job to counter swap those swaps. The tanks might not need to engage in the rock, paper, scissors game at all.
Counter swapping is more of an issue at higher ranks, i’m lead to believe.
This is a rather silly conversation.
- CounterStrike
- Unreal Tournament
- Call of Duty
- Valorant
- Rainbow 6 Siege
- Apex Legends
- TitanFall 2
- Halo Infinite
- Splitgate
- Team Fortress 2
- Starsiege: TRIBES
- Hawken
- Dirty Bomb
- Gundam Evolution
- Overwatch 2 <--------------
- Overwatch 2017
- Paladins
- Overwatch 2022 <--------------
- Bleeding Edge
- PlanetSide 2
- Paragon Reborn
- Battle Born
- HyperUniverse
- Awesomenauts
- Smite
- League of Legends
- DotA2
- World of Warcraft PVP
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Is this a comparison of game speed or a scale between moba and fps?
Could be either.
But explains why i’ve never liked any of these XD (the rest i’ve never heard of, apart from LOL)
I’m still in ow because it’s familiar
CounterStrike
Unreal Tournament
Call of Duty
Valorant
Rainbow 6 Siege
Apex Legends
TitanFall 2
Halo Infinite
Team Fortress 2
Paladins
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Well, let’s put it this way.
A playerbase where 66% of the players prefer a playstyle that rarely goes for kills, isn’t something that exists.
And it never will be.
So why would the devs develop a game around a playerbase that doesn’t exist?
But that as a comparison doesn’t have much to do with overwatch.
Having to fight for every kill is different than rarely going for kills.
But if we humor the comparison, overwatch certainly found a playerbase pretty fast. And it was a pretty big one.
It’s their own development decisions that estranged the playerbase, and now they’re trying to fix what they left to rot.
Much of the playerbase has moved on.
And if dps heavy gameplay is something that the devs keep moving forwards to…
Any first person shootery games you could recommend? Something similar enough to overwatch that it doesn’t demand a hyper aggressive gameplay and which has weapons/characters that are playable with a 30% or less accuracy without ending up as a detriment for the team?
I also really like aerial gameplay, jetpacks or something?
What percentage of the playerbase would you have left, if you subtracted out the DPS players, and kill-focused Support/Tank players?
What fraction do you get for 4 divided by 6?
Well, Deep Rock Galactic scout is pretty zippy.
I’m at a point where I don’t even care as long as they come up with something that doesn’t force me to play tank to accomplish my weekly challenges.
My pet peeve is putting up with the 20 matches in “All Roles” queue, aka “Tank queue” every single week when I have an active Premium BP…
Fix that and I’ll forever be happy when it comes to Overwatch.
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Maybe that clip didn’t really represent things.
Well… seeing that even in destiny2 i play a fire warlock. Who with the right things can shoot mid air without plummeting like a stone.
That does look fun.
I might look into it some more.
Also, we both know that the dps players are more than a third of the playerbase, so 40 -30 -30 is closer. And from both tank and support there are people who prefer protecting to dashing ahead into the enemy team.
Whenever i played reaper and mei in ow1, i always played a bodyguard to the supports. Thus freeing both of the tanks to run amock if they wanted to. I’ve done the same in oq in ow2 until the recent armor change. If no one else cares that me and the other supp are being harassed, i swap to reaper and keep spy checking eith the shotgun spread, dome the tracer and solo ult the moira that faded in if i had to.
And many new supports have been created to attract dps players, ergo they have been designed damage oriented.
Playing those supports passively is throwing. So i’d say that sadly, that the more defence oriented players only reach around 45% at most.
But at least we used to be able to play. The dps passive is the first thing that actively makes heal oriented gameplay less viable.
Yes. What should have happened was they never delete OW1, release OW2 with no roles and just go as far as they can in that direction.
Then you’d have both games instead of this stupid hybrid mess they’ve forced on everyone out of laziness+greed where you have a bunch of legacy stuff that doesn’t work with new stuff.
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Tanks as dps is what OW1 was, but tank players just acted surprised about being focused with CC and dying because they were the most impactful role in the game in OW1.
Nurfing tank health would essentially make them utility dps which is what they have always been. Beefy dps. Old hog, diva, etc could 100 to 0 any flanker. It’s just semantics really.
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We’ll have to agree to disagree. That has not been my experience. Hog and Mauga can basically go wherever they want and no one can do anything about it. Winston can just run down the backline unless you hard counter him and even Rein can just W through entire teams with minimal support if your tank is messing around on ball.
Has not been my experience either. When I play tank I mostly like Dva and teams are on triple beam by 2nd team fight in plat.
I’d say that since OW2 launched nothing in the game is more consequential towards a match’s outcome than an uncountered tank playing decently.
I have no earthly clue what your point is here.