Can We Admit Role Queue is a Failure?

General Discussion
183

clarification: The statement I replied to indicated that only dps players preferred the freedom of role-less queue.

184

Added a disclaimer that said: Mind the Rule of Exceptions----took it down since it seemed out of place. Thanks for clarifying why something like that is needed.

185

I understand you need to believe that RQ is a failure because you hate it, but that isn’t the case. RQ has made the game better in many ways, with very little drawbacks.

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there are many, many, many people playing qp classic for the freedom it offers

many of those players are support mains and/or tank mains

187

Back when LFG was introduced, I always set my roles the same way:
1 Tank
1 Flex
2 Damage
2 Support
It was understood that whoever joined for Flex could off tank or play third DPS as needed. If you joined for Tank, it meant you were playing main tank.
If you just set your LFG for 2-2-2, half the time, you’d just get two off tank players, and you’d get a whack team comp anyway, after going through all the trouble of using LFG.
Well that’s how 2-2-2 is now.
If 1-3-2 sets this right by making the 1 Tank player main tank, and allowing one of the Damage players to flex to off tank, then I’ll finally be happy with role queue.

188

Actual flexing needed to disappear since players largely get “abused” in Competitive (esp. with profiles visible). Options to switch will also get abused and having penalties for abuse the will be abused as well—that’s a lot of abuse which players (unfortunately) excel at.

“Players” are resilient as an entity, get rid of one player for rule breaking “two more surface”.

189

I’d dispute that. Before role queue, I had a whole total of zero games lost at the spawn room, and the number remained zero after role queue.

So it didn’t improved. It stayed the same.

2 Likes
190

No.

191

Really, I hated the system too at first but now I think it could not have been better. It is refreshing to see other heroes be played again see different comps being played. And a lot of my friends came back to the game and stayed. The only problem I have dealt with was queue times but I am willing to wait for a quality match.

1 Like
192

Remove Lucio’s speedboost, and goats dies.

193

And pretty much all Rein heavy comps…

Wait a minute, even Dive needs Lucio.

194

I’m from Brazil, and at least until Sym 3.0 arrived, I barely had to wait 3 minutes to get two teammates for my LFG. After Sym 2.0 got deleted, I severely reduced my playtime, and mostly played when friends invited. So I don’t know what happened after that date.

Said that, my LFG was always three flex slots, with the description to rotate 1-1-1 each match. I didn’t filled for a full 6-stack, and mostly I used that to chit-chat while playing or waiting for the next match. That also increased the amount of Bnet friends I had, and often I would invite them instead of opening a LFG, but I did had a very active LFG life.

Heck, even now, LFG is not dead in SA. I played the three weeks of Archives and had a lot of movement there, even outside the achievement hunters.

People just need to remember that you are not required to always post 6-stack LFG. 2-4 people is often enough to find a good balance.

1 Like
195

Nope definitely not that simple.

  1. They would trash a balanced support
  2. Goats was not enabled by speed boost
  3. Supports are already getting nerfed quite a bit and I think they are all in a good spot
196

Yeah, they know what it was like before, and don’t want to return to the days where the don’t have an effective anti flanker.

They worry that blizzard will tighten it way way too much.

It is fear driving it.

197

You are blind if you think Lucio is not used in everything, and is more clutch then any other support.

Lucio was used during the Ana meta when we had 4 tanks and Ana’s Nano Boost was scary. Lucio was used in Dive. Lucio was used in Goats… Why? Because he could speed around the map, and increase the speed of his team. Lucio was clutch.

We saw how important he was last week when he was banned in OWL. All Deathball type of comps were weak without a speedboost to collapse on the other team. SF Shock were struggling to win, you know, last year’s champs. They tried to do “goats” like comps without a Lucio, and it was weak… WEAK.

Brig was merely a catalyst, but you can have “goats” without Brig. Kind of like how you can swamp out Ana, Moira, and Zen… overall Lucio is the clutch pick for Goats. No one swaps Lucio for Baptiste.

1 Like
198

When did I say he isnt’t used a lot all I said was its a misconception to say that Lucio’s speed boost alone enabled goats.

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The overall Goats comp is what made it powerful yes, but without the Speedboost, you would just be a bunch of slow ult charge for the enemy team with a Pharah. So Lucio is the one that makes it so strong.

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Even with a pharah Dva was widely used in goats so pharah would have had no effect against a capable dva. What made goats strong was its high sustain and the ability to snowball.

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Lucio is used in everything… the end.

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I was with you until 1-3-2.

1-3-2 is better than 2-2-2, for sure, but still tries to cram square pegs into round holes.

Overwatch is a social problem, and you can’t solve those with technical solutions.

The problem is that people don’t know “how to play,” where “how to play” includes “how to work as a team.”

It is, and was, too complicated for me to write out, but I was able to get the fundamentals, which will teach someone all they need to know if followed:

h ttps://calmongames.wordpress.com/2019/06/29/overwatch-the-missing-manual/

h ttps://calmongames.wordpress.com/2019/06/06/how-teams-learn-to-coordinate/

Overwatch will never be playable, with or without role queue, until the things in those posts are common knowledge.