Bastion has a lot of issues, but Roadhog is the one absolutely glaring problem. His usage in bunker comp is why Bastion is pushed out of the meta that he should otherwise be ideal for.
A hooked Bastion is a dead Bastion. It’s as simple as that. It’s too easy for Roadhog to pop Orisa’s shield and hook the Bastion, because Bastion does not have enough firepower without headshots to take down a corner-peeking hog.
The matchup today is very different than the matchup at game launch, which was fairly even given Roadhog’s former inability to move while healing and lack of any damage reduction. Bastion’s damage output has been severely nerfed since then, and Roadhog’s survivability has been buffed by an enormous margin.
Something has to change in this matchup to make Bastion viable in the meta.
I suggest working on positioning and communication with your tank. Position yourself in a spot thats harder to hook and if your orisas shield is going down have her communicate that or at least look at the visual, then get up and move a bit to avoid being hooked. Hog has always been a part of bunker and Bastion thrives in Bunker.
Though you may mean well, I am not a new player looking for advice on this matchup. Your advice is sound general advice, but your assumption that I need such basic advice in response to a thread about a real balance issue in the game is a little insulting, to be frank.
Bunker is being played in high SR comp, but it’s not typically with Bastion. It’s with Hanzo and Widowmaker, primarily. It’s an enormous glaring problem when Bastion isn’t the go-to pick in a bunker meta. It should be Bastion’s meta, but it very clearly isn’t. Look at the stats.
My post about the Roadhog vs Bastion matchup is my attempt to explain the observable numbers.
Don’t know if it would solve this problem but that hook range is just excessively long. Hog just doesn’t punish people for being out of position, his original design intent, he punishes people for being in position as well, that isn’t quite right.
The idea that “hog punishes people for being out of position” is something that came up as a phrase spread around by players, but I’ve never seen a developer say it. I’m not sure that’s really the design intent. It’s a bit of a strange thing to say, as common as it is to see or hear. Every hero punishes people for being out of position. Roadhog’s hook just adds to the threats that define what a good position is.
His role isn’t to punish out-of-position players so much as it is to move players who are in good positions out of their position.
Sounds like you are crap at Bastion, you know good Bastion’s are mobile right? Bad ones hide witht hie tank. Hog is EXTREMELY loud, so maybe listen sometimes
Okay, I will buy that then, it makes a lot more sense.
I am glad to hear you say that, I too have decided on an account devoted to Bastion that hangng with the tank constantly is not wise despite some shield tankers getting flustered I am not with them constantly.
Its a complex question. He has his deficits, like being fairly large in recon mode and easily hit, no question. Likewise, some people sit in Sentry mode too often, that is probably the biggest problem then get wiped more easily.
The better bastions move more, constantly setting up and fighting more in recon mode. I strive when I run him to be about 50% elims with Recon mode.
The problem is you get salt regardless: if you are countered a lot its “getz off da Bastion, you suk fool” but if you do well, its “you f’ing n00b, get offa Bastion you no skill pos”. So, you’re damned if you do, damned if you don’t with Bastion. I encounter far more toxicity in my team and from the other when I run Bastion unlike any other character, and that says a lot from someone who also does a good bit of Mei and Sym. Bastion gets far more heat from all sides, including jealous teammates.
I’m a very good Bastion who moves around a lot, but you’re kind of crap at being a nice person, aren’t you?
A good Bastion player does listen to hog and move to avoid getting hooked, but a Bastion in recon mode isn’t bringing good value to the team anymore compared to alternatives. Any time Bastion is in recon mode is time spent bringing less to your team than a Soldier: 76 would in the same hero slot.
Roadhog simply existing denies Bastion the realistic capability to use Sentry mode at effective ranges without a shield to block the hook. Even if Roadhog never kills Bastion in a given match, too much value is lost from Bastion being constantly forced to avoid him. Not even an Orisa shield provides safety because of how fast it can break under Roadhog’s pressure.
The most effective position for Bastion when up against a Roadhog is very often at long range, even at the cost of being out in the open instead of behind a tank’s shield. As with the Recon mode problem, this is another situation where a different hero does it better. Widowmaker or Hanzo can do a lot more from long range than Bastion can, and this is where the current “bunker” meta with dual snipers comes from.
Your delivery was callous, but you’re not wrong about Bastion needing to do more than just sit behind an Orisa shield. Bastion does need to move around to stay alive, but therin lies the problem: there’s no reason to play Bastion if you can never sit still within his gun’s effective range.
That’s correct. He’s a liability because it’s too easy to hard counter Bastion. Roadhog’s hook is one of those hard counters. It’s probably the hardest of all the counters, because it’s virtually guaranteed death for Bastion any time hog gets within 20 meters without a shield between them.
This is by design. Roadhog has always been a great answer to other tanks and Bastion. The only thing that needs to change is how well you play bastion. That being said, Reaper, Torb, Soldier, and Mei work very well against roadhog.
Roadhog was actually killable by Bastion back before the Bastion rework. A Bastion with good aim could absolutely DELETE Roadhog back when Bastion had headshots in Sentry mode, but hog could still get a hook off if Bastion was unaware or busy. Kill or be killed felt fair from both sides. Now the matchup is entirely one-sided in Roadhog’s favor. What we have now is different than what we had by the original design, and nowhere has a developer claimed that Roadhog is intended to counter Bastion.
No. This is not a “me” problem. This is a Bastion problem. Look at the available stats on hero pick rates. Bastion is trash tier in the middle of a so-called “bunker meta”. He has a 0.6% pick rate overall down to a 0.3% pick rate in GM. He is dead last by a huge margin in every rank above silver, only breaking 1% pick rate in Bronze.
The best way to play Bastion is by standing in the spawn room so you can select another hero.
the only way you’ll be allowed to hook a bastion is if a mei lifts him up for you and that is not as easy as people make it out to be. Hog has to puthimself in line of fire to hook the bastion
Orisa’s shield has 900hp. Even a team of 6 Mercy can break that shield in just 1.5 seconds if they all actually shoot it. People grossly overestimate the durability of Orisa’s shield… and of all shields, for that matter.
I couldn’t disagree more with you about this thread.
Bastion is already increasingly difficult to defeat in lower/mid ranks due to his main “counter”, the communication/coordination between teams being completely non - existent there.
Roadhog is pretty much one of the only hero counters to Bastion who can regularely defeat him in said ranks, due to him not requiring a lot of skill to get value out of in the first place, so simple making him an unreliable counter against him as well is more than unreasonable…
