Atp what do we do with hog

General Discussion
42

I might be a somewhat non-typical hog player but I think old just-pre-rework hog with the new breather with some hook adjustment should work.

Hook should do less dmg, has less range, but half the cd. He should just have an area around him that’s highly lethal (but not 1-shot), not something like “don’t be in the range when he has hook and go for him hard when he doesn’t”. His hook should be the lethal version of peel that we need on a reaper type tank, not the ability you hit to get a kill that leaves you basically useless for a long time after regardless of results.

43

You haven’t made a logical argument. That is just coincidence until you prove causation.

If your argument is that the game’s balance is reflective of player perception of fun fighting against the hero, then I have some shocking news. When D.Va and Mauga were absolutely busted at one point, that means everyone loved playing against them? Or when Roadhog was meta the second month after his rework everyone all of a sudden loved playing against him and that’s why he was meta? Are you delusional?

So when they gigabuffed Orisa a few months ago it was because everyone all of a sudden changed their opinions on playing against her and the devs thought “Hmm, everyone loves the immortal horse now so we’ll just give her massive buffs to please them!”

You’re divorced from reality.

The genre of hero shooters is poorly understood by you.

If you don’t like games where there are many different heroes with different and unique abilities creating a system of positive and negative matchups, play a game where every player has access to the same tools.

You’re part of the group who wants this game to become CoD. What next? Should we add perks, equipment, and killstreaks? Make every player able to sprint? Make the game loadout-based rather than hero-based? It feels like you won’t be happy until roles are removed and every hero is Soldier: 76 without helix rockets and healing. Overwatch is clearly not fun for you. Hero shooters are not fun for you. I suggest finding a genre that appeals to you.

Case in point. You picked the hero that plays so similar to Soldier: 76 that the only difference between them is a fully automatic rifle vs. a semi-automatic rifle lmao.

44

It’s not coincidence, It’s you being purposefully ignorant and ignoring the signs in your face because you are either an idiot or don’t want to admit your hero is a cancer to overwatch.

Notice how dva got slightly nerfed, is still quite strong but the discussions around her have died down? It’s because people like the hero, she was just TOO strong.

Mauga being strong lasted a LITERAL WEEK and the feedback was so damn strong about how cancer the hero was, that blizzard immediately after ONE WEEK nerfed him into the ground and he’s been a bottom feeder ever since they realized no one likes the hero.

Roadhog was meta for again a short time after the rework and then guess what! People said “Hey blizzard, the rework did nothing, the hero is still cancer!” and shocker!

HE’S A BOTTTOM FEEDER NOW.

Again I ask. Stop being stupid to drive a point home. Admit you are wrong and move on. Fun is ABSOLUTELY a factor in why heroes get nerfed.

This just in:

Overwatch balance team makes stupid decision and quickly walks back on it when they realize their playerbase despises the hero being changed.

Just look at the feedback and reactions on people’s faces every patch when orisa gets microbuffed. People despise the hero and if she gets strong again she’ll quickly be punched right back down by the community.

Why do you think certain heroes are straight up never made meta or if they are meta, they are quickly dealt with? Because people despise the heroes on a fundamental level.

You keep saying this moronic statement as if spamming it makes it less moronic. No one is saying unique hero identities don’t need to exist. The problem is when those hero identities are unfun problematic designs that directly interfere with a majority of people’s enjoyment of the video game.

Literally EVERYTHING about soldier and ashe are different. The only thing similar is that they are hitscan, what in the blue hell are you talking about? Are you genuinely this unaware or uneducated about the game you are on the forums for?

This statement alone shows you need to go talk about a different video game. You don’t know the game you are speaking on, on its most basic level. Really? The only difference is semi auto vs automatic? LMFAOOOO

46

That’s not at all what I said. So you keep playing make believe and have fun talking to yourself.

Except in your example it’s untrue and never happens. So again, keep playing make believe.

Everything in video games is subjective you dent head, that’s the POINT. We are talking about a clear fun factor that is non existent with hog.

Again, their weapons are quite literally only similar in the fact that they are hitscan. NOTHING about the two heroes outside of that is even remotely similar.

Soldier has an unlimited sprint, a burst damage ability, and an aimbot ult.

Ashe has two firing modes, an AoE DoT ability, a keep away mobility tool, and a 6th hero on the team for an ult.

There is nothing similar between the two heroes other than the fact they are hitscans. You are objectively incorrect.

Except I don’t have a problem with their identities. I have a problem with widow and hog’s which is the two heroes we are talking about.

47

He needs a complete overhaul, he still suffers from the issue of when he’s good he’s an unkillable 750hp with high sustain and the ability to one shot kill DPS and Support heroes who can also just afk on point and spam breather and when he’s bad he just blows up without really doing anything.

His rework failed to address any of his issues and made the issues surrounding take a breather much worse due to stuns such as javelin and Sig rock only interrupting it for one second now so the sole responsibility to countering him solely relies on support picking Ana and Zenyatta so he’ll blow up.

But that also doubles down on hog players complaints of Ana and Zenyatta making it so he can’t play the game. To be honest we do have a Roadhog who is good design and her name is Junker Queen.

48

Direct quote from you: “…majority of the community despises your hero, hence why he’s kept garbage tier permanently.”

HAHAHAHA. Rein has never been bad once in the entire history of the game? LMAOOOOO.

Not at all. Win rate, avg kills per 10 minutes, avg time of life before being killed, etc. are all metrics that don’t rely on feelings. They are objective. They don’t require emotional input.

As I said, if we remove the abilities and unique hero identities you have a problem with, they are nearly identical.

And I have a problem with your main’s identity. So since we’re balancing based on feelings, we’ll remove what I hate and what you hate. And remove everything else that gets complained about. Then every hero can be the same and you won’t have to cry about alleged problematic designs. Everybody will have the same gun, same tools, and the only deciding factor will be skill. Matchups won’t exist and you’ll get exactly what you want. Of course you don’t really want that. You want your hero to be the best in the game and the heroes you don’t like to be deleted from the game. But we have to consider everyone’s feelings. So to be fair we’ll remove everything other than a primary weapon so that nothing can ever be complained about. A necessary sacrifice so that you and I can’t complain about hero identities anymore.

49

Saying “a majority of the community hates your hero which is the reason he’s kept bad” is NOT the same as saying “I hate the hero personally which is why he’s kept bad because of me, one person”

Don’t be dense.

No. That’s not what I said.

Rein has never been KEPT bad because people didn’t like his design.

When it comes to the conversation about fun (you know, what video games are meant for) it is subjective!

Are you going to keep repeating this idiotic retort as if it means something? Your minority opinion is not some sort of “gotcha!” moment against my argument. You’re not proving anything other than your own incompetency.

A MAJORITY of people despise roadhog, hence why anytime he’s even remotely good, he’s immediately placed in the bottom feeder tier. Hence why he’s there now. Hence why he was there pre rework. They keep him garbage because they know, no one likes the hero.

50

A tank shouldn’t one-shot. Period. End of the line. If they can’t change that, he needs to stay a dead pick.

1 Like
51

Hog is probably one of the most poorly designed heroes in any competitive game, and it got even worse in ow2. 90% of his value comes from his hook+ headshot, which is one of the worst feelings in the entire game, and good hog players can land thier headshots almost every time. But without it, he offers little offensive value unless he ults, and when he doesn’t have his hook he’s not only not dying because of his sustain, but he’s also not doing anything for his team

53

Rein was literally the worst hero in the entire game for over a year

54

No one ever said that. My entire point has been about KEEPING them bad lmfao.

Hog became meta early in ow2, everyone realized “wow this is terrible” so he was kept in the gutter until his rework, his rework came around and he became good again and everyone again realized “wow this hero is still an absolute abomination” and where is he currently?

Once again in the gutter.

It should be! Unfun, monotonous things should never be good! It’s that simple.

Unfun, monotonous things are the VERY things that should be getting reworked and changed for the better. That’s always how it’s been.

And no it’s not about one person going “oh I don’t like this so it needs to be changed” it’s when such a large amount of people are saying it to the point that hog had to get reworked in the first place and those SAME complaints are still there even after the rework because it was a complete and total failure.

The proof you keep asking for is the fact roadhog keeps getting put into the gutter every single time he’s decent. It’s not just a “oh make him slightly weaker” no it’s putting him in the bottom 3 of the tank role and leaving him there for hilariously extended periods of time.

The design of the hero is god awful. Accept it, cope with it, move on.

Rein has never been the worst hero in the game. He’s been bad before, never the worst.

55

I have zero faith in the Reaper rework.
I am almost 100% positive he will play only slightly differently and be much worse to vs and much more annoying.

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56

Maybe just cough cough rework him to how he was OW 1 or like cough cough have fun playing another tank like doom idk

blizz ain’t really gonna do anything tho cough cough just sayin

57

How about this article?

There are heroes that the community is ok with having both a high win rate and a high pick rate. When Reinhardt hits a 60% win rate, which is considered very high for us, and is played often there are few complaints. When a hero like Roadhog does this (he recently topped out at around 54%), the community reacts… differently. There are heroes that the community deems more ‘fair,’ or at least less frustrating, than others. The mechanics of some heroes, especially at really high levels of play, require us to pay more attention to them. We still want every hero to be competitively viable, and we love that some of our heroes can be the right situational pick, but we think it’s healthier for the game for us to proactively, and in a more timely manner, manage certain heroes and prevent them from dominating.

They specifically use Roadhog as an example of an unpopular character.

2 Likes
58

Lol, I believe Hog is designed for DPS players forced to play tank for various reasons. I call Hog and others like him anti-tank – his scrap gun breaks barriers, his combo erases a barrier-less tank, and he’s a terror against squishies bold enough to get within hook range. He’s bad because Orisa counters him – and Orisa is ANOTHER ANTI-TANK in this game. I find this a funny state of affairs, but I’m not really that hung up about it because I just play the weaker tanks and just focus on having fun. :slight_smile:

59

It’s particularly baffling to me that Roadhog’s rework took over a year to implement and there was about an hours worth of actual dev work that went into it.

3 Likes
60

Over a year just for the hero to come out the other side with:

  • Less skill expression (loss of right click)
  • One new ability (that just gets used for his OHK combo and nothing else because it has zero other use)
  • A more frustrating breather (can no longer be really countered by stuns and now is only stopped through anti)

They quite literally managed to not only add new problems, but not fix ANY of the problems that existed before. He’s still too tanky with breather (except even more now than before), anti is still too much of a requirement / too much of a hard counter against him and he’s still too overly reliant on being able to one shot people for value.

Just incompetence, truly.

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61

I can’t take these statements seriously :skull:

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62

can we be a little real and say for like 85% of the cast being 10 hp out of position in front of a tank is basically still a death sentence

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