The passive role needs to be removed or at least nerfed
Maybe go to 3 seconds before activation, or be exclusive to supports with no way to self heals like kiriko/LW/mercy
But I think characters that already have high impact or sustain banefit more of it(Ana and bap)
I would try on a experimental some kind of cauterize from paladins or hat they tried on alpha
But adjusting the numbers
Maybe 15% less healing while being shoted won’t kill the support
I say that as a support masters
Why? Just curious as to the reason you believe this is a problem that needs addressing.
Supports have too much survivability
90% of my matches I play supports, and all of them I’m with the least deaths on both teams, I know that support don’t need all this sustain, just to focus on awareness
That’s not a problem, because for example moira and brig are not problems
But when you give it to problematic characters like bap and Ana they become immortals beasts
As for the cauterize, it is to encourage playing closer to cover, make healing tanks not painful out of combat, and at the same time not making players being healed so hard to kill
as a Support main: Nope
This passive is completely busted to have on characters that can already self-heal which is all of them in support roster. Force them to use self-healing abilities or heal each other if that is the role. Otherwise, give damage and tank roles self-healing abilities and passive too. I see no reason why this exact role suppose to have it exclusively while at the same time they have the same damage numbers as damage heroes on their primary. And, btw, speaking about damage role passive, which is not passive at all because it is conditional. Passive should be passive, not conditional like kill this and get “nothing?” “Reload buff, lol?” If that to be conditional then give it an actual value, such as “confirm a kill and get +5% damage until you die” Way too op? That is what I’m talking about with support current passive. So get rid of it or equalize damage roster passive with it in terms of value! Until then I increase the overpowered role’s q time and don’t play damage at all, role is 0 value atm compared to support.
Lw can heal himself now
So no
I have mixed feelings about this one. I’d say if they had like, a definite “off healer” and “main healer” category, that off healers usually have no ways to heal themselves or have minimal self healing.
“Off” healers would be Brigitte, Lifeweaver, Lucio, Kiriko, Mercy and Zenyatta. Low Self healing, higher utility in their kits.
“Main” or “Flex” Healers would be the others. Ana, Baptiste, Illari, Moira. More capability to do healing, self healing and damage.
Kiriko is that weird inbetween. She doesn’t have a self heal, her healing is high, but she also has utility. That’s why I put her in the off-healer for that specific reason. She’d just be a wonky case.
I’d say Off-healers having the regeneration and the main/flex healers not having it would be fine. But, I dunno. I’m still iffy either way. I feel like this’d still make them too vulnerable.
Supports in general has least deaths because they usually do not have to stand in los of enemy fire unlike the other 2 roles.
Start playing more dive-ish team comps and watch their deaths start to be similar to other roles.
If they have mobility or an escape, then I’d say take their self heal away. If they’re slow or immobile, leave it on them.
Though personally I’d rather a slight nerf to it in general; kicks in 1.5 seconds out of combat, but reduce the heal refill rate so they have to stay in cover longer to fully regen and it makes any 1v1 duel more fair.
That said, I would like to know how much more or less supports are dying than they did in OW1 before touching it.
I don’t agree with this since damage is just so high and supports still get harassed fairly often even by non dive character’s thanks to lifeweaver
No you don’t.
If you did you’d realise that the support passive being removed would cause serious problems in the game.
You’d be aware that newer heroes are not created with self healing abilities that can be relied on and will need to be rebalanced.
You’d be aware that it would force supports to save heir big cool-downs for themselves, making the teams experience worse and keeping fighting supports the same.
You’d realise we’d have to increase healing across the board to make up for this.
You’d realise supports would need more bloated kits because their buttons per minute has dropped drastically.
You’d have to find a way to get people to queue support now that most are just pressing one button for twenty minutes.
You’d realise all of this if you were a support main and not a support player.
You are most definitely just a support player, and one with no idea what the ups and downs of the role currently are.
But thank you for your time. And for proving that rank is no indication of understanding about balance.
not just that but the support passive means they can retain their cooldowns like nade and bap’s shift for their teammates or offensive pressure rather than just to stay alive. This was not the case in ow1
completely agree, the support passive is why supports are overtuned atm.
they buffed the passive at the start of release because no one wanted to play supp tho, flanking/pressuring supports was too oppressive and made the role completely unfun
maybe it needs to be tuned down? but not removed
Tanks already have the most broken passives. Less ult charge from shooting them, less boop, less cc, sleep lasts a shorter time. Give me a break.
As for self healing did mean like on Rammatra, Orisa, Junker Queen, Roadhog? All can restore health or armor?
Or did you mean like Reaper, Bastion, Mei, Soldier, Symmetra? All who can restore health, armor or shields?
You guys act like DPS and tanks don’t steal support abilities all the time.
From genji deflect, stolen from tanks to Symmetra ult stolen from tanks to soldier healing to junker queens shout.
The roles have always had crossover. Always.
Honestly remove it from every support other than Mercy and Lifeweaver. Zen has shield health anyway.
If we’re being serious Ana doesn’t need it. Bap doesn’t. Kiri doesn’t. Illari doesn’t. Moira doesn’t. Lucio doesn’t…None of them do.
That’d make only Ana, Brigitte and Zenyatta able to have the regen out of combat since they’re the only ones who have no mobility of any kind. (And even though it makes her rush forward, I don’t count Shield Bash as mobility)
I do agree that it’s a lot, but still. It’d feel… eh. The taking-longer-to-regenerate thing I’d agree with.
the only heroes who have truly no mobility are roadhog and ana
everyone else can either boop themselves, or has something that can be used for verticality, or a speed boost during an ability or their ult… just sayin. Even sigma has mobility tech
changing the passive for different supports makes it too confusing for new players and opens a whole can of worms for balance. Youd be better off just nerfing the passive across the board and then readjusting each individual support in the rest of their unique kit as needed
It would immediately put kiriko, ana and baptiste down a peg, and make the other supports a bit more relevant as a result, even without compensation buffs here or there, even though the whole role would be nerfed across the board. Heroes like mercy and moira would increase in pickrate because they can stay alive better
I guess by escape/mobility, I mean an actual “good” escape. GA, Fade, Teleport, Twirlyboop. I don’t count jumping directly up into the sky an escape, so Bap could keep his. And Lucio speed doesn’t move him away from danger as fast GA or teleport/fade, so he could keep his too.
So only Mercy, Moira, Kiriko, LW, Illari and any future support with a good escape would not have it.
But again, I think the passive makes sense for the role and really just needs re-tuning to make it a little more fair. Taking it from some and not others would not be ideal.
That passive is so irrelevant and people are still complaining
Aint no way you used Reaper’s self heal as a comparison for the self-healing supports have…
Thing is the support passive is useful but if you’re constantly being tickled, poor positioning or hard focused it never actually activates it.
You as support take less deaths because unless you’re playing someone like Moira, Lucio, Brig or even Illari (Not so much since she plays off angles primarily) who need to be mid/front range to be optimum you’re usually further back.
**I’m aware here lucio has escape but as someone who’s constantly helping relocate the team he has to be ‘closer’ to them so in that definition he’s mid range for example. He also doesn’t benefit iirc from the healing passive and only gets increased heals during amp it up. Same with moira. **
It doesn’t need removing but I do think it might and I say MIGHT benefit from some retweaking.
One example might be - It does a definitive burst heal of say x amount if you’re out of LOS for so long but only activates once every x seconds. (no more than 20% of your health once every 20 seconds per say. ) Enough to survive without you healing back to full but enough to reduce survivability.
I main support, have done since 2016 and I like it as it is but I’m also open to compromises. Same way I think tanks should blanket have a 50 - 75% reduction on cc effects and anti-heal but keep it normal for squishies.
E.g. Hog gets hit by sleep it’s like 1-2 second compared to say ulting genji where it’s full duration . Hog gets hit by anti-nade it’s only 25% as long and 50% effective so they receive half healing as say to squishies where it’s 100% effective and no healing.