If it’s the best one in the game, it shouldn’t be easy to use. We’re talking the longest stun in the game at 5.5 seconds.
Fine that it’s unique and all but if it’s too weak as an only self defense then it’s a tad wasted on her. She really doesn’t have much else by which to save or extricate herself out from a bad position. That’s my point here.
It’s not. It’s a skill shot. That does not make it inherently weak. It makes it mechanically demanding.
She shouldn’t be buffed any more than she recently was as being overall the most viable healer is more than enough, or the consensus will be to nerf her in less than six months.
sorry, but 2 shotting squishy medics fram afar with almost no penalty just aint ever gonna fly
And right you are. That IS the complaint. It’s a skill shot that is useful as an offensive tool but utterly woeful on efficaciously doing what it was meant to do…
In that regard and with consideration that it IS a high skill shot and in consideration that dive hard-counters her and that the size of the dive hero pool has nearly doubled since she boarded it’s not a very good disengage tool. Not by that measure.
It leaves her more defenseless than not.
I’m glad this discussion is finally coming up.
This damage boost discussion alongside bringing 80 dmg back is something to discuss and is a fair point to be made about it.
For damage boosts I would recommend they either remove it entirely or have it act a different way for Ana other than damage.
Reason I say this due to damage boosts not really working much for roles like Ana, Widowmaker, or a distanced playstyle from the team. You don’t often see Mercy risking it to fly across the map to Widow, so why would Ana be an exception if shes at a distance from the team.
It doesn’t really make sense for Ana to work off damage boosts as Ana is a sniper who works off the idea of carefully placing shots in a small window of opportunity. The farther you are from the team fight the smaller your window is. Dmg boost is also way too situational and too much of a crutch. In the moment a flanker jumps Ana, Ana can quickly be killed, but for her to be this playstyle where its smart to play at a distance on a sniper perch away from her team. It is important she has the neccessary sustain to suit this distanced playstyle.
Damage boosts is too situational and heavily does not belong in a snipers playstyle that is about consistency and carefully placing shots. A.k.a 80 dmg is better for her overall where as dmg boost is too situational and does not belong for roles like Ana.
Also no way you’re going to have two healers sitting in a corner; one dpsing and the other damage boosting the other healer. Who’s healing the team?
Considering that Ana is in a good spot now I don’t see it happening. Ana is only in a good spot because of Mercy falling but as soon as Ana starts having her weaknesses get the best of her she will instantly go back to being very weak.
Agreed. As soon as people realize that she’s not that difficult to counter they’ll start applying pressure direct on her because of her frailties. Anything you need to do to win, right?
Moreso the case now that dive is also seeing a return. She’s not a Mercy so she doesn’t get a “get out of jail free” card like Mercy has. As a matter of fact she can’t run away nor heal herself effectively. Further most dive heroes can put more pressure on her than she can put on them.
It’s just a matter of time before enemies get used to dealing with an Ana on an enemy team. The ability to peel isn’t as good these days as it was during the tank meta. That era’s gone.
So yeah. I agree. It’s only a matter of time ‘til she’s revisited again.
Not to mention she only really doing so well because Lucio is being played more and his aura range increase basically gives the fake passive healing Ana needs. I’m a Sombra and Ana main but I’ve so been playing Doomfist for awhile and Ana has no chance to survive against a guy like him. She’s a free kill with his ult.
I’m able to deal with Doomfist a bit as Ana only because I play him but still not everybody is going to have that knowledge so in the end the Ana is going to be forced to constantly switch.
I still believe Ana needs a small passive heals on top of that why hasn’t she received any voicelines when she gets attacked like all the other supports has gotten.
Yeah…its only matter of time…
I don’t want to sound so negative but its the truth.
I disagree. It works just fine defensively. There’s no reason a disengage tool needs to be a free get out of trouble button. Especially one like sleep dart that doubles with great offensive applications.
See, I do understand the problem some people might see with that, but I’m on the opposite side. I honestly believe Damage boosted Ana should be able to 2 tap enemies. To do this you’re either running Zen, in which case your whole team benefits from extra damage while sacrificing heals… or you’re running Ana and Mercy, to which your team now has no defensive ult. If we’ve learned anything from grav dragon meta, those are pretty import to run or you give the enemy a free team kill. The sacrifice being made to run it is more than justifiable.
And so you’re Perfecly fine with her being as defenseless as she is. That’s okay. That’s your opinion and I can respect that.
Me? I see her as a hero bringing a paper knife to mech fight. So I’ll side with her being a bit more balanced, a tad less being a brightly colored sitting duck and hopefully having something more than a plastic dart as her sole means of self defense.
If I see her on the enemy team I’ll immediately recommend two of my guys to go dive and make her life hard. It’s a built-in hole on the the enemy team. I’d be negligent not to pry it open.
Yeah fair point. Its 1 of the few reasons damage boost makes no sense for Ana, but consistent damage like 75-80 does.
but thats the thing…
The changes I suggest are to fix clunky aspects of gameplay, not straight game changing buffs or reworks. To balance & fix aspects of her kit.
Address her problems in her kit, not spam reworks at random.
Besides the range increase on nano that was actually a problem needing to be addressed – the new ultimate sucks. It does the opposite of what Ana is suppose to be. Ana is suppose to be high risk, but if the skill is there the player is rewarded.
All the new nanoboost does is conform to a “press button to win” type of style you see in Mercy rez, Reaper ult, Zen ult, Sombra ult, Lucio ult (etc)… Its very bad design for Ana. She doesn’t belong in that low skill scenario, and in general I think thats a poor way of designing the game to be just mobility, stun cc, and press q type of ultimate to win.
Its ok if her ultimate is not the best thing in-game, whats important is her playstyle / skill on her hybrid rifle w/ utility. Rifle damage & QOL changes need to be addressed and that will overall smoothen her gameplay out & fix her problems. Not all, but it will do a lot to help her without breaking the game.
I have to disagree. I’d say Ana was pretty good before the support changes (right after her ammo buff she became a lot more consistent and less punishing), she was just shoved out of the meta due to double sniper meta making rez more important than healing, and Mercy being to out damage Trance with Hanzo right click whereas Ana would have to nano or nade (which is much less consistent).
In fact, in Contenders when they got the hitscan buff patch + the release of Hammond + the sombra, they BARELY played Mercy and played much more Moira/Ana, even though the support changes weren’t live for them yet. It just shows how the meta change heavily favors different supports than Mercy. Also, the nano buff made her ult much more flexible and able to be used defensively, which is great!
I mean, she does have effective 300 health because of her nade, and if your team/second support peel for you properly you shouldn’t be dying to dives so much. It’s just like Zen, he has zero mobility and a huge hitbox, but when his Lucio/Mercy/Ana peels for him he suddenly becomes very hard to kill. And for what Ana lacks in damage (compared to zen) she makes up with in CC and a 100 extra health on a 10 second cooldown.
Its wanna say its a hard dilemma to think about, but for what its worth Orisa, Zen, and Mercy are the roles that can dmg boost, Mercy will 100% not go to damage boost you as it pulls her too far from the team while not healing for both supports, & Zen is situational, while Orisa is an ultimate & still situational.
I do agree a lot with your point and its very fair from that POV.
My 2 concerns are how Ana fits against Widowmaker in that scenario as shes sorta this 2 shot body shot or headshot type of role and comparing her to even some damage roles at that point. Its hard to think about if its fair or not to be honest. I am unsure.
but its not just like zen. Ana’s strength is suited at a distanced playstyle away & outside the team. Zenyatta & Ana regardless of hybrids are 2 very very different playstyles. The positioning of an Ana player is comparable to a Widow player. The positioning of a Zenyatta player is close to the team as a team dmg support. Ana is a sniper role w/ utility while Zen is a team dmg support.
A support is too busy front-line to peel for you, and often times it is 1v1 or 1v2 scenario that requires Ana to have strengths she needs to win if the skill is there.
She spends too much time wasted in a 1v1, wasting too much utility that was uncalled for, and is often forced to drop down from high ground toward the team. Ana needs the damage for sustain, use, & to suit that distanced sniper support playstyle.
If she is playing like a heal dispenser 2 feet from the tanks, there is obviously something very broken about her that forces her out of that distanced playstyle and I am looking at the inconsistency in her kit where majority of roles aren’t in the 1v1 scenario.
Lets be real, 2 sniper with Rein and Zarya was the perfect Meta for Ana. Nano worked great on rein, hanzo, zarya and even zenyatta or brigitte in certain situations. She got the change to shoot through full health team mates allowing her to put pressure on enemy widow from behind rein’s shield, if nano’s down you have anti to counter enemy zen. nade to boost your zen’s ult/brigs aura, and picks weren’t nearly as common with the amount of shields/armor/healing. You rarely saw anything die unless it was a team wipe. 2 sniper was basically a game of who can get grav+dragon first. Mercy just did the bare minimum easier. Damage boost and high healing. Res for the off chance something did die without grav/dragon.
Both nade and sleep are better used offensively. They always have been. If a flanker does manage to get you to burn your cd’s using them defensively, the team fight is already heavily in favor of the enemy. To compare Ana to Zen is disingenuous. The value Ana brings to her team is through that utility and clutch burst healing. That utility is also tied to her means of survival making every decision matter. The value Zen brings to his team is offensive utility with consistent, albeit low healing. Zen doesn’t need to worry about burning cooldowns and has the damage to defend himself, while still keeping the value he brings to the team.
I agree with this.
This is part of the design of utility having high value potential, but having its downsides.
In the same way her rifle damage has many disadvantages surrounding it, other aspects of her kit also do this. IMO that is the idea of balance when you have high value potential from her utility or rifle damage, but there certain drawbacks and things to exploit when it comes to Ana’s kit, & her rifle.
Widowmakers hook is strictly for mobility & sniper angles while she has 6 targets to dps. Ana has 11 targets & is a different story on what her rifle & utility is. How it works, how its strong, and how its exploitable. Ana is about pre-planning before things happen, decision making, and multi-tasking alongside positioning for 11 targets.
I think sleep dart is fine.
Yeah, im on board with this, if that’s what it came to. Do you feel like a movement or evade skill might also be a possible way to round out her kit instead, though? I’m thinking specifically of those moments when she has to play an extremely short game. i’ve always kind of felt like giving her more active defense was the better move, instead of just turning her into a dps