No it didnt.
Also it was not an exceptional case, we were all solo q in OQ and it also happened in RQ. If it was 2 3stacks, that would not happen due to the fixed cap.
Like I proved: The “RNG” factor is way worse in Solo Queue and consistency does offer way more advantages, even in “worst case scenarios” than solo queue.
You cant just make scenarios to justify that.
One might call failing to acknowledge that there is a good chance this was only implemented for Call of Duty… moronic.
Not me though…
Ultimately, the fact that the patents are specifically about CoD doesn’t matter. They still don’t describe the sort of rigged matchmaking that OP is complaining about. They’re completely irrelevant.
Well the bigger thing is - it literally does NOT matter.
The net impact even on the 1% chance that he is correct only about the use of MMR being used to match people of higher and lower skill level at the same SR together… the next impact is that someone will likely take a couple more games to climb than they normally would.
That’s what this whole post is about.
That is the entire net impact of the videos he has created.
This is what he is saying is illegal.
The rest about use of personal data is absolutely nonsense so I’m just ignoring that.
There isnt much more to say to you tbh. OW will continue to use mmr match making. You deserve a ban for spamming the same topic.
I wouldnt want a game with no match maker, I tried it in destiny and thought it sucked. The best players group up together and stomp everyone they come across. They queue matches all day and farm everyone into the ground.
Go play that if its what you really want.
Blizzard wants both sides to have a chance to win. If you think thats inherently “wrong” then this isnt for you. Thats only an opinion.
What didn’t? You said you were in a match with a 3300 SR player and a 1900 SR player on the same team.
The matchmaker doesn’t put ranges like that together except in the two circumstances I mentioned (if ever): people of disparate skills are queuing (so you get one player at 1000 SR lower than another and then the matchmaker needs to try to make a match out of that with others who are solo queueing), or no one on the server (so the matchmaker has to kludge a match together out of the few people who are available). And even then, you might not get such a crazy difference like the one you were reporting. You can say that’s some normal experience in solo queue, but I’ve played a ton of solo queue since OW launched and that is not a normal experience.
Sweet god yes, it is a huge topic right now. That and understandably, “computer says no” - straight up isn’t good enough the moment you bump into the courts ;).
You got to show your working in a way which humans can understand.
So, we project the data into n dimensional space, and apply a series of kernels to it, and then find a n-1 dimensional “plane” to slice between the groups… And just like that, you have lost the court case…
Sorry mate but you need to do your research because the MM literally is the only one who does that. If you create a 6 stack, you CANT do that because of the Fixed SR cap on a group. Thats how it works, stop spreading misinformation.
And no, its not a weird experience, it has been happening A LOT since RQ was implemented and it is way more prevalent since 2020. So yeah, claim stays 
PS: Any difference beyond 800 SR is “crazy” and that is a normal thing now.
Haha, yep. The training data is also usually embedded with unknown biases from the collection process (data is usually manually labeled by humans).
What you say is especially true for deep learning models, which are completely opaque models. This is actually my research focus, explainable AI for deep computer vision tasks. 
Again, though, there are only two reasons the MM would do this- either people are grouped such that it is skewing things (and I get what you are saying about the 1000SR limit difference, but the fact of the matter is that there are tighter controls than that in solo queue), or there simply are not enough people queueing in your region.
The 1000SR range is an expansion of what the matchmaker generally allows in order to allow players to group with their friends.
Wait, you’re talking about OQ- that’s point two I made above: not enough people play OQ in most regions to make a good match so the matchmaker has to do crazy things in order to get the queue to pop. That’s not a solo queue issue- that’s a tiny playerbase issue. That also explains why you have such a better experience in groups. OQ isn’t really going to be particularly functional in most regions without grouping. That makes a lot of sense now- it’s just not particularly applicable to people who aren’t playing OQ.
You need to update your information about grouping and how MM works, there is a talk in this very same forum. What you are saying was true in 2018, not now.
They increased the gap the MM will consider to start matches faster with RQ, because otherwise some people would experience outrageous queues. This was said when Jeff Kaplan used to work here.
Not a region issue, not a “weird hours” issue, not an issue at all. Play 10 matches solo queue in RQ and check the ranks, its not uncommon at all.
It isnt at the moment. You also have seen it, when there are not enough players in the queue. The time waiting IS a determining factor, the SR gap is not.
With a group, the cap is not even on a MM level, like the game literally tells you “unable to queue, SR too far apart”.
And no, its not OQ, I said this happened in both matches. The only difference is that in OQ you can see the stacks, thats it. Im not going to reiterate or repeat myself. My claim stays, proven true and verifiable in game anytime you want to do so.
Again - telling it like it is 
I play a ton of RQ. I just don’t see what you see. I solo queue all the time- I generally see a range of about 200 or so SR in my games. Sometimes people are grouping and things get skewed. But even then I’ve never seen something like what you describe- not in solo queue when playing RQ. I don’t play OQ though, so I’m sure that changes things.
Well, the matchmaking system in ow2 is going to take time to adjust because it rewards playstyles differently from one, what would be considered a good playstyle in ow1 might be throwing in ow2 but the matchmaker needs time to account for that and re-adjust elos.
Right now ow2 balances teams by taking their ow1 mmr and balancing it like it would an ow1 game, it’s not perfect yet because some people when transitioning from 1 to 2 might perform much better or much worse.
There’s no real fix for this besides time for player’s mmr to adjust to 2.
Technically you could add a system that moves mmr faster to speed up the adjustment process but that has issues of boosting players via win streaks or lowering players more than needed due to loss streaks.
Also, they said they have big plans for ranked and the first beta is more so just to test server stability more than anything else, mmr adjustments are probably on the backburner for now.
You might be right, but we’re not talking about logging off for the night, we’re talking about giving up the game entirely.
Exactly! Now what if your stompings were broken up by these better, closer games? In that pattern, a stomping probably wouldn’t even trigger you to take a break, let alone drop the game forever.
Even if you don’t think it’s present in OW, that’s how ‘engagement-based matchmaking’ works. It’s built around the same psychology that keeps gamblers playing - Win just enough that you don’t lose all motivation to play.
I wish I could say I found it myself. I actually stumbled across it in the Competitive forums and thought it’d get more visibility here.
There’s a few thing to consider here:
A truly unbiased matchmaker is effectively a coin flip. Because the chances of it being heads or tails is equal, there is a high likelihood that that there will be streaks of wins or losses over a large enough number of flips.
Let’s take the argument that losses are the main factor that leads to quitting. It isn’t that simple, but for the sake of discussion let’s say it is.
What if a person loses a bunch of games because the system is actually fair and balanced, but the stars just never align for them? The answer is that this person is at greater risk of quitting.
So how do you make sure they don’t quit? You have the matchmaker be a little less fair and balanced so that it’s more likely that their streak of negative experiences will end.
Conversely, if we’ve got a player who has recently had a bunch of close games and wins, they’re probably not going to be at risk of quitting if they get rolled over once or twice.
Without weighting, the key factor that decides whether a player continues or quits is chance. That’s a risky proposition for the developer/publisher, given how much investment they have in the product. Weighting improves the system’s ability to consistently retain players.
Dude they’re the companies patents. They’re not tied to specific games. What you think they obtain MMR patents and just not apply it to overwatch? I get there’s speculation in all of this but to think they wouldn’t use their own matchmaking patents is pretty moronic and you’re speculating just as much as op. OP’s speculation is more educated than yours. You’re just speculating what you want to believe.
you are an adult, get a life
The usual figure cited is that less than 5% of patents are actually used. The vast majority of patents are ideas that do not really go anywhere. I remember when people used to scour the patents that Nintendo filed to try to get a hint of what they were doing. There would be lots of speculative articles about new peripherals or their next console. But none of it would go anywhere, because the vast majority of patents do not go anywhere. (There was a really interesting interlocking screen patent, for instance, that looked pretty cool, but obviously they haven’t done anything with it.)
Well whatever system the matchmaker is using in competitive, I personally don’t mind it too much. What I have an issue is with the quality of quickplay games. To me, quickplay in OW1 is only enjoyable if you’re practicing new heroes or trolling. Trying to take quickplay seriously is asking for a bad time.
Competitive games on the other hand are a lot more balanced most of the time, even with this ‘engagement-based matchmaking’ manipulating my likelihood of wins, losses, and draws.
…
The only quickplay that’s tolerable to me are in games like Valorant where the matches are less team-reliant and more skill-based, allowing individuals to carry their whole team with ease. That’s possible in Valorant which is probably why I can keep playing their quickplay (called unrated) over and over again without tilting and closing the game.
Not “even with,” but ‘because of.’ MMR/EOM/algorithmic handicapping/Bayesian skill scoring…whatever you want to call it, it is designed to create the illusion of balance, and make every match as close as possible. It’s time for us to consider how that sausage is being made, because it’s being made with people.
I had a life. Overwatch and this thread have taken a great deal of it away from me.
You are right that it’s moronic, and he is actually being far more speculative than I am. The things he’s saying are not supported by evidence. Meanwhile, there is strong evidence of my assertions including not only patented details of invention for algorithmic handicapping but also developer statements EXPLICITLY AND LITERALLY confirming that it is implemented in Overwatch.
And now you have to waste our time too?
Thats evil