A GUIDE FOR THE DEVS: How to make all tanks viable and possibly more fun in 1-3-2

General Discussion
1

General Intro

Okay, so Jeff is thinking about implementing 1-3-2. While there are enough issues with this that I have added a bonus rant at the end, I am mostly interested in presenting actual ideas for making solo-tanking palatable.

A few tanks are already very close to being able to do this while still being fun, but a few are in need of major adjustments/rework.

Jeff has already toyed with the idea of moving RoadHog to dps, but I plan to come up with the best solution possible to keep that from happening.

Please keep five thoughts in mind as I present these ideas.

  1. As a lone tank with reduced shields, your job will rarely be simply providing shielding for your team.
  2. Your job is to create space and initiate team fights.
  3. If you do not have solid ability to survive during a team fight, either through mobility (like Winston) or endurance/sustain (Zarya bubble or Hog breather), you are dead in the water.
  4. If you do not have sufficient ability to outplay/deal with CC (Rein or Orisa shield/fortify), you are dead in the water.
  5. As the lone tank, there will always be extra focus, damage, and CC on you. Currently I count 8/16 DPS characters having CC.

Tank Specific Adjustments

Reinhardt

As the king of creating space and initiating team fights by moving forward, Rein only needs small adjustments to have more endurance and to be more threatening/intimidating.

  • 50 red health changed to armor
  • Firestrike cooldown reduced from 6 to 5

With less opportunity to build shatter off of other tanks, his firestrike cooldown needs to be adjusted to compensate.

  • Barrier Field added effect – alternatively, new passive: Unbreakable Will – 15% speed bonus while on cooldown (when broken)

This change has two-fold effects; one, it gives Rein more ability to either push forward/continue the engagement or back off/disengage, two, it gives enemies another dynamic interaction/decision when attacking Rein.

Winston

Winston has arguably the best ability to engage/start a team fight, while also having solid ability to outplay CC/absorb damage with his bubble. However, his presence is rarely threatening and he feels particularly flimsy.

  • 50 red health changed to armor
  • Jump Pack cooldown reduced to 5 from 6

As other tanks have become more mobile, these small changes help Winston strategically engage/disengage more effectively and often. The buffed Tesla cannon range/aoe allows him to be much more threatening and maintains the same ratio and cone-like shape

  • Barrier Projector added effects – alternatively, New Passive: Integrated Systems: Must be within 5 meters of the barrier (it must also not be broken)…
    • Tesla Cannon:
      • damage increased from 60 to 65.
      • Max range increased from 8 to 10 meters
      • AOE increased from 6 to 7.5 meter width

This change allows Winstons bubble to have another layer of strategy and added presence on the battlefield, making him more of a high priority/threat.

Wrecking Ball

While Hammy already has done well as a solo tank before, his susceptibility to DPS CC compounds with three of them guaranteed on the enemy team. Mei, Sym, and Sombra in particular will have an easy time completely shutting him down because he has no real shield to keep from being affected by them.

  • Adaptive Shield Adjustments/Rework:
    • Increased Temporary shield from 100 to 200, and bonus shield per enemy within radius reduced to 50 from 100
    • Cooldown reduced to 12 from 15 seconds
    • Duration reduced to 5 from 7 seconds
    • Additional effects when in use (not destroyed):
      • Full CC resistance (like Orisa)
      • Full hack resistance (like a shield)
      • Grappling Claw: Damage increased from 50 to 70 (when powered-up)
      • Pile Driver: Damage increased from 20-100 to 50-100
      • Quad Cannons: Rate of Fire increased from 25 to 30 per second.

This ability rework adds a lot of layers/dynamics. There is a small up-time increase via cooldown reduction. While the base layer of shield increased, full potential shield decreased from 700 to 500. With the added effects, Hammonds will have to decide when to deploy the ability - ie preemptively to block CC, or re-actively to have greater sustain in a fight. This still leaves plenty of outplay potential on both sides by bursting his shields down before stunning, etc. It also keeps with/adds to the theme of his shield being adaptive to every situation, rather than just the number of enemies he is around.

Orisa

She is very close to being a viable solo tank, but she is missing a small amount of mobility that will allow her to engage/disengage more effectively .

  • Fortify: damage reduction decreased from 40 to 35% and movement speed increased by 10%
  • Protective Barrier: Cooldown reduced from 10 to 8 seconds

Sigma

He is also very close to being a viable solo tank, but his vulnerability, both in health and beam-based CC, hurt his play-ability a lot.

  • Shield HP (not experimental barrier) increased from 100 to 200 for a total of 500 Health.
  • Experimental Barrier cooldown decreased from 1 to 0 when recalled (reverting original change)
  • Kinetic Grasp movement speed increased by 20%

These changes allow Sig to more effectively solo tank. The grasp speed increase in particular, allows him to absorb more damage effectively by moving into previously out of reach fields of damage. It also allows him to take more space or disengage more effectively. Reverting the barrier cooldown allows him to rapidly redeploy, which is very important when dealing with beam-based CC.

Zarya

Zarya typically has no ability to main-tank, but these adjustments can potentially make her viable as one.

  • Health increased from 200 to 300 (for a total of 500)
  • Particle Barrier (personal)
    • Health decreased from 200 to 150
    • Duration increased from 2 to 4 seconds
    • New Effect: When Particle Barrier is active and unbroken, speed bonus of 10%
  • Projected Barrier (friendly)
    • Health decreased from 200 to 150
    • Duration increased from 2 to 4 seconds
    • Ammo increased from 1 to 2 charges (think junkrat mine changes)
    • No speed bonus
    • Cannot be used on the same target for 4 seconds after duration or break

These changes allow Zarya to take more space via her personal speed bonus, second charge of friendly bubble, and increased bubble duration. The decreased bubble health is offset by the second charge, allowing her to gain a total of 90% charge if all three are fully broken, increased from 80% charge when just two were broken. The general increased health allows her to be more durable as a main tank needs to be.

D.Va

She is a tough case. Her new mobility allows her to rapidly reposition, initiate team fights, disengage, etc. However, without a second tank/shield, she has very little ability to outplay beam-based CC and Sombra in particular.

  • New Passive Ability: Energy Banks
    • When DM resource meter has been full for 2 or more seconds…
      • Immune to speed reductions and hacks

Honestly, I’m not sure this is the best solution, but I think I’m on the right path. If she is a solo tank without some form of full CC resistance, Mei, Sym, and especially Sombra will make her unplayable.

RoadHog

He is also a tough case, and Jeff has even toyed with the idea of making him a DPS character. Same as DVA, but more severe due to no DM, having no CC resistance makes him unplayable.

  • 50 red HP changed to armor
  • Take a breather adjustments
    • Cast time increased from 0.5 to 2 seconds
    • Speed increased by 10%
    • Also heals nearby allies for a total of 50 HP (think Bap’s regenerative burst)
    • Full CC immunity while casting

I’m not confident in these adjustments either.

Closing Thoughts

I do not think this is the right idea, but there certainly are ways to make it more enjoyable for the lone tank if it comes to pass.

Even after her nerfs to freeze, in a 1-3-2 situation, Mei’s Ice Wall becomes arguably one of the best abilities in the game. It can make more space than many tanks, cut heros off, and essentially let her play as a psuedo-off tank (which has been done in the past). As the only psuedo-off tank that I can think of, she will be a must pick on every team, every game. This concerns me greatly.

Please let me know what you think.

Bonus Rant

DPS players can get bent. I bet that even with 3 on each team, your que time only halves from like 10 to 5, but my tank que goes from 30 seconds to 5 minutes as well. I get it – there are far too many dps characters for 33% of the team comp, but the difference in que times is disproportionate even so.

Seriously you guys are trash /s (kinda)

4 Likes
2

Try 30 mins → 15 for DPS and instant queues → 2-3 min queue for Tank. Cry me a river hehe.

I like your changes tho. I’m all for making solo tanks into juggernauts. They will be more fun and more focused on their actual task. They are not shield bots but space creators.

Solid work

3

No matter how much change is made to the tanks there will always be that ‘one’ tank that every group wants and all other tank players will be harassed until they swap.
Sorry but there is no good reason to go 1 tank (for tank players or support players for that matter)

2 Likes
4

How is that different than any time playing Overwatch? This has always existed and is a community driven mentality. In most ranks it doesnt really matter, if you are good on one hero and trash at the meta hero you can provide larger impact on your skilled hero.

1 Like
5

It would be much worse, now If I say no it’s 50/50 if the conversation ends there.
If there is only one best tank (and there will be under 1-3-2 ) it will be 100% of the time the conversation will not be ‘hey soma switch off D’Va to a barrier tank’ “no” “ok” . It will be instead "Hey Soma switch off D’Va to <best tank> " “No” “report Soma for throwing!!!” and then get called trash etc. etc. etc. for not switching.

6

Dont balance the game around people being toxic. Thats not how you make the best product or experience.

Its going to be map dependent. If youre playing on gabralter then due to all the high ground you should probably play ball or winston over REIN. But that has always been the case, other than GOATS meta and double shield (due to the current balance). But that doesnt mean it is impossible to win with a REIN but it does get more difficult.

All heroes are not equal on all maps, nor should they be but people will always have their opinion and may share it in a toxic manor. But that doesnt mean we should sacrifice the other benefits for the actions of ragers.

The meta has always been dictated by TANK DUO. The tank/off-tank synergy has always been incredibly powerful and eventually forces many picks to no longer find the value they used to.

I’m all for a solo tank comp moving to live, but this doesnt mean that tanks will see less support. if Zarya, Dva and Road get moved to DPS, they will have less beef and self sustain but should still retain their ability to support the main tank.

So if the team is hard countering you on Rein, and everyone is asking you to swap off Rein bc you are getting hard countered, then how is that different than playing Monkey, right now, against a Mei, Reaper, Brig, Bap, Hog and Orisa comp?

Yes there is a strategy that may dominate the comp meta, but overall we should see better games. Don’t forget that we currently need as many tanks as DPS and SUPPORTS in each lobby yet like 15% of players (or less) choose to play tank. Not only does this increase queue times but this also creates wider skill rating gaps in ranked lobbies. Im high masters and often get 2 diamond tanks after waiting 25 mins.

7

There are 0 benefits to 1-3-2
Higher DPS queues (as tanks and supports quit)
Tanks stuck playing one specific ‘best’ tank or forced to quit.
Supports being overworked to the point they quit.

8

Solo tanks get buffed into juggernauts… you know… actual TANKS.
DPS queue times are cut in half, even with off tank players swapping to DPS. Sorry this is just facts.
Supports can now take more duels and not solely focus on keeping large meat bags alive. Also less shields.

Before role lock we had mostly 1-3-2 but that system also allowed for players to swap ROLES during a match even tho we see NOW that most players have a large disparity between ranks of their off roles and main role.

No more people swapping to support bc we have 4 dps, but that person swapping only has 5 hours on supports total. That exists and was common before role lock.

1 Like
9

+1 for trying and looking to be optimistic about the possibility of 1-3-2.

However, i had mentioned this in another thread:

That said, it would be a very big undertaking insofar as balancing and adjustments goes if we go solo tank and one, which i think that the OW Dev Team is currently ill equipped to handle, much less achieve.

Also, in the end, if i do continue playing the game, which i am unlikely to do if OW goes 1-3-2, i will …

Soma is probably right about this.
Tanks would be ganked like crazy in 1-3-2 and the team with the better DD players will definitely win but that is what the other half of the player base wants, right?
Meanwhile, whatever tank players are still left playing in the game would be forced to play the “meta” tank to cater to the DD players and not have fun. I foresee that only barrier tanks would be wanted … despite the other 5 players not using it (the barrier). So tanks like Hammond, monkey, D.Va… either get sidelined as tanks or moved to DD category…

In the end with the reduction of Tankers, queue times pretty much ends up similar to as it is now or in fact, become worse as there are more players queuing for DD & Support.

Only benefit is that the last few Tankers left playing the game (not me, for sure) would have near instant queues.

10

Oh I’m sure even my very large amount of patience would be tested to the point I would quit. It’s bad enough now being a D’Va player, can just imagine what would be like if was only 1 tank.

11

Unless we are looking at MMORPG level Raid Bosses, Tanking would be really crappy in 1-3-2.
I had been there prior to 2-2-2 and that is why i was lackadaisical in playing QP, much less Competitive mode games.

Honestly, just look at who enjoys playing the Yeti in Yeti Hunt?
It really is so much fun to be ganked by 6 players.

Yeah, that is how it is gonna be for Tankers when we go back to solo tanking and this time it is worse. Previously, if i got sick of being ganked, i can switch to something else. Now, i am stuck as the punching bag. No, thank you… =(

12

no

13

Yeah, feels bad to be ganked… no matter what.
But hey! DD and Supports would all point to the instant queue times and say, quit whining!
Yeah, i would stop whining by quitting! =D

14

except (using WoW as an example) 99% of those bosses need 2 tanks.

15

Yea but this also was an environment where we could have all tanks or all supports or NONE OF EITHER. Also in this system those that swap onto roles can be much less skilled in that role. Inspect everyone you see today when playing comp. Out of all the people with public profiles, count how many people have the same SR ranking between all roles. Now do the same for those who have large disparities in ranking between roles. The latter is much more common but was never accounted for prior to the 2-2-2 but WILL STILL be accounted for in 1-3-2.

I dont want any plat healers in my masters tank games tyvm. That was far more stressful than not having an offtank OR having an offtank that should be in 3 ranks below the lobby

16

Well, Mr. Kaplan mentioned that his WoW games needed only 1 …

But Yeah, heh. We will just have to see how it goes…

17

You bring 2 tanks with you into 5 man dungeons? Are we talking about teams here or raids?

I said juggernaut tanks not mini-raid bosses. No one wants a raid boss

18

the specific quote was MMORPG raid bosses. Not dungeon. Dungeons yes were one tank, raids was two.

19

What is “Hubris” for $500, Alex?

20

Well, basically Soma was kinda agreeing with my exaggeration that solo tanking in 1-3-2 requires a Juggernaut i.e. mini-Boss to be a Raid Level Boss in MMOs to be “viable”… no offense, Herdinstinct =)