A skill shot kind of gets countered by the way avoiding LOS removes it. Tanks are also more likely to be in the open taking space making them still the most valuable target.
How about a fair cooldown to reapply discord that way the placement timing is important.
You would have to place discord as a finisher rather than an initiator since them going behind cover would make it go away.
Or rework it so it just isn’t anti-tank from 5 sources of damage. It’s a risky design for 5v5.
The time to kill in the game is already too fast and losing one team member can cause a fight to be lost.
So basically make zen useless. He would need a much bigger rework for him to be equally as viable as other support roster, since he doesn’t have that much healing besides his ult. And he lacks self-sustain because of his large hitbox and slow movement. His self-sustain comes from killing, so if that gets nerfed, that would do him no good.
Phelps is saying this would raise TTK. You two are agreeing.
I’m not really fond of the skillshot idea personally. Zen’s survivability is balanced around the debuff being guaranteed on his attackers. A skillshot would be too hard to land on heroes like Tracer, Genji, Sojourn, Kiriko and probably even Moira, and they’d likely dumpster him.
If discord has to be nerfed, I’d rather just nerf the debuff value then compensate by increasing Zen’s personal damage and projectile speed.
Im honestly tired of the ability myself. it is just as abusive as WoW hunters marking a player. I would ALWAYS get targetted in WoW Battlegrounds and it is the same problem in this game. TIRED OF IT.
Ooooh! I like that! And we can do the same for Harmony Orb as well. We could even attach it to our Orb Volley kind of like how you can attach Sonic Arrow to Storm Arrow! And then maybe revert back to the 3 second LoS downtime to compensate? Actually… never mind, Zen doesn’t even need that.
Like, in all seriousness, this is a very, very extraordinary cool idea.
Also, that’s my line.
ahem
Discuss.
Edit: (btw do you mind if i steal this idea for my Mid-Season Patch wishlist? )
Absolutely scorching hot take. OW has one of the longest TTKs in the actively played FPS space–if you think OW has a fast TTK, don’t play CSGO or Valorant.
Obviously those games are examples of high TTK… I was talking about compared to like paladins and overwatch itself. For 5 players people die too quickly and there is too much healing that would cause a conflict if only damage were nerfed. People get healed up too quick and this game has too much burst damage the second you peek.
Including one shots. Discord orb exacerbates that.
Not sure how Overwatch has one of the longest ttk’s when you can solo 2 tap someone from a range in like a second. Apex fights are a lot longer due to self shielding and such.
Compare the two on youtube and look at how fast people die in overwatch.
They just ignore the tank and 2 tap on Cass or hanzo headshot a squishie.
The only heroes that actually live as long as they should are reaper/mei.
That should be the norm probably, with less heals.
Too much healing is why TTK is the way it is (and you seem to know this). If you have less healing you can actually calibrate damage properly–too much healing and you either delete the DPS role from the match or get instantly exploded when that healing isn’t available.
Discord doesn’t affect many one-shot HTK thresholds. 25% more damage is absolutely a deterrent from just rolling down Numbani mid with no plan, but it isn’t an instant death sentence like everyone claims it is.
I meant that discord exacerbates the time to kill issue we already have across the spectrum with the damage in this game, not one shots. (Hanzo rapid fire killing tanks, cass hammer, lots of stuff) Throw a discord on and you essentially ruin 5v5. Your tank takes 25% more damage from all sources than their tank.
For how little value it takes to use it, it is indeed too much as an initiation ability. It was fine in 6v6 when there was a tank to replace the dead one and people eventually removed him from the fight. It could be better if it were used more like echo lazer, to kill confirm via cooldown or hp amt restriction.
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