A role lock game where one role sucks isn’t a guaranteed loss in the lower ranks. Players there are not skilled enough to capitalize on glaring weaknesses like that.
I’ve won more games in RQ than I ever won in OQ.
As a Lucio shot caller. Think about that for a second. Lucio fits into pretty much every team comp.
Top 500 players often talk about things relative to their own skill level, and the rank they play at. It’s the same for players at GM and Masters. The game is played so differently from Bronze - Plat.
While it’s true that team composition isn’t nearly as important as players think, Role Queue is absolutely necessary in the lower ranks. People in the lower ranks are not skilled enough to make 0/5/1 work, because they simply don’t have the necessary teamwork and knowledge to make it work.
I don’t want to babysit five players who all think they’re going to be the MVP, and actively play the game like it’s TDM.
Each possible team size is a want, actually, so i am unsure why the attempt is being made here to say that only 6v6 is a want, when 5v5 is equal in this respect
That said, the need is that there has to be at least one teamsize, but it need not be 5v5 or 6v6
I accept and understand that some players prefer the excessive queue times, stale metas, absence of flexing, unnecessary restrictions, and other severe issues that 222/122 inflicts upon the game
I accept and understand that you think the absence of flexing is somehow significant enough at the lower ranks to matter at all.
Again, Role Queue is absolutely necessary. If players wanted to play other roles, they would. Role Queue allows for more niche heroes to be viable in an environment where it would otherwise be throwing because you’re not bringing any value to your team.
Stale metas are a balance issue, not a format issue. See: Dive Meta prior to Brig’s release, GOATS meta post-Brig release. Excessive queue times are a result of role population imbalance, and OQ doesn’t solve that problem. It simply has people reluctantly switch to a role they’re not comfortable playing. This is less true at Diamond and above, but below Diamond it’s absolutely true.
The only premise to make OQ work is that everyone should have equal power. Yes it is impossible, but OW was never perfectly balanced anyway. Thing is, the devs should have tried to balance the heroes/new characters in that way. But they instead have encouraged synergies between roles.
People at first just enjoyed diverse gameplays and played whatever character they wanted, and had fun. Few people cared about teamplay or composition.
But it seems the devs, WoW people, had very strong preferences and wanted to educate people what is real fun, like well-organized teamplay, gettin’ synergies between roles, counterswapping and etc.
That’s the real reason why OQ didn’t work imo. The devs just allowed OQ, but they never cared about it and encouraged RQ by balance adjustment and new characters.
This makes no sense when you are literally posting on a 6v6 post. Do yant 3-2-1 or do you want 3-3 or do you want 4-2 ?
We want 6v6 to excell and the only that is happening in the most balanced mode is 2/2/2. Anything other than that is just a waste of time.
I am sure the 6v6 community did not wait since 2022 for Open que 2.0
Here - insta one shot dps wins. Soldier gets visior and nano. Nice 6v6
How excatly - that easy to say. Why dont you give us idea how exactly it could work ?
Tell me why I should tank when I have to fight a genji or tracer who is going to easily diff me on my Rein ?
Tell me why i should tank with equal power and face a Pharah who I cannot do anything as a melee tank.
I am not reading the rest as what you said holds no weigth. We cannot tank, neither heal or dps if everyone has equal power. We all need to be strong in certain areas and weak in certain areas. That is what made overwatch the game it is now.
A tracer is only as good when there is no Cass in red team.
A pharah is only as good when there is no solider in red team.
if everyone was equal power the most broken heroes will excell.
Widow then only does 300, and armor/ shields gives you a threshold to survive.
Soldier nano could kill everyone but can the 6 team of dps since they can output far more damage, and if they are running sym/torb then, it was 2 cp, where the enemy has to come into the point to contest and guess how many turret are there?
Are you even reading my post or just having a knee jerk reaction because it was simply 6 dps?
Yes flex play does occur at all levels of play, unless its a 222/122 match, where flex play isnt possible at all
Again, 222/122 isnt needed
At all
It is important to understand the difference between a need and a want in many aspects of life…and no matter how much one really really really really wants something, it remains a want, not a need
Choice of character is never throwing
If it were throwing, the characters in question would not be available to be played
There are characters that are weaker or stronger than others, but all of them are viable
Every single one
Not at all
Because 222/122 severely and unnecessarily limits possible team compositions. This means fewer metas are possible. With fewer metas, the ones that are available become stale sooner
Not at all
Excessive queue times are caused by 222/122
In the absence of 222/122, excessive queue times simply dont occur
No one is ever required to play a given role in role-less queue mide
There are other arrangements that are both possible and feasible, and not a “waste of time” at all
If i were to pick an arrangement that most closely approxinates a “waste of time”, itd be 222, as that mode has already been tried and has already failed
Your opinion is noted, but regardless of how sure you personally are, it remains speculation…no more than a guess
I want to hear your suggestion as to what mode you think ? I am really curious. You say anything other than 2-2-2 but you are not telling us the mode lmao
The absence of flex play at the lower ranks is not significant enough to matter. Someone who’s in Gold as Damage or Support is extremely unlikely to be any higher than low Plat on Tank.
Again, 222/122 is necessary.
Mate, just stop. This is Overwatch we’re talking about here. The difference between a need and a want isn’t relevant here.
So you’re going to take everything literally, despite knowing full well what people mean when they say something is a throw-pick?
Stale metas happen as a result of balance, not format.
Except it just doesn’t. It limits possible team compositions, yes, but not severely.
No, they’re caused by an imbalance in role population.
In Open Queue, excessive queue times don’t occur but the caveat is that you end up with team comps comprised almost entirely of dps as a result of dps being the most popular role. Not all heroes fit neatly into every team comp like Lucio does.
Except that’s not entirely true, now is it? A team comprised of 6 dps is going to find it near impossible without all 6 of them working as a team, which almost never happens below Diamond, to overcome a balanced team comp.
Open Queue is, and always has been, impossible to balance.
It’s impossible to make every hero equally as powerful as the next. How do you make Lucio as powerful as Reinhardt without completely breaking the game or destroying what makes Lucio fun to play? Put simply, you can’t. It isn’t possible.
This isn’t 2016 anymore, and I think that’s something people need to learn to accept.
There’s no perfect balance and we also had dive, moth, goats, double shields, rock paper scissors and etc. and they were all broken as hell. What I said is NOT the perfect balance. OW never achieved this no matter it’s OQ, RQ, 6v6 or 5v5. What’s important is whether the devs just try to make it work, and they didn’t for OQ. It’s that simple.
Also, I think the devs should NOT fear to delete characters when it makes the game worse. Characters are no different than 5v5 or some other patches. They could revert it when something goes wrong. Most of those broken metas often come from one character indeed.