I agree, but the chips are down right now, so people are sorta looking for any way to improve Overwatch. I think we should try a Moba-lite mode and see where that gets us.
While I’m on the topic, you know what else is bizarre? Overwatch has a role system, yet it uses modes best seen in games where everyone has equal kill potential. For example, Payload works the best because it accommodates roles the best. But 2CP is annoying due to forcing teamwork. In Team Fortress 2, teamwork is little more than a polite suggestion for everything but coordinated pushes, so players feel like they each have more impact.
Same with Push. I hear Splatoon has a similar mode, but it also has a variety of mechanics that make the mode more bearable. Like fast traveling to your teammates when you respawn. Overwatch couldn’t handle that because tanks fast traveling to the front line after death would absolutely break the mode.
I really think a Moba type mode would help the game because it would take advantage of a team oriented role system. It’d feel like a mode made to fit Overwatch instead of a mode lifted from other games, and done worse.
ya as much as people cried about various metas, they actually got rid of huge sustain issues and shield issues.
Like for majority of the ladder the game was pretty good, its just it all came too late and playerbase left.
If they did that during goats meta the game would have been much better and retained a lot more players.
Regarding support the key issue is they need to powershift the utility power, zen cant get meaningful survivability as long as he has team discord.
same for ana with anti nade.
if they can be allowed to gut team value of discord anti nade rez imf then they can actually open up supports to be a lot more fun in a self centered way.
Well, to ego out a bit. I did think it was interesting that I posted a “You should have a PVP OWL Beta, and this is how to do it” and then a week later they announced that’s they were going to do. Granted, I knew that they were going to have a meeting with the OWL team owners just before I posted it. But it does help to have a “Hey, why can’t we do this?” as an example for those OWL owners to point to.
Heck, even the Orisa picture I grabbed , the tip of that energy blade kinda looks like a spear. And “Spinning Attack that blocks incoming projectiles” was something I wanted to give Hog.
IF hog had that along with hook people would be malding even more now, would have looked lit with midas skin though, but its really cool to see those changes, esp how much forum guys like you can see the upcoming problems, like you had nerfed widow and hanzo in that, yet here we are still talking about widow being op, like i dont get why they thought she needed 200 hp, i know it from playing widow 200 hp is so extra you often survive with 10-15 hp and pick one more, this was even back with 6 players.
Blizzard released Overwatch early just so the game couldn’t gain traction.
Bad game.
Never heard of it.
Another one I am unfamiliar with, but had heard of it.
Issue with publisher/development studio. Now a game again on steam under another name. Though, as I played quite a bit of Paragon the first go round, it’s a Smite clone and nothing like Overwatch.
OWL league is the root of 5v5. Blizzard “put the cart before the horse”… “put all their eggs in one basket” whatever adage you want to use… they over invested in an “e-sports” league where they thought the success was a forgone conclusion.
Turns out… the league is suffering and hemorrhaging money/viewers/sponsors.
So before the launch of the actual PvE portion of OW… they made a rash decision to change the game to 5v5. Why?
Because they knew if they didn’t make a drastic change before this season of the Overwatch League, the viewership and sponsors would continue to decline to the point of where the league would fail. You think they released OW2 early just for the players? No lol.
They did it for the people who they convinced to drop $20 million on for each league, because those people weren’t seeing a good enough return on their investment… and they had to do something to show those investors “hey your money is worth, just stick around and see!”
I’d argue that the playerbase they have, is far more “Shooter game” focused than a lot of people would like to admit.
And that the idea that 66% of the players on a team should want to have a sedentary non-aggressive playstyle, was never going to work long term.
They fixed most that by making Tank more desirable to “Shooter game players”.
Now they just gotta do the same for the Support Role. With Kiriko being a good start on that.
As for that. Yup. Yes. But if they could be leveraged to get the PVP community to not have to put up with years of more content drought. Great.
What we have is scuffed, but very fixable. And I wouldn’t wanted to have waited for a highly polished release.
Also if anything, I’m just waiting for Microsoft to take over, since aside from being rushed, you can tell that Bobby Kotick is giving them the absolute minimum budget.
My point is that the mesh of MOBA and FPS isn’t really what I see game crraterors go after. The aforementioned Smite and formerly Paragon are/were just 3rd person MOBA’s. If you made them top down they would be exactly like League or DOTA.
Outside of Battleborn I don’t think I have seen a developer try to really mesh the two together. From what game play I saw of Battleborn they did a good job in half the combination and a seriously bad job in the other half. So bad, I don’t think Overwatch not stealing their thunder would have saved it.
The way I see it, here’s a spectrum of FPS Mechanics to MOBA Mechanics.
CounterStrike
Unreal Tournament
Call of Duty
Valorant
Rainbow 6 Siege
Apex Legends
TitanFall 2
Halo Infinite
Splitgate
Team Fortress 2
Starsiege: TRIBES
Hawken
Dirty Bomb
Gundam Evolution
Overwatch 2 <--------------
Overwatch 2017
Paladins
Overwatch 2022 <--------------
Bleeding Edge
PlanetSide 2
Paragon Reborn
Battle Born
HyperUniverse
Awesomenauts
Smite
League of Legends
DotA2
World of Warcraft PVP
So when I hear stuff like “Oh you just wanna make it exactly like CoD” it kinda makes my eyes roll.
Ditto for when people insist Overwatch Roles need to follow DOTA/LoL/WoW guidelines.
It’s almost on par with saying “One less Tank, and the game instantly becomes CounterStrike”.
If anything hurt OW2 it was the fact that the devs didn’t spend enough time reworking a majority of the cast to fit the 5v5 role format. This is why some heros are awkward in it. This is why there are still hard counters. ETC.
Tanks as a role were already imbalanced in OW1. We can look at the most complained about tank right now (Hog) and a majority of the things that make him strong are hold overs from OW1. The major buff he got in the transfer was control over his whole hog. Which is still a pretty impactful buff. But still not OW2’s fault the hero is the way he is. Tanks are perfectly capable of being balanced to get out of the RPS it’s currently in.
I am a support main. No. Support as a role is largely fine thanks to the passive. Thinking we need CC to live is just a silly notion that has never been true.
Mirror fights have always been boring to watch. This isn’t an exclusive thing to OW2.
Tank que times are long for the same reason DPS ques are long. People enjoy playing those more than support.
Off tanks are not a thing anymore and people will accuse others of anything regardless because it’s easier to blame someone else than criticize your own gameplay.
Should we not at least set perimeters on what classifies as both a MOBA or a First Person Shooter?
To me, the staple of the MOBA is to create a character build, based on amount of currency gained throughout the match which you must purchase in a centralized location. In addition, the win condition must be to destroy a final Non-Player Character objective.
This is the League of Legends and DOTA blueprint that all other MOBA games have attempted to emulate. Whether that be Smite with third person, or Heroes of the Storm with terrible balance and another attempt for people who only want to deal damage to hijack the properties which define the game. In HOTS case, it was what destroyed it.
Then to what degree do we consider First Person Shooter mechanics. I will not concede that a game where you have cross hairs in the center of your screen is an FPS. Ark: Survival Evolved is not an FPS. Thief is not an FPS. Star Trek On Line is not an FPS. They have the same qualities as many of the games you listed. Just because you have the ability to shoot something doesn’t make it Call of Duty.
Now the last comparison I made between Overwatch and Call of Duty I specifically said that if the damage numbers get increased any more, and the tanks get less defensive structure, we will be playing nothing more then Call of Duty with Borderlands characters. To be honest, I stand by that comparison. No matter how hard Blizzard goes into trying to balance the game, everything always dwindles down to damage, and how much can be applied by whom. Look at the next iteration of changes. Hog, who I will always say isn’t a tank, will be getting his damage reduced in some manner.
Why?
Because Blizzard can’t increase the defensive capabilities of the tanks any more then they already have or damage players will cry. Reinhardt had a 2000 hit point shield for years. You know what the constant was? You could lose as Reinhardt with a 2000 hit point shield. It didn’t make him immune to death, and it didn’t guarantee a win for his team. But, (and I can’t make the annoying voice I want to with typing) “HuR dUr, I just doesn’t want to shooty shooty shields all day. It makes my tears cry tears, and all my Hard Work of hitting the Q button may not get my epic killz for Play of the Game” “How does I GG EZ at people when I spend 30 more seconds a match trying to counter playz the shields”. I am sorry but that ____ is the weak ____ whining we have heard for years. It didn’t work in 2017 and we lost a huge amount of Mercy players. It didn’t work in 2018 when Bridgette was nerfed, and it didn’t work in 2019 when the tanks were nerfed.
The game hemorrhages players because Blizzard thinks that balance is making the game more fun for damage dealer players. This has never worked…oh wait, it has. In Call of Duty, and Destiny, and Doom, and Valorant, and Counter Strike. It works when there are no tank or support players to piss off. And that’s all Blizzard does anymore, piss off tank and support players. They balance their game like ____, then expect everyone to grin and bear it when they play the role that gets least amount of love.
The only thing I was wrong about in Overwatch “2” was that a few tanks would be way more fun they they were in Overwatch Original. Mostly due to the 5v5 format. Too bad all those tanks suck huge ______ ____. They made 1 of them good, for a week. This was too much for damage players to deal with so to the forums we go.
Ever since Blizzard was stupid enough to give Mercy invulnerably as a buff to end all buffs, the developement decisions seem to be drawn from a hat at this point. Make it a MOBA style or straight Call of Duty clone. But do SOMETHING, because what they are doing now will not work in the long run. And 5v5 doesn’t fix ____, it just shifted where the real problems existed to begin with.