Unable to improve/not seeing your own mistakes

General Discussion
18

I tend to watch replays several times to focus on one aspect each.

  • Usually I check team decisions first (obj, give obj, hard push, boss calls). It helps me for the following aspects.
  • Vision. I start with only enemy side, then ally’s side. By now I can do this step with the above at the same time.
  • Positioning. Again, I do it for both sides.
    All that while looking at Mana, Fountain CD, Strong CDs.

Then I round it up one last time to verify my assessments. Also, Wins are good replays to analyze too.

Edit: Melee Assassins are a tough deal. You could test out other roles, not to switch over, but it can help adjust some behaviors. For example, playing Ranged Assassin can not only show you how ranged enemies try to target you with respect to ability ranges, and help have a less aggressive posture, which can be translated to a healthier one for melee assassins. Or healers can tell you why you were out of reach of a save. This is your call though. Not everyone likes to flex out.

19

Maybe watching stream can help. Watching how they play, their timing, where they go at x time on x map and stuff

20

Am I the only one that generally doesn’t watch replays? I usually only do so unless I argue with somebody over conflicting experiences of what happened in a game. Otherwise, I generally know why a game goes wrong.

I would say as someone who used to watch him and got so much better when I ignored his advice, stay FAR away.

That’s the thing that people don’t seem to realize especially when so many mediocre players will constantly stress not dying or thinking that soaking (the least skilled and easiest thing you can do) is also the only thing they can do to help win.

To the OP: you seem to be almost exclusively picking melee assassins. Which is of course fine, but they do require a bit more finesse in terms of knowing when your attack windows are to maximize damage without putting yourself in too much danger.

Have you tried other roles? It could be just that you suck at them, even though I’m a master level healer, I’m probably gold level melee assassin.

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21

Lots of experience.
Stay mindful of your actions, don’t get tilted or too wrapped up in something that you just start sending it down mid without even realizing you’re effectively throwing.

If you’re the one dying a lot try hanging back a bit, even if no one else is getting on the point you running in and dying isn’t exactly helping your team unless they can mop up afterwards.

When something doesn’t work, just analyze the situation. Learn to play to the strengths and weaknesses of every hero and try to get a good read on the other players, keep track of who is more aggressive or passive, the skilled and fast reacting players vs the dude who keeps missing their skillshots.
Think of it more like a strategy game than an action game.

22

Have you tried other roles?

I’m a healer main. I used to play with a friend group but ever since that kinda fell apart, I only play with one other friend, so I started picking up ranged and melee assassins. I’ve also tried tanking - I can only kinda tank with Mei, the rest is… Hopeless in my hands lol.

If my winrate is anything to go by, I’m okay with Cassia, Lunara, Kerrigan and Valeera. With other roles it’s mainly Auriel and Mei, bruisers are… Not my thing. I wanted to learn Yrel, but yeah, that didn’t work out.

23

Yrel’s a tough one to get a grip on if you’re not versed in the Bruiser ways to begin with.
Taunt Varian is a decent introduction to bruisers. Technically a Tank but due to his lack of general CC and focus on single-target elimination and dueling I still consider him more of a bruiser than anything.
[T2120034,Varian] is a pretty fun build. Take Shield Wall if they have a lot of burst but otherwise Warbringer+Juggernaut help you secure kills with more damage and since you keep W charges you get more burst out of Overpower.

Bruisers are a funny thing. Not quite tank, not quite melee assassin, but still plenty beefy enough and can dish out enough hurt to be confused for either.
Each hero has their own unique approach to the roll. Some are more capable of peeling divers off your backline that others but I’d say it’s probably best to consider yourself an independent agent from your team. You look for opportunities to dive in and you take them, you can’t take the same kind of heat a tank can so don’t go jumping into a backline if they haven’t been spending their cooldowns yet, but you definitely have more leeway to pounce on people than a Kerrigan, Butcher or Illidan do.
You want to confuse and split the focus of the enemy team up, much like a tank. But you can’t be the sole focus of aggression like a tank can. Aside from cases like Yrel the main difference between bruisers and tanks is that the threat you generate isn’t from the CC you dish out or eating skillshots so your squishies don’t die, it’s the potential damage you can deal. The enemy team will be forced into split second decisions of dealing with you or the backline, and that’s generally the moment you’ll be wreaking the most havoc. A team that can’t focus on a target generally can’t secure kills, given the amount of sustain in this game.

24

For me, it isn’t necessarily about what went wrong, but what I can do better. I use it a lot to check my positioning, use of CDs, and how well I am manipulating vision. Being able to see a part of a match from the enemy perspective helps me know if I am showing too much, or being too obvious in rotations.

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25

It takes time to learn the mechanics of a hero to the point where your brain is not thinking about “which buttons to press” but instead “what to do next”, to a point where you can think with a cool head, know the tools at your disposal perfectly and how far they can take you.

Think of it like driving, the first time you drive, you hit the brakes too early and drive too slowly because you don’t understand the capabilities of your car, and your situational awareness is low because you’re too focused on the mechanics side of driving. Once you become used to the car, you start projecting your mind outside the car a lot more and can react a lot better, and the car becomes an extension of your “mind” or “hands”. It should be the same with the heroes.

I have been playing so much Whitemane recently and tried to play 1 game of Medivh in between, but I kept trying to drop my E (the searing lash for WM) on minion waves with Medivh, which was essentially opening useless portals just in front of me. Point is: I was completely focusing on the action (clear wave with E as I would on WM but would drop portals), and that’s kind of where you want to be with heroes, especially fast one such as Valeera / Qhira / Maiev.

You need to know your kit so well it becomes second nature, and then you are looking for “outcomes” not thinking about which button to press next and if it is going to work or not.

It will take a lot of failure to understand the kits. I play of them by the way (Qhira / Val / Maeiv), with Qhira at level 90 or so.

With all of that said, my recommendation is to give yourself at least 10 games with the hero (all played back to back), using the standard build, to make sure you gave yourself enough time to appreciate the hero. Don’t switch too much when learning. If you have the hero at level 10+, then you gave it a serious try but usually not before.

26

People won’t rip you apart if you’re humble about it. If you preface your comment like, “I’m bad” then they’ll simply give advice. The only times replays are ripped apart is when someone boasts that they’re so good at the game or that their teammates are dragging them down and then you watch them play at wood league level at best.

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27

I get it. I reckon that if I did watch my replays, I would of course inevitably learn something. The fact that you can’t do instant replay is annoying too. I just feel like, eh, I’d rather use that time to play another game lol.

For me, knowing what went wrong, allows me to be better, and if I already got that from the game, there’s not much I get out of it by going through it again, especially because of the efficiency to educational value ratio is.

But I guess I’ve always had like a natural talent to be able to see these kinds of things in real time. I ran a pvp guild in wow and my very skilled guild mates would often miss out on subtle and not so subtle mistakes when we were evaluating recruits. I also don’t really hesitate to say when I messed up.

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28

Man, I miss when the RBG ranks actually meant something. My WoW guild does both Mythic raiding and RBGs, so I am kind of used to going over logs looking for areas for improvement.

29

Does anyone know if it’s actually “okay” to post a replay on that replay analysis thread, since no one has posted anything on it for 3 months?

I just had a Qhira match where I got the full blame for the loss, and where I know I’m bad, I’m not sure why it was entirely on me

30

You can probably post it here, if you aren’t comfortable posting it there.

31

Have a purpose for what you are doing.

common mistakes, Going to objectives down a talent tier.
Pressing or starting fights with no reason other than fighting
Not knowing when to go back to base and staying too long in a fight.
Fighting when the enemy is 5 and you are not (3 or less)
Not watching the mini map, and getting ganked by over extending.

When watching the replay, what was your positioning ? were you in front of or behind the tank ? did you overextend ? could you/should you have gone back to base for heal/mana ? Did you go into fights knowing your team is 5v2 or 5v3 trying to save people who are going to die and dying with them.

Did you get a camp when you should have helped ? did you separate from the team late game forcing them to fight 5 v4 ?

Did you build a build that was appropriate for the situation ? building according to highest winrate isn’t always right for YOUR current game.

32

Yeah you’re right.

It was this match, if anyone minds taking a look: https://www.heroesprofile.com/Match/Single/?blizz_id=12008579&battletag=Foxtato&region=2&replayID=37848367

I definitely took the wrong ult, I know that much.

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33

D aggressively only if you’re 80% sure you’ll get a kill worth the play. As a melee assassin like Qhira, it’s all or nothing.

In your draft, you’re the offlaner. You start mid. At no more than 0:30, you go bot.
Rotations can be acknowledged here:

Else, some other Qhira players:

MustekasHeir

Amnezia

Icen

34

I will take a look, sorry for the delay, I was out most of the weekend. Fair warning, I don’t play Qhira all that much, so can’t give you any decent advice on talents and all, but can look at your general positioning and macro play.

35

I will take a look, sorry for the delay, I was out most of the weekend. Fair warning, I don’t play Qhira all that much, so can’t give you any decent advice on talents and all, but can look at your general positioning and macro play.

No worries! I’d appreciate it very much. You play Artanis, right? Maybe you could also point out when I engage at weird times?

I remember somewhere at the end of the match, the tank and healer were spread and both of them were going for a stun IIRC. I didn’t know who to follow up on so what I ended up doing was… Well, an absolute mess and a failure on my part

36

OK, after watching this, I can give you a couple of things to keep in mind the next time you play Qhira. First of all, never use a hard engage tool early in a fight, unless you know your team is with you, especially your tank. A lot of times you were using E or D, and either causing damage that was easily healed up, or getting yourself in a bad spot. You definitely had some really good Es, but most of the time they weren’t resulting in a kill, which is what you should be looking for. You were also in trouble a lot of the times because you used D to engage on a full health target, so had no way of getting out when things went sideways. If you are going to use D offensively, it should only be to finish someone off when you know it is safe to do so.

Second, try to use AoE abilities like Q and W where and when it will hit multiple targets. I saw several times where you threw a Q at a single target, when a slightly different angle could have hit a second target, putting more pressure on their healer, and giving you more healing from your W.

Third, do not get baited into chasing a kill if you cannot account for most of the enemy team. That happened in bottom lane when you thought you had a kill on their Nova, but the rest of her team was right above you, and you ended up getting ganked instead. Yes, kills are your job as an assassin, but sometimes you have to let one get away.

All three of those things could be because you are used to playing Valeera, who is primarily a single-target hero, and has a number of ways to get out of situations that she doesn’t want to be in. Remind yourself that you aren’t as safe, and you should be looking for multi-target opportunities.

Last, and this applies to every single hero and role, one major thing I noted about your positioning is that you didn’t seem to respect what I internally refer to as “their side” of things. For example, if I am attacking a minion wave or a fort, I mentally view it as having a “my side” and a “their side”. “My side” is the safe side, closest to my structures, healer, tank, or escape route. In other words, the thing I am hitting is between me and where they are most likely to be. “Their side” means I am between the thing and the area they may be coming from.

Whenever I cannot account for the enemy team, or if it is a situation I may want to leave in a hurry, I make sure I stay on “my side” of things. For example, just before the second objective, your team was attacking their fort (good). Too many of your team, including you, were on “their side” of the fort you were attacking (bad). Your Tychus took this to the extreme, and went charging into a 2v5 against a Bloodlust Rehgar and Stitches, and promptly died.

At that point, you should have been on “your side” of the fort, or just left completely, as it gave them a chance to run you down and kill you too. If you want an even better example of a complete failure to respect “their side”, just watch the replay from the perspective of your Tychus, he was far worse at that than you!

With Valeera, she often wants to be on “their side” of things, as she is designed to be disruptive and get away with it. Most other heroes aren’t quite as safe doing that, so it is one thing you can practice that may help in the future.

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37

This is a lot more in-depth than I expected it to be, thank you so much. I’ll try to apply this the next time I play her. The concept of “respect their side” is also definitely something I’ll pay more attention to.

Thanks a bunch again, this is really helpful.

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