i 100% agree with that
Pretty much every new expansion contradicts things from previous expansions as well as what is documented in Chronicles. It’s just the nature of any human creation. There was all sorts of uproar in almost every Legion patch where what was considered “canon” was pretty much ignored for compelling storytelling. And honestly, I am fine with that.
Fun fact: The Benedictus quote I posted earlier was from Cataclysm, which released 6 years before any of the Chronicles volumes were published. In a strange twist, Benedictus’ faith and story arc plausibility was one of the things retconned, so in terms of origins, is technically more canon! 
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not true, prove it. give me examples or provide quotes that contradict each other
chronicles is telling stuff directly, whereas that benedictus quote is speaking from a third person perspective. it’s his own view on the powers. there are many characters in lore which went from Light to Void, as if there was no difference, as if there was no moral codex ascribed to them disticntly. then when you lose morality, then Light and Void do have no difference anymore to the indivual’s view.
Definatly. New lore will always come into the game and things change that were established before. It keeps things interesting and creates a feeling of a living story so to speak.
What I don’t think will happen is a major retcon of the lore of Chronicles, like it happened with the old lore through the introduction of the Chronicles. Doing that would nullify the work they put into the Chronicles.
Did they already retcon stuff from the Chronicles? Can you give me an example? (No ill will, just curiosity)
I wouldn’t call things that are established earlier more canon. I think it is actually the opposite. The newest lore will most of the time be the one you can rely on the most, while for the old one you have to look whether or not it fits the new.
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I think there lies my and Hoku’s point.
If the newer versions are the more canon, than it means, the older version tho were canon at same point couldn’t stand as canon for eternity.
And since it’s only perspective what’s new and old and a matter of time, nothing indicates or guarantee that the Lore we have now won’t change again, creating an even “more canon” canon, pushing the story further and further ahead.
Usually retcons happens because: we made things more complex and detailed, so some things just couldn’t stay as they were.
And that can be the case with this whole Light and Void conflict as well, which is hinted in WoW (at least in my perspective) that can be brought together, like how Alleria Windrunner works.
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damn right. you can’t change the nature of creation… but you can make arthas cast the Void instead of Light at once. nobody is against that, and it isn’t even against the rules of creation.
exactly. also because the Benedictus quote is from a third person perspective… wheras the chronicles is directly setting up stuff.
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i wanna note here, don’t forget that we’re talking about the fundamental powers of existence. the Light & Void creation theory in WoW is set up to be forever. there can’t be anything in actual expansions that contradicts the creation nature itself, and if so, please provide direct quotes of contradictions out of authentic resources. the one argument that there is no Light and no Void in WoW, but just Power, turns the whole explicit creation story and its philosohy upside down. the benedictus quote, is a quote of a third person character in lore, stating his own interpretation of existence.
benedictus was the leader of the church of Light. he got corrupted later by the Void. in insanity and full of Void, he statet that there was no Light, no good, no evil, but just power. this is quite Void driven thinking, coz even the Light know’s that there is evil. for if there was no evil, there would be no good.
i’m just gonna sidestep the current conversation because hoo, i can’t handle debates about the fundamental forces of WoW’s universe, eheh
anyway, i think it’s less that blizz was trying to establish a connection, and more that blizzard just really liked/likes certain tropes and story formulas. heroes becoming corrupted, demons, heaven/hell (warcraft 1 described “daemons” as being from hell, and priests were kind of just magic christians), light-versus-dark narratives in general, invading forces that have endless armies and/or the ability to take over your mind, etc etc…
oh, and sneaky assassins with super-long high ponytails q:
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did you know that the bible states: God is Light? it doesn’t say God is Jesus or anything, but that God is Light.
yet many christians say that the Light is just a metaphor for goodness, though the first pages of the bible state that God made the stars and the earth out of Light. how is this just a metaphor?
“There was the true Light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man.”
“The lamp of the body is the eye. If therefore your eye is sound, your whole body will be full of Light."
“We must be holy, because this is the only sound evidence that we have a saving faith in our Lord Jesus Christ.”
“Therefore, since we have these promises, dear friends, let us purify ourselves from everything that contaminates body and spirit, perfecting holiness out of reverence for God.”
"Just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”
“Blest are they who hunger and thirst for holiness; they shall have their fill”
yet many christians say that you can’t strive for holiness. they say it is not through effort, but through the grace of jesus only that we attain holiness. they recognize the Light bearer, but not the Light itself.
i feel like the whole Light story in WoW is correcting what modern christianity is missing out comeplety = the belief in ones own holiness. some christians even told me that it is devilish when one tries to become holy. say whaat?
this supports the claim that i made at start, that blizzard is trying to make a point with all the Light & Void, hokus pokus/psionic ability stuff. maybe they are hardcore christians who believe in Holiness/Unholiness? the creation myths are soo the same.
Even among them.
Xeera was evil in my books.
So the Light has the same contrast/spectrum of alignments as humans, which indicates this is also true to the Void.
Which proves that there is no unquestionable and fundamental good or evil but those things are determined via perspectives and selfinterests and the whole world is a big gray area.
Even in fantasy worlds nowadays.
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in what translation and edition? rolleyes
Anyhow, you should stay away from religion, given code of conduct issues.
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oh my, this is far too metaphysical for me, eheh
i feel it is worth mentioning that in WC1, the setting was pretty much generic fantasy—your standard “medieval-european kingdom gets attacked by strange creatures” thing. imo the real-world-analogous portrayal of religion was probably a product of that setting, and the subsequent change to “demons come from space / priests worship a faceless force of holiness” was an attempt to move away from any references to real-world religion
anduin in HotS even says he thought angels were apocryphal, implying that the views of the WC1 human religion aren’t followed by the Church of the Light. they’re two different (but similar) religions
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sorry, i didn’t mean that Light itself is good. i never meant to claim that in this topic. what i meant was the church of Light, and all the humans who are connected to the Light that have quite an interpretation of good and evil. their believe in goodness is there, just as their awareness of evil is there. and they attribute Void magics as abominable demonic magics.
the Void is called unholy magic, whereas the Light is called holy magic in the chroncles and everywhere.
and there is this in the chronicles:
“The naaru are benevolent creaturs of living holy energy. They are perhaps the purest expression of the Light that exists in the Great Dark Beyond. The naaru have vowed to bring peace and hope to all mortal civilizations and waylay the dark forces of the Void that seeks to engulf reation.”
-World Of Warcraft-Chronicle Volume 1
"The void lords are monstrous entities composed of pure shadow energy. These beings are cruel and merciless beyond mortal comprehension. Driven by an insatiable hunger, the void lords seek to devour all matter and energy in the physical universe.
-World Of Warcraft-Chronicle Volume 1
now what exactly these quotes mean, if it’s truly about good VS evil, i don’t know. but isn’t it justified to at least suggest so?
This thread reads VERY much like a Healsonheels one. /sigh. Staaahp.
If this was a real HoH thread, it would just be the OP arguing with themselves.
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i don’t see that, i rather see confirmation of reallife religions 
there is freemason symbology in the paladin hall, and in the paladin hall only. freemasonry is a still existing organisation built upon the foundation of the order of the paladins back then, some special stonemason knights. is it a coinsidence that humans in WoW are stonemasons too? look at stormwind, it looks like a damn castle from medieval times. there is also another symbol of freemasonry (the phoenix) on books in the pala hall. the phoenix being the symbol of the bloodknights who tapped into the Light. the phoenix in freemasonry bears the meaning of Enlightenment/Holiness. this meaning of the phoenix in masonry is not to be figured out very easily.
this smells like you’re supplanting a lack of information to be more than it really is…
Blizzard products are massively referential – especially noted easter eggs – but a hefty part of that can be seen in regional references used to influence each particular ‘race’ or setting a particular game. (ie warcraft trolls or starcraft terran) While aspects of humans in the warcraft setting follow European roots, its not an exclusive reference.
“oh freemason stuff!”
Paladin’s reference germanic mythology.
The Knights of the Silver Hand get their namesake from Tyr as a model for upholding justice and order, even at the sacrifice of self. The Silver Hand is the recast hand Tyr lost and the creatures he fights, and dies to, are all emblematic of the mythos of Týr
Fun tidbit: as English is a Germanic language, the influence of their mythos carries on to this day. The name of a particular day of the week is called Tuesday, but could rather be “Tyr’s Day.”
So what you’re content to fixate on for a particular meaning (ie, confirmation bias) looks to have roots and references you haven’t considered 
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aight i get you, you’re saying that there is a lot of stuff referencing from wow to rl, but that it isn’t anything more than a reference. a fantasy created for fun, a world of gods and demons, watchers and forces. taken ideas from existing ideas.
but, when blizzard and many other games like Warhammer 40k and Doom obsessevly tell about psionic/psychic abilties and share the same ideas, it tells me that these games and their lores are trying to make a point. it is science fiction, but they go so deep in defining a thing in the lore sometimes. in SC, WoW and Diablo it’s ALL about psychic powers, the wielding of Light and Shadow through mind. in one universe it’s called magic, in another one it’s called psionic power. but it’s the same. what i see is blizzard combining science and magic, as if they were one.
by the the way, WoW creation myth = big bang theory
“In the beginning, there was only the Light. as the Light moved on, the Void came to be in its absence .”
-WoW
"The universe began as a very hot, small, and dense superforce (the mix of the four fundamental forces), with no stars, atoms, form, or structure (called a singularity)
-Wikipedia - Big Bang
“Dark matter, the mysterious extra mass in the universe that emits no light yet exerts a gravitational pull, may actually be made up of primordial black holes that originated with the Big Bang.”
-livescience.com
“Although very different in nature, the Light and Void are bound together in a cosmic scale.”
-WoW
matter = Light
dark matter = Void
that’s repeating the same thing to neglect variation beyond the tl;dr consideration.
While some stories can be allegorical, as a means to teach or convey something, that isn’t the only function or motivation to writing.
While there can be some overlap in the ‘origin’ told these days, the series themselves started out with as divergent a perspective as there was to the gameplay. as more sequels and books came out, then additional writters were brought up and some aspects of the stories were homogenized. In such cases, its less so as to “zomg, its just like my stories” as a means to share the ‘same idea’, but to use what an audience knows as a point of familiarity to try to ferry them into what is actually new of the work at hand.
People come to a work with pre-existing expectations and default to those expectations until they realize and accept something as specifically detailed to be difference – if something doesn’t specify it needs something than ‘air’ to breath, than an audience assumes the character uses “oxygen” but may not care about the composition of said ‘air’ unless the character as a mask/respirator/suit/etc.
Its simplified details because audience need particulars simplified.
In this regard, you’ve chosen to assume the basis of similarity between all 3 and lump it as some mind/psionic stuff, and then conflate it to be personalized projection. In this regard, the basis of what you’re trying to project comes at the neglect of details that don’t suit you – which mires the theory.
Functionally, however, its not as if “psionics” or “magic” have to exist for the effect of what you’re trying to claim to make sense away from the tin-foil theories. To note: these sort of games are escapist fiction, so the common elements of having things beyond our reality is the whole point of the work being “fiction”. But even beyond the notion of ‘fiction’ for ‘fiction’, the mythos of referential stuff ties in to how the ‘real’ world works.
Some of these creation myths all have ‘dark’ or whatever cast off as a form of light; that holds true in effect for the electomagnetic spectrum.
“White” light is the combination of several elements, that on their own, seem vivid and disctinct from white, but are just a part of it. Fractions of the white have oppositions in their composition (red & green) but are still both part of the whole. Similarly, the means of having ‘opposites’ of the light comes down to the perspective of radiant light versus reflected light – how we perceive ‘light’ is on what it hits, so what we ‘see’ is what isn’t absorbed by the material at hand and we see an ‘opposite’ of its reality.
That’s why a combination of colored light goes toward white, but a combination of physical colors (like markers) goes toward black. Its still all part of the same “whole”, but the perspective we have in processing the varied movement of particulars is simplified in a form we consider as ‘opposites’.
Shadows, to a certain degree, are a manifest form of cognitive bias we have to out perception, but the spectrum of radiated frequencies are all the same components of matter moving at such a way as to seem different.
What is even called “black light” (contrasted to white light on the effect it has on our perception) isn’t an opposite or evil, but a difference of perspective from the same “whole” as mentioned before.
Magnetic polarities are a facet of movement, and not of incongruent qualities, and the identity of a particular “pole” changes over time in a similar sort of cycle as one conveyed as the cycle of the Naruu from Light to Dark.
a number of origin/creation stories tend to have some sort of “whole” that was fractured into sides that then toil in conflict and war. Effectively, they’re all part of the same “whole”, and part of the distinction between these facets (much like how the perception of color is from frequencies) isn’t so much the “mind”, but rather emotion, how its manifested, and hw it aligns with desire and the ‘mind’.
So its not as if the fiction of ‘magic’ or the like needs to be projected as “real” in these stories for the same effect to be referential to other materials apart from your fixated theory.
Stuff like myths, theology, and the like have have resonating similarities in blizzard stories because they serve as a comparable role for fictional people as it does real one – that’s what makes the characters, plot and events “relatable”
The capacity to retell the same stories doesn’t have a inclination that people perpetuate that this stuff is to be “real”, its just a consequence of the money-machine pushing toward “universally” relatable qualities to reach a broader audience and pull in more fan affection… and money.
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