well
if is a control deck
its supposed to be able to do it
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Control deck =/= Priest deserves by far the best value generation out of any control deck and the best answers out of any control deck. Priest plays solitaire, straight up. You cannot plan against all the nonsense they rediscover.
That’s an overtuned control deck that stifles every single archetype that aims to play on the board (which is most decks, board gameplay is the most important aspect of the game) and in Priest’s case even combo and miracle because Illucia is a busted swiss army knife card. It’s a deck that deserves toning down, so classes that aim to play on board can actually start using it without Priest effortlessly punishing them for anything they try.
Priest for instance literally doesn’t deserve Apotheosis anymore. The card that makes ignoring Priest’s board punishable shouldn’t exist when Priest has removal that can check any board state and more burst heal that doubles as removal (Xyrella with cheap heal spells). Samuro with Apo is bloody Reno against aggro right now, it’s disgusting.
The class got overtuned to hell and needs adjustments pronto.
Could someone point to the data that shows the Priest claims that it’s dominating?
I look at VS Report and filter by top 1k Legend and it shows Priest is Tier 2 and Paladin on top.
Then I read the VS Report and it clearly states that Paladin is dominating.
Show me the data. Don’t tell me “Well, these streamers said”. I don’t care about what top streamers are saying. Show me the data. Otherwise, all this talk about Priest being insanely overtuned and OP at top legend is just BS talk.
https://www.vicioussyndicate.com/drr/vs-power-rankings-data-reaper-report/
It’s the 9th best deck at TOP 1K Legend. What in the heck are you guys even talking about? The data doesn’t support your claims.
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this guy been repeaing "priest is dominating " since DH release
before DH got nerfed for the first time
thats is enough for me to know i shoudlnt take anything he says seriously
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It’s the most brought and banned class in GM.
Priest also has the best matchup spread in 1k legend. HSR shows that the only negative winrates are against freaking memelock and poison rogue, the decks that crumble apart against numerous others while Priest manages an overwhelmingly positive winrate or something above 50% against most decks because playing solitaire well is what top players do.
By the devs’ own policy (“baLanCIng ARounD tOp PLaYers”) Priest deserves to get hardcore hammered and redesigned. It’s overtuned solitaire nonsense that GMs auto-ban out of fear of getting scammed, as Priest absolutely never lets their non-Priest opponent feel like they’re in control of the game. They play solitaire, straight up.
The data contradicts everything you just said.
I said present me with data. Are you unable to do that?
What people bring to a GM is completely irrelevant. Tournament play is no indication of how well decks perform on ladder. You rarely see aggro decks in Tournament play even when they are clearly the top deck at all ranks. All ranks.
Please show me data that supports your claim. Otherwise, https://www.vicioussyndicate.com/vs-data-reaper-report-197/ negates everything you just said with actual, factual data.
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“The data” in VS doesn’t even show Priest’s matchup spreads in top legend. But the legend ones should already give you an idea of how oppressive Priest is. It’s favored against every relevant deck and its winrates only climb at the highest ranks because Priest is pure solitaire that experienced players are capable of abusing very consistently.
I don’t care if someone in 5k dumpster can’t pilot Priest into a Paladin or they even see Secret Rogue there (high legend Miracle Rogue has gotten too popular and eats Secret Rogue alive). High legend Priests have long driven Paladins out and HSR shows the Ctrl deck is favored against literally anything that isn’t Memelock or Poison Rogue. AND Paladin is getting nerfed again while Priest is untouched.
Priest is the most banned class in GM. GMs constantly call Ctrl Priest the best deck in the game.
If the devs actually believe their own stuff about balancing around top players, they should freaking hammer Priest down.
VS doesn’t have a large enough sample for me to trust it. Only shows 8k games at top 1k legend, which means not many people are using it.
I keep seeing him complaining about priest being tier S since forever haha. Of course paladin is stronger in legend, he just doesn’t want to see it.
“How dare be a board-counter class in the game?!!” is all I see in that.
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Paladin is barely a class in top legend compared to Priest and Rogue. Do you understand what “top players” are? It’s certainly not the 30k below 1k.
I play in top 300. 1k legend is swarming with Priests. It’s that solitaire control deck, and Miracle Rogue + deathrattle DH that pray to highroll against the Priests.
I am already legend and the vast majority of my games from the past two days were against Priest and Rogue.
And for the record I’ve been advocating for Paladin changes FOR MONTHS and criticized the hell out of devs for that subpar patch that didn’t do **** to First day of school.
I don’t care if you one-trick a class. Paladin terrorized the average MMR and Priest is disgustingly overtuned solitaire at the level of top players. The level the devs supposedly “balance” around lmao. Yeah, they sure care about balance. Not.
- There are stats on internet showing that is not really like that.
- Balancing the game around top 1k legend is a veery bad idea because that’s not even 1% of the game’s community.
- If most tier 1 decks are board-centric, it’s pretty natural for the anti-board class to rise. The same way warlock and mage rised when priest was tier 1-2.
- Solitaire was a Hearthstone playstyle since forever. Should we delete all combo decks because they just want to ignore the board as much as possible, delay and get to the golden moment?
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The stats in top legend show Priest has multiple top10 winrate decks in 1k legend and no unfavorable matchups aside from Memelock and Poison Rogue - both decks way more vulnerable than Priest.
Balancing around top players is what the devs themselves said they’re doing. But they’re not doing any balancing anywhere, as evidenced by godawful patches and them ignoring even GMs’ input. Or Masters’, who are also the top of the top and the devs have explicitly said that they look at those players’ performance to “determine whether a class would need more changes”. Except they don’t look. Otherwise Priest would’ve already been borderline deleted from the competitive scene, or even redesigned properly.
Solitaire HAS NEVER been Hearthstone’s identity lmao. Most classes in the game do not rely on “haha random resource (re)generation is half my deck” as a wincon. And the fact that Priest nowadays completely stifles board gameplay is utterly unhealthy for the game as well, because board based decks are the vast majority. To add to that dominance over board decks, Priest murders combo and miracle because some “brilliant” person had the idea to print the most insufferable swiss army knife card in the game - Illucia.
Ctrl Priest is an overtuned solitaire deck that turns 1k legend into a freaking torture simulator and forces GMs to auto ban the class lmao. It deserves the hammer. Has done for a while.
The stats can be very inaccurate. A few thousand games is no match to Blizzard’s data base, which is bigger and more analytical.
So then what other source of data are you two using to determine that 8k games within the top 1k of people isn’t enough data but the data you see is? Have you personally watched over 8k? games? This is what I’m getting at.
Where is the heart of your evidence that allows you to convince yourself that Priest is overtuned at top 1k legend and ignore over 8k games at top 1k legend?
I’m trying to understand your reasoning.
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Where
Are
The
Stats?
How come you won’t post them and keep avoiding it? Why is this so hard? You keep making these wild claims and I’m not seeing them. What access to stats do you have that others do not?
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I have made no assertion about the power of priest in top legend, which, btw, is higher than top 1k to many players.
I said I don’t trust VS to analyze properly. This is their explanation of how they calculate win rate.
Assuming that the average builds are similar, and that the sample size is sufficiently large, these differences may suggest that our players are more proficient at Zoo, or our opponents are less proficient in Midrange Shaman, or both. To correct for these discrepancies, we take the simple average of the two win rates, and conclude that in this matchup Zoo is favored and the expected win rate is 60%.
My emphasis added.
Because of how they only track opponent decks and average their wins, they likely significantly under report the power of a deck.
Note that there is an assumption about sample size, and this falls apart the smaller the sample. 8k games is pretty limited when compared to say the 500k games HS replay shows just bronze through gold for face hunter.
While I admit top legend is a small meta, I have methodological issues with VS.
That’s fine if one admits it. But Villain is over here making assertions of truth, claiming they know the stats, and isn’t providing them and gets angry when no one accepts their assertion.
If you assert something as a fact, you should be able to provide proof of said fact. I’m simply asking for proof.
The best stats out there contradict what they say. I don’t know of a better system tracking stats so I’m asking for them.
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Freezing Trap
I love it
So I guess Board based classes should just never get to actually win then huh
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cries in new paladin deathrattle weapon