Dev 1: I have this great new idea… after the player spends hours and days searching for the perfect piece of gear we get them to get this… break it… in just a few minutes. What a great way to get them to play more so they can spend even more hours finding the next thing to break. Sounds like fun don’t it.
Dev supervisor: Sure does… I’ll bring the popcorn. Can’t wait to watch these guys cry over and over again.
The more I play, the more I think this is exactly the type of people we are dealing with. Random one hit kills that never get fixed. Pit Bosses with near infinite health. The worst attempt at trying to bring Greater Rifts to D4. Annoying UI issues. Mounts that hang up on pebbles. Oh and the delay of when you hit the dismount button and it finally dismounts. Uber bosses that are immune for 3/4 of the fight. But seriously, forcing us to break our best gear has got to be the cream of the crop.
What bothers me as well about tempering is that it locks good gear you find to your VERY specific builds, unless you (manage to)temper some sub-optimal stats that work on multiple(still not all) builds. So let’s say you find a 3 GA item - your options are to (ATTEMPT TO)roll exactly the right stats for the build that is going to use it, or (again, ATTEMPT TO)roll less-than-ideal ones so you might be able to use it with SOME other builds. Really bad design. Good legendaries are already way too difficult to come by - more so than mythical uniques.
Some people(haven’t seen them yet) may say “then just don’t temper”, but tempering(seeing as it makes quite a difference when you get lucky with it) is very likely taken into account with how the endgame content is balanced. Without tempering one is unlikely to get very far in The Pit which is likely the most difficult thing in the game seeing as how it’s endless(?).
I honestly have no idea what your point is here. Could you please clarify.
When I found a perfectly affixed 3 GA chest last season, I took the third choice… I sold it for 25 billion gold. I could not see myself even attempting to temper it and face the utter devastation of bricking it. And I did not even need the gold because I had just sold a necklace for 20 billion. It was the sheer psychological terror I wanted to avoid.
It’s not that serious. If you find a perfect 3 GA item and roll an unwanted stat on it, just wear it until you find something better. Or keep using your almost perfect 2 GA item. Improving your gear is a holistic journey with incremental improvements. Getting a bad roll on a perfect piece is ok- it’s gonna be ok. You’ll get more gear as you play, and even the most RNG screwed player will over time slowly make their gear better. That’s the whole point.
I swear you all need therapy or Buddhism or something.
It’s not the worst but there’s aspects of really sloppy implementation involved.
Like being able to not only reroll back into the Affix you’re trying to roll away from but rolling a worse version of it.
That’s a kick in the nuts. Especially if it happens multiple times in a row. I’m not sure how they do their RNG code but my guess is they have an array of 1-100 and each option gets an equal segment of that array.
Problems is when your array is that large you get a TON of opportunities to land on bullcrap options, like mass rerolls because if there’s 3 options, each option gets 33.3 numbers on that Array. So while on a grand scale it evens out statistically it’s a freaking miserable experience sometimes for the end user.
The point is you do not know what the item is yet. You only see 3 out of 5 affix.
If 3/5 affix is already your “best gear” then it really doesn’t matter what the other two affix are and they are just bonus.
In reality the tempering system is an” identify” mechanic. But instead of just identifying the item and revealing it fully, you get a chance to target specific affixes, increasing the odds it will be affixes you want or are beneficial. Instead of a 5 affix item with 5 random affix, you get a 5 affix item where two of the affix are targeted, increasing the chance of something good.
The concept that tempering broke your item is like saying identify scrolls in D2 or POE break your item when the revealed item isn’t exactly what you wanted.
In D4 more than half the item is already identified for you, letting you better determine where to gamble your resources on further identify and crafting it.
Over all it improves the quality of drops.
The problem with tempering is it is not presented correctly and sets the wrong expectation. Mechanically, it is very good.
The only issue imo is rerolling into a worse version of your current Affix or massively inflating the cost do roll again by spamming “Don’t change”. Which is how you get these horror stories of “bricked 3GA item that cost me 10 billion” or something like that.
And what’s the expected timeframe on that? How much does someone have to play before they fit in this club and get their magic drop? How does player retention figure into this? After minimum a couple hundred hours since 1.4 and I have two pieces I haven’t even found a 1GA replacement for, is that within or under expected time to receive an upgrade counting average rate of bricking and refarming? At what hour rate should I hit a 99% chance of having received and succesfully tempered a 3GA suitable to my class?
Have you done these studies? Because Blizzard sure as hell better have. But wait, they want to do a gacha loot battlepass game, but don’t even understand how the dopamime hits are supposed to work anymore.
While I agree that tempering feels bad it still has better odds than trying to find a 5/5 item.
If this was the old system then what you found was a 3/5 item. Now you have a chance to add something to it. It gives you a bit more agency on the item.
They can’t just let you pick the stats. They can’t just give unlimited rerolls because that’s just letting you pick the stats too. The game would be over in a couple days if you could just pick everything.
Yep. I agree. On top of that, here are two scenarios.
S tier horde build, but you bricked one of your items. I am 100% sure you will still obliterate T8.
A tier horde build and you got a perfect GA and temper on your item. I am 100% sure you are still stuck at T6 or T7 lol.
I would be more pissed of on perfecting my triple tempers and still stuck at T6 or T7 because the issue isn’t on the gear. It is just that the build I picked has no bugs or exploit that would let me wipe T8 quite easily.
The game is over faster for me under the new system than the old system. Simply because I can’t be bothered looking for upgrades with this system.
With the old system I could pick up an item and immediately know it was an upgrade or a potential upgrade with a good roll at the occultist. The new system you have to go through 20 clicks of tempering. Then get lucky at the occultist. Then get lucky on master working again. Spending tens or hundreds of millions to get a few stat points that make pretty much zero difference.
Tempering is worst in the seasonal realm where a player has a finite amount of time in which to have “fun.”
Fun is ultimately in the eyes of the beholder. A player could have fun obtaining gear or doing end game activities or both or something else.
In D3, the path that a player took through the game was rather obvious and could easily be followed using nothing but in-game interface tools. A player received a set of gear through season mechanics and it gave them the ability to compete and hit the ground running. The grind focused on changing this gear set, upgrading it, or seasonal unlocks.
In D4, obtaining gear is the sole focus of the game. Whether or not a player can obtain enough gear to compete in end-game content within a season is not.
Right now, a player’s objective in-season is to play a maxroll build that requires the least amount of farming while still achieving high tiers in Pit or Infernals. That objective is a circumvention of the sole focus (obtaining gear) of development because the grind is so steep due to things like tempering. In other words, “playing your way” while in-season is futile.
If development focused on enabling players to finish end-game content in-season, then this game would encompass more of the realm of “fun.”
He is trying to say that you find an incomplete item and not an item, therefore you have not ruined an item, you are just “discovering” what the item really is like…
Although in some ways he is right, it doesn’t take away from the fact that this feels wrong.
The fact that it is our decision to press the button that adds the stats tells our brain: you are doing this, you are ruining it.
easiest way to fix Tempering and the “bricking” of items is to have it behave like the enchanting system. Where you ‘temper’ but you can choose to keep the old affix or the newly rolled one…
The crux of the complaints is that tempering can make an item worse.
By that logic every “not tempered item” has to be considered …I dunno if that is a good way of looking at it, i don’t wanna play a game where all i can do it collect
and then i have to play a rng game where it will then be decided if my stays or if i get something usefull.
…I dunno if that is a good way of looking at it, i don’t wanna play a game where all i can do it collect