Andy-the-noob cant beat NM100. He cant even pass Corpse Bows. Even if he copies the guide, he is still being killed over and over. Becoz the maker of the guide created the build/paragon to satisfy his own gamestyle. It’s not created to satisfy the gameplay of noobs like Andy.
D4 is not a game for idiots like Andy. Andy can still play D4 but he can never beat the hardest content on his own.
You don’t have much of an imagination. Every single response to this post from everyone… is a case in point of that paradox I referred to earlier. lol
Again, not explaining anything.
If the “paradox” you’re talking about is this:
Everything else in your entire post does not constitute a paradox, and is in fact your own opinion of how a video game should work or be altered to fit your ideal game. To which I say, make your own game, and see how well it does in the market. Your whole argument is based off personal opinion of what you feel would make a game be successful or more well liked.
Contrary to the point, as is seen in various iterations of the game. PoE - extremely complex and difficult to get into, has a much smaller player base then more popular options out there. D4 - extremely easy to get into, not a lot of thought required, lacks QoL and endgame content, sold over 10m copies on hopes and dreams, and there are still more people playing it over PoE at its peak.
So please, make a game, exactly how you would like it, I will be the first to buy it off of you, play it, and critique it. Until that time, you keep going in circles trying to convince people your miracle drug will cure the monotony of the game by making it offer more choices that revolve around killing enemies. Once again I reiterate, I wouldn’t mind these changes in the game. However you aren’t fixing the core problem people have with the game at the moment, you’re just adding another layer to combat that would make the combat more interesting, but do nothing for the game as a whole.
Ready to get your mind blown? What does every single Diablo IV player do for the vast, vast majority of their playtime? Combat. Isn’t it the height of irony that making the vast, vast majority of the game more interesting is not something virtually anyone discusses as a core problem when many players admit playing the game is largely mindless? Do you not get it? The paradox I was referring to is people simultaneously being complete morons yet being able to handle a more challenging game. You can’t expect to collect aggregate feedback from complete morons - and there’s a good argument to be made actual gamers are the refuse of society (I would know) - to provide a vision for your game. Streamers are nothing more than glorified gamers so you’ll hit a dead-end there too. I’ve sunk enough hours watching and listening to those clowns in addition to being in gaming communities. The vision has to come from the game developer. We know that Blizzard have no actual vision for this game themselves, one that is worth speaking of anyway. That is abundantly clear.
Progression is the thing players cry about most of all. Wouldn’t you say other games do it better than this one? How are those other games? What happened to Diablo III when it got better? As I’ve pointed out before, the concepts I’m suggesting can be tied to progression themselves.
PoE comes across as an abomination. Apparently its gameplay is no less idiotic than the expectation for the genre yet the background drowns in complexity. But it’s instructive. It’s supposed to be the actual spiritual successor of Diablo II. What is it that you think the “hopes and dreams” for Diablo IV’s future are? People are just dumb, Iggi, and you have to know who and what to listen to. Diablo IV basically sells like a much-anticipated AAA single-player [campaign] game. That is no barometer of success, except for corporate vermin. The game sells because the market sucks and gamer demand is inelastic that way. We’ll consume AAA crap in the absence of anything else. What’s the alternative - read a freaking book? I’d burn myself alive if I had to be an MBA in life. People insult this game in droves, and even those who like it do so often expressly stating you don’t play it with high expectations. The game is a borderline disgrace, Blizzard developers themselves probably know it (the smarter ones anyway - don’t underestimate the power of stupidity), yet it makes enough money. So what? I suppose ultimately it comes down to what a game creator is in this thing for.
Enemies don’t just have HP and damage, they have numbers, locations, behaviors, and qualities. Enemy and environmental design itself is integral to combat quality. Whether you should be crowd controlling enemies, spreading your damage, focusing your damage, perhaps even doing different types of damage, whether you should be defensive, mobile, etc. these are all choices you could be making in variable circumstances. There is also playstyle variation for its own sake. Does copying a guide and mindlessly grinding further in the current game due to a carrot being held out in front of you for longer sound like more of a core issue to you? Because that is exactly what all these fools are asking for. Don’t give gamers any more credit than they deserve. You can rely on gamers to figure out and play more challenging games, you cannot rely on them for knowing what a game should be like. If you put gamers on a pedestal you’ll drown in their insipid feedback that your insipid developers aren’t doing an awful lot with anyway. And then eventually everyone moves on, some more discontent than others.
While you understand one problem, you fail to understand the next, and no amount of arguing back and forth will make you see the bigger picture. You’re focused on the branch and not the tree. I actually agree with your points, I just don’t agree with your conclusion.
Regardless as I’ve said in various other posts of yours good luck with your idea of getting them to restructure the combat system. Honestly rooting for you, but if 30+ years of blizzard games has taught me anything, it’ll likely never happen. There’s a possibility, sure, but you’d have better luck making your own game that challenges people rather then relying on a company such as Blizzard to provide it. 
What is the “tree” I’m missing, ironically enough?
Ask yourself objectively, without your ideal of a perfect combat system, what is the current issue with the game as a whole, and you will find your tree. I’ll give you a hint, it’s not just the combat system. What is the one common theme between almost every single complaint on this forum about? No it’s not Blizzard either, although that is a part of the issue.
Progression/itemization? Or in other words:
Loot is the carrot on the stick dangled in front of you donkeys by unimaginative developers sitting on your backs. It’s literally how I’ve seen people describe their main issue with the game. Yes, the game is mostly mindless as it naturally is being an ARPG (I’m basically quoting other posters here, not embellishing) but a proper loot system makes it worthwhile.
Sure, this is a necessary ingredient, but to call it the tree at the expense of the literal core of the game is just an indication of how lost everyone is.
Agreed, Progression/Itemization, the carrot on the stick, all ingredients, still not the core problem of the game though. Even your combat tweaks are all a part of the bigger problem. Endgame activities, crafting, QoL features, etc. and everything listed prior what are they all missing? What would keep people going?
I’d even say your combat tweaks are fairly low on the totem pole if we’re being honest, it’s important, but not as important as you think. Nor would changing it now, keep people engaged in the game longer. If they came out with your combat system tomorrow, people would still have the same complaints as a whole.
People will easily play with a lackluster combat system. D2 and D3 prove this. Oh sure D2 had more then 6 skills you could assign, and for its time it was amazing, but by todays standards it doesn’t stand out. D3 went even more bare bones, and according to Blizzard has had record numbers in terms of players, so clearly the combat system isn’t the problem here.
PoE, ignoring the Passive Skill Tree, has 1 to 2 active abilities people typically use as their main damage dealer, some are even auto-cast, the rest are usually for movement, an aura (toggle buff), or passives that enhance these skills.
Even the latest LE has more options for its skills, which does enhance the gameplay, but it won’t keep playing long hours into the night.
Let me ask you, what good is the combat for? Killing enemies correct? Why do we kill enemies? To get loot. What do we do with that loot? Equip it and kill harder enemies. What happens when you reach the end of that road, with nothing left to do as we have now, would a new combat system help that situation? Oh it wouldn’t hurt, but it also wouldn’t add anything at this current moment.
I’ll rephrase the question, as a whole, what does the game need more of? I think you are overthinking the problem.
The combat itself is pretty damn good. It’s got a great foundation. It’s really just the endgame, itemization. Loot isn’t great. It’s a game that’s pretty good if you’ve got a weekend to spare and move on. It’s not good for anything else. It really doesn’t help that it’s being handled pretty poorly with the cost of cosmetics, feeling like blizzard isn’t really hearing us as it’s consumer and we fall on deaf ears. I feel like the game had a great launch but after the 1.1 patch that nerfed everything it feels like the game is getting worse as time goes on.
What’s the old saw about giving the people bread to keep them fed and circuses to keep them entertained and the people will ultimately be satisfied?
It’s not wrong, but the quality of the bread and the quality of the circus has to be increased because the people demand “better”- whatever that happens to mean in a given context- in order to be satisfied.
My first MMORPG was Neverwinter Nights on AOL (yes, I’m old). I thought it was absolutely the most incredible thing I’d ever played and that nothing, ever, could be better. Why? Because there was nothing (or perhaps almost nothing) to compare it to. I thought the same thing when I was dragged by friends into playing EverQuest and I had the same reaction: best thing EVER. Then came Diablo, EQ2. WoW. D2. DAoC. LotRO. DDO. GW2. PoE. NW. And now D4. Many of these were available at the same time and each had their dedicated (most for a time, some continual) fan bases.
Admit it: we’re spoiled. We have so many choices of not only genres of games to play but of choices within genres. We expect so much from developers and we’re quick to point out flaws and disappointments (and rightfully so- we pay for the product). Myself, I’ve been chasing the sense of wonder I had the first time I logged into EverQuest- and I’ve never found it, at least not for any great length of time- and mainly because my expectations might just have become too high.
2023 was kind of an awesome year for gaming, aside from the usual AAA stumbles and duds it was actually kind of pretty good.
No Rest for the Wicked might be in your interest window when it comes out, Horizon Forbidden West is out on PC next month, Hades II will probably do an early access of some kind in the next year, I could keep going…
One thing I can just kind of say is that the chances thaf the developers of this game in particular stepping away from their market audience are like… Basically zero… At least within the same I.P.
As much as I typically hate IGN they had a nice interview with the developers and showed off the first boss you come to in the game. The developers explained their process and why they made the boss the way it is. It’ll be very much a souls like game. I’m looking forward to it.
They also had a video with just the gameplay leading up to and killing the first boss without any commentary.
Maybe Diablo is more on the level of not needing a brain as there is no build diversity but some other arpgs utilize you and your thought process to hurdle the hard parts and become a victor. You should try last epoch or Poe OP
I’m lost. Endgame activities? Those will be added, but don’t forget this is far from the first ARPG. Following in the footsteps of others - with this game actually being impressively behind at the moment - will likely be insufficient. They’ll still make money though given expansions. Like I wrote, the market sucks and people will buy them regardless. The people who spend money seasonally I’m more impressed by.
Your experience is relatable for many. It also explains the siren of Diablo II that has stilled successors who have stayed a while and listened.
They shouldn’t step away from their traditional audience but expand it.
My gaming monitor gave up the ghost and I sold my graphics card but Last Epoch seems trash enough for me to try on a 4k 60fps TV and a 2080ti. I bought it, if “servers are fixed” by tomorrow afternoon I’ll start playing it. Did notice on a stream they had one button remapping ability.
What do you say to people that claim they just want to come from a hard day on the job, turn the brain off, kill some mobs on the couch (at the highest difficulty of course) one handed with a beer or sandwich in the other hand? Or to the people that claim, i don’t care about combat just want the loot/rewards fast as possible?
I say their experience can be preserved. Changes that make the game more challenging can be voluntarily accessible rather than baseline. The baseline should be what you describe. I do like the idea of having a big umbrella in a game that provides different experiences to different people, obviously within reason or what’s practical.
This is not how that would work. People can’t have everything.
lol you know they want it and will complain for it. But I agree the idea of a big umbrella would be ideal. We’re just gonna have to be patient.
Yea, I don’t think Blizzard are developing this game in any such direction. They’re using difficulties just for progression where everyone is intended to be on the highest difficulty at a particular point or level. We’ve gotten to the point where game developers and designers are themselves degenerate. lol
Agreed.
Financially speaking the market is fine, from a gamers point of view ARPGs like Diablo are limited in variety though. It’s either F2P/P2W games, PoE, D4, LE, Torchlight, and older variations. There’s more in the works of course, but currently options are limited.
What I’m talking about is content in general. Which includes but is not limited to: End-Game, Progression Systems, Crafting, Itemization, Class Balancing (which includes tweaking of combat), QoL Features, Reward Systems, Stash Space, Character Slots, Consumables, etc.
What we have now is a more complicated D2, trying to be a D3. D2, objectively speaking, has very little content. Back in the day it was great, but today it’s outdated. D3, while having more content then its predecessor, is all about grinding GRifts with little variety involved and an endless progression system that just turns your character into a hilarious god who spits out literal quintillions of damage.
D4 currently is lacking in all areas by today’s standards. NMD are the equivalent of Grifts, but you use them to level up, instead of them being only available at max level. While there is some difficulty completing tier 100, it pales in comparison to the Grift grind. NMD are also very static, where as Grifts were randomly generated, adding a little flavor.
So as I said it’s not just one system that needs more content, it’s quite literally all of them. More end game content is great, but you need a progression system, a progression system is great, but you need QoL features to compliment it, QoL features are great, but you need itemization to help it along, itemization is great, but you need class balancing. It all works in tandem, and one system becomes shallow if the others don’t keep up.