Yea unless im taking my couple friends through nightmare tiers they cant hope to do, they dont even feel like playing either. The game is fun but it really deters the average person from playing once they realize their items at 730 are about as good as its gonna get…so pushing the character to 100 is just a pointless grind with a paragon board as a reward that is extrnely underwhelming. None of them fealt any sort of urge to even try and get statues or renown, which at this point for me would be a welcome break as i chase tempest roar with no real thought it will drop.