I can not see this system be great at all. So far I have wasted 5 items just to get 1 stat I want. So there is not even more tries to get the second stat. I think the tempering attempt limit should be removed. It’s not good this way. I am already beginning to just give up on it. Imagine you did find a good item with several greater affixes, just to brake it while tempering.
I have tried a good amount of times just to try it out. And I have no positive result in tempering. To me it seems like just a way to break you items.
18 Likes
/no
Removing the limit means farming new items will be useless , especially end game.
Tempering system is one of the best they added!
I say keep it like this.
24 Likes
Virtues or vices of the system aside, pretending best case for your argument that you have tried 5 full items to get 1 good stat and failed, that means you have failed (at worst) a 1/5 roll 20 times in a row (4 rolls per item, 5 items, I dont think any category has more than 5 options). The chance of this happening is marginally higher than 1%.
You are a reasonably extreme outlier, and that is in the worst possible circumstances. In many cases there are multiple useable options or the options are less than 5 in a set, or in the case of ancients you get 2 extra rerolls and the second category isnt that valuable so you can use them to get the right roll on the first category. In that case it is wildly more likely to get a roll you want, so the chance of failing 5 items would start to approach more like 0.1%.
4 Likes
It’s just endless grind as before. Get the greater affixes you want and then destroy it, rinse and repeat. It’s easier to get the through looking at gear for sure, but there are to many outcome on the recipes to actual get the stat you want.
I am not getting greater affixes yet, but getting that one good item later on to just break it. That do not sound fun at all. Thank good I have only tried it on random stuff. But I guess the outcome do not change later on.
Maybe the system is greater than what we had, but you still need to find many of each item you need so you have plenty of each to break. So I feel the grinding will be even worse.
As the last one answered there are more than one good stat on an recipe. But if its only one of them you need you can fail as i did. The recipe had 6 outcome, and i hit the same stat 3 times and the rest was one of the other stats i did not need. And yes it can happen several time in a row. So I find it almost impossible to get a perfect item in this system, since you might only have one roll on the last stat. And you would be extremely lucky to hit a good one there.
But i will see later on if the result are the same there and I just keep breaking items, if that’s still the case I am not sure I am motivated to keep trying.
1 Like
It will always be endless grind, the new system only turns odds into your favor, so you are less likely to struggle to progress with gear that definitely don’t match what you want to play.
Any ARPG game is an endless grind.
It matters how engaging is this endless grind and with S4 update, D4 is on the right track.
11 Likes
I am often against making game more ez but this time I am with you.
I hate bricking items. It is sucking joy from getting good drop, bcs it means nothing.
This is one a single thing I really don´t like about loot reborn.
3 Likes
This was brought up during the PTR. It was easily foreseeable that tempering would not be well received.
2 Likes
Gotta agree here, bricking items is never a good system, any system that gives you “Negative” progress is bad, makes people want to stop trying. They literally just copied Last Epochs forging system Lol.
Easy solution, make a rare item that can be used after your X attempts that you can consume to have more attempts.
3 Likes
My werewolf wolf pets can almost one shot every elite in WT4 it’s hilarious. Imo Loot Reborn is good fun!
And I don’t even have good loot yet hehehe
1 Like
This literally just kicks the bucket down the road.
Confirmation bias. Plenty of people are using it without posting on the forums; the reality is that both options have downsides and would thus have detractors. As someone said in the first reply; a lack of endpoint would equally lead to a reduction in the item chase economy.
Sometimes there simply isn’t a “right” answer, and the answer is a judgment call on what developers think is right for the game. Putting a cap on attempts in this system introduce a small increase on getting most of the way through gearing and a massive increase on getting the “best” gear. To replicate a similar set of timeframes there would have to be a significant increase in getting the relevant base item in the first place.
You might think that’s better, but that is partially how we are here in the first place - the world where much more loot with a much wider gamut of affixes to random your way through to get to where you are now. Frankly, without a loot filter to filter the items dropping on the ground, I am FAR more a fan of (very rarely) bricking a “good” item that I pick up than having to sort through an annoying number of bad drops in the first place, but that’s just me.
The reality is that the scenario described in the OP’s post here is wildly unlikely and simply not the standard experience most people will have. If you’re talking about getting perfect affix bases and then putting the right tempers on them; sure, you might get some bad disappointment. If you have a mandatory temper, it is not at all hard to get it on multiple “very good but possibly not perfect” bases, and most people will see it on their first item the majority of the time.
Absolutely love this system. In fact, so far, the loot rework feels like a home run.
7 Likes
I gave my feedback during PTR. I am content to sit back and see how this plays out.
The system isn’t great in either game because they both work on a premise that you get a piece of gear early then the infinite grind is to get an identical piece of gear with higher stats. This is super super super boring.
There isn’t any thought towards how stats balance across the system to solve problems. Changing one piece of gear doesn’t have a cascading impact where you will want or need to reconfigure skills/gear/paragon to cover a variety of problems translating into a stronger character. It is just get these stats then hunt for higher of those exact stats.
LE does this gearing style better though. In LE you don’t pick up the gear if you don’t get the appropriate T6/T7 rolls on it to begin with. Here there is grind associated with making attempts at that T6/T7. Not sure how they fix gearing ultimately. It seems like it is impossible with how bad the core of the game is.
it is a matter of “Progress”, step one is get the great item you want, step 2 get the great temper you want. Current system makes the player feel like that are LOSING progress. I mean technically they are not as you can find another base and have another attempt, it is a mental thing.
And if this is how you feel then why is it a problem?
This here lies part of the problem. I don’t think getting the stats required to ensure you can actually play a basic character build should be gatekept. The tempering system is not a final engame system, this is masterworking.
Tempering seems to be there middle ground system that is mandatory to reach end game, yet it is going to gatekeep a lot of people, simply from bad luck.
With two attempts we have slightly less than 50% chance to actually get the stat we want, this does not even count a good roll. So we have a higher chance to fail than succeed, so you are completly wrong here, the scenario will actually occur more often than not.
I think it doesn’t need to change much, I like the concept. I would not be opposed to increase tempering durability atleast by 5 points though.
some people literally want to be done 2 days in a season. i mean just imagine, they literally suggest that your first 925 can be tempered until you have your BIS item.
people finally have to understand that arpgs are endless grinds.
3 Likes
Honestly, this my issue. Diablo IV has no depth, nor variety in content, and thus is not engaging at all, especially long term.
1 Like
Good idea. Give up. That is the optimal solution for you.
I happen to like it just like it is, so far.
1 Like
You have 4 attempts in wt3 and 6 in wt4. The initial category selection doesn’t use an attempt, and you get 3 rerolls in wt3 and 5 in wt4. The 5 rerolls in wt4 are across 2 categories, so if you need to use all 5 on one your second category will often brick, but that also often doesn’t matter.
Given that WT3 lasts… about an hour, you get 6 rolls to get a mandatory temper on a piece of gear, assuming you don’t have a second mandatory temper on the same piece of gear (which, as far as I know, doesn’t exist). I don’t know how many options exist in the categories of such pieces, but if it’s the same as necro-specific it’s 4 options, so failing a 1/4 chance 6 times in a row is a 17% chance. IE: 83% of people will roll that temper on their first item, and 97% within their first 2 items.
Again; this also ignores the fact that to just get a build working, you can also do this on any piece of gear; it doesn’t have to be perfect. It is nearly impossible to NOT get a reasonable piece of gear with the tempers of gear you need in a reasonable time frame. It will take a long time to get high-rolled tempers on perfect gear, but that is the point.
1 Like