Burning Rage : pathetic damage with very small aoe , and you have to be berserker to even have this effect ? what a joke??
Dust Devils : do nearly no or little damage .AND poor pathing literaly hitting ZERO mobs most of time.
Battle-Mad: gain berserkeri 2.5s after switching weapon 10!! times ??? Come on . And remeber , your berserker duration doesnt stack and is capped 5s if without key passive.
And the useless Aspect of all : Ancestral Echoes . Not only it takes a spot on the action bar , but also It does ZERO damage. When I am doing 500K- 1M crit using WW, this aspect procs and does 1k damage??? what a joke ???
19 Likes
Agreed. not to mention too many usless uniques and legendary nodes.
7 Likes
I fail to understand how somebody can swap weapons 10x and keep a decent uptime on whatever requires you to swap that much. To use this is a big waste of space when you could have gotten some better aspect without the downtime when you are switching weapons. Skills also got cooldowns so it is just a clunky way of playing the game, 3-4 switches would have been enough to start with and then nerf it to 4+ if it gets too good.
Dust devils while whirlwinding, gaining fury or whatever is also completely trash because the tornadoes deal low damage and shoot away from the enemies, this could actually have been decent if the tornado stuck to the enemy that it first hit and kept ticking damage. Tornadoes got the same problem as Charge and Kick, it just makes tornadoes or enemies fly away from you and everything else…
Burning rage and the Ancient thing is just undertuned garbage. They thought it would be cool at level 20-30 or something and completely ignored to make it scale up for higher level enemies, as did they with most effects that should do bleed or any other kind of damage from items/aspects. Things bleed for 400-1000 damage when enemies got 1,000,000+ health or something.
8 Likes
Yup, playing with ancestral echos. It’s fun as heck on WT3. I’m seriously in doubt I can bring it into WT4, though I plan on an honest try for my alt. The worst part about it is it can only seam to proc one ancestor at a time. I’m using both leap and upheaval and have never seen them both at the same time. You can have CotA up and have one proc for 4 ghost bros on the screen though.
The fire aura? Maybe with the flame upheaval unique? I doubt it, but I’ll give it a try eventually. I bet it will be fine in WT3 but fall off dramatically in WT4.
You can play pretty much any build in WT4 once you get some gear, it is just that some builds are far superior and what is listed in this thread is not a part of it. You most likely got some other aspect that is better than ancestral. My ancestral duuuude did not even kill the trash in WT4, which kind of defeated his purpose of even being there.
I think that ancestral also should give some bonus to ancients, perhaps make them last 2-5 seconds longer or reduce cooldown when you spend fury. Many of the weaker aspects in this game could need something extra to make them actually good.
Barb is the clear victim of the blizzard turnover during the games development.
Fun fact for pros who know, the game went through several development teams, each working in siloed reporting structure to a revolving door of systems managers and game directors. Absolutely no communication. Agile workflow process gone mad (for those in systems, you know what I mean.)
The evidence most clear when you look at barb compared to any other class. Half our stuff (paragons, skills, uniques, aspects) doesn’t interact with the other half the way it logically should. Not to mention talents that were obliterated into uselessness that have those “build defining uniques” that blizzard advertises on every single loading screen.
Add it all up and you’ve got a class that needs a drastic overhaul. The proof is in the output. Barbs aren’t killing Uber Lilith in under 3 minutes like other classes are.
The result will be clear. Barb will be least represented class when season one ends. Maybe we’ll get some love in S2. Assuming the dev teams don’t do another shuffle and we lose all the in progress work again.
15 Likes
Agreed, and the aspects and items that actually works were nerf to the ground. Thank you Blizzard.
3 Likes
B-But 4 weapons! That’s like quadruple the weapons!
/s in case its needed.
What I find most hilarious is that they came up with this “arsenal” system with the clear idea that barbs would be constantly swapping to different attacks like an anime character, pulling out a new weapon all the time… except that’s not how it works. AT ALL.
all this arsenal system encourages is stat sticking, not utilzing multiple attacks. And it really, really shows that they had no clue due to our weapon specialization being ANTI-SYNGERISTIC with our arsenal system, as it encourages going focusing on one weapon type (whichever one has the best bonus for your build) rather than swapping around.
6 Likes
I have try the ancestral echos many times. At first I thought it would scale with the ultimate itself and also proc the passive effects . Then I find out it just dont scale and literaly has no co-effects with the ultimate. Which makes it so pathetic .
What a shame ! It has the highest lucky hit chance among all of the barbs aspect . It would be so much better if it actually scales.
AND dont waste your time using that hell hammer unique. The burning damage it does is 2000, which is less than your passive bleed expetze . Sure it looks cool , but the damage is just too low.
1 Like
So Arsenal was the brainchild of the original class lead and dev team…
That was several teams ago lol. There’s just no continuity of vision or intent in the finished product so Arsenal which was supposed to be this big thing with weapons and expertise is now just “u got 3 stat sticks”
6 Likes
It’s not that hard if you have every weapon type assigned to a key skill. Frenzy > Leap > HotA is easy to pull off 10 swaps with very quickly. Especially with the lower Leap CD aspect that makes it almost instantly available.
You can also buff your damage pretty decently with various options from swapping weapons.
2 Likes
yeah too many people are stuck on thinking barb has to be “WW and three shouts” forever. That being said, I do think most of the Weapon Swap aspects are weak, not because of what you do activate them but because the payoff isn’t great.
Completely agree. I don’t use conventional builds, so there have been times I’ve thrown Battle-Mad on a 2h to get the 5 second duration, but otherwise, idk if I’ll use it again now that my build is more fleshed out. That said, weapon swap damage bonuses are pretty good; especially with the Mortal Draw glyph.
Totally agree. Flat number aspects are badly designed and tuned. Lets not get started on the dust devil copy pasta trash. Can it get even more uncreative?
So, Frenzy > Leap > HotA sweap 2 times. You have to do this cycle 5 times to get what ? 2.5s berzerker? I mean come on. While you are doing these circus trickes , high tier nm mobs one-shot you
4 Likes
i mean if we didn’t have 3 shouts eating action bars, we might actually be swapping weapons around
death blow probably has one of the most satisfying ability sounds in the game, can trigger berserking reliably, and also hits pretty hard, but we’re pigeonholed into using a 3x or 2x shout build in order to not get stunlocked for years and for survivability
just make an ultimate shout
and give players diminishing returns when suffering from any bucket of crowd controlling effects, but this is a global issue, effectively having your monitor constantly being shut off by stuff like cold enchanted frozen mobs with a cold affix instantly freezing you the second they touch you is just beyond awful design
another thing
dunno why d4 devs were like 'hey barbs have been duel wielding enormous weapons for 20ish years in d2 and d3, you know what be cool? if they just didn’t anymore"
1 Like
Its more than just shouts though; the fact that 2 of our ultimates don’t swap weapons (wrath of the berserker is another buff like the shouts, and call of the ancients is a spell) is another key part of our kit that doesn’t play into the arsenal system. (Stomp, steel grasp, iron skin, kick are also other skills that don’t use weapons. All in all we have 13 skills that use weapons, and then we have 9 skills that don’t use weapons. 41% of our skills don’t use weapons. Almost half)
The barb would need essentially surgery to reorient the arsenal system to fluidly integrate, not just bandaids. So I don’t expect the arsenal system to be made a key part of ourselves even if the nix the shout reliance.
I WANT it to be changed, I really do. I think its a cool concept, and I think it COULD be made to work. But it would be a large, LARGE amount of work, and I get the feeling blizzard is going to be phoning things in rather than sitting down and doing heavy lifting work (Unless its to try and sell a DLC or expansion).
1 Like
realistically I don’t get why some stuff isn’t counted as a weapon skill other than like beyond the name, which can easily be changed
you can change ground stomp into ground slam, add it to the arsenal system, and give it different secondary effects based on the weapons used (2h slash increases change to take crits, bludgeoning causes vuln, dw increases stun duration) for example
there’s no reason why what is basically their hallmark selling point of the class for d4 to be worthless for some abilities
wotb can be augmented in the same way, just make them raise their selected weapons instead of doing a stomping knock back, like how rally will cause the barbarian to raise their weapon when it’s caster
or even something like
entering wrath will automatically cast (arsenal related core spender/most recently used spender) upon use
ex: using wotb with dw selected will cause you to immediately double swing for free and give the refund as if crowd controlled
1 Like
You keep saying 2.5 seconds like you can’t get it to 5s on a 2H. I’ve literally never used it at 2.5s.
Everybody can get one shot at higher NMDs. I don’t see what your point is.
And you put this aspect on 2H? OK ,I see . end of the conversation.
2 Likes