Improving: Seasons

PC General Discussion
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Important Update:

This idea does NOT affect how Seasons function, it only affects what happens AFTER the Season within the Eternal realm.

  • Fresh Characters start new.
  • Cloned Characters start new.
  • Fresh Characters become Eternal Characters at Season’s end.
  • Cloned Characters are cannibalized by Eternal Characters they are cloned from.

The purpose is to give players who have no interest in playing outside their main Eternal character a way to justify engaging in Seasons, as they are designed, beyond the minute volume of new content that these Seasons bring.

It’s one piece to an overarching series of suggestions I’m trying to put forth to potentially improve the game both in and outside the context of Seasons.

Hope that clears any confusion.

I’m pretty sure that we can all have our cake and eat it too. Seasonal enthusiasts don’t want to lose out on the thrill and challenges of starting over fresh, whereas those opposed want persistent progression for their mains and don’t feel as though the game is engaging enough to re-roll a new character.

That latter point for those opposed is a little bit more complicated to address, and I’ll do that in other threads.

For now, though, I’ll stick to seasons themselves…

Function:

Just make it so that when we begin a season, we can either start with a brand new character or…create a “cloned” character that’s tethered to our main in the Eternal Realm.

It doesn’t matter which you choose, the season itself plays out the same, with your character starting out fresh. The only difference being that the cloned characters have an in-game lore explanation and additional function after the season concludes.

When the season ends, all items collected are transferred to the Eternal character that they were duplicated from, along with a sizable experience gain based upon a percentage of the Seasonal character’s achieved levels. So, while not directly building upon our Eternal characters, we’re indirectly doing so through participation in the seasons. It does what many want without destroying the fundamental purpose of Seasons that would be the case if Eternal characters were just given the ability to participate directly.

The percentage of experience gained through the season provides some level of justification for participation, alongside the Seasonal rewards, for those who want to focus on their main characters. It won’t likely, however, be as much experience as we would be gaining through grinding out on our main directly…meaning that, if all goes well and people engage in this system, the devs may not have to compensate as much for the power creep with their upcoming expansions…as these eternal players will be gaining power slower through participation in Seasons.

The experience boost, however, should still be a sizable percentage so that it still feels like decent progression.

Lore Explanation:

From a lore perspective, this entire system could be explained by the player receiving warnings of a dire threat looming upon the horizon, the expansion, and in an effort to prepare themselves for the impending threat…we embark on a journey that transcends the Sanctuary we know and dives into the infinite multiverse of Sanctuaries we don’t.

With Lilith unlocking our power, we’re now left to explore that potential by doing what not even the High Heavens and Burning Hells thought possible, exploring the lives of different versions of ourselves in alternate timelines…the seasons. Through the experience and wisdom of living these alternate events, we ultimately return to our bodies in the eternal realm, stronger for it. It’s likely Lorath, and perhaps a couple of new characters, whom sets us on this path, concerned by the risks to our psyche but, ultimately, believing that it’s necessary to stand against upcoming evil.

Just a rough idea, but with a little creative writing…it could work out just fine and set the entire mechanic up. It’s possible that these alternate timelines aren’t even real, but constructs of our mind…using our power to perceive every potential outcome to such detail that we’re actually living through it. This wouldn’t affect the fundamental nature of seasons at all, but would provide those without interest some incentive to participate. It also doesn’t seem like it would be very hard to implement either.

As stated before, this doesn’t address the lack of replayability, but baby steps…

Yes? No? Hate it? Love it? Cheese?

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All my friends who are new to Diablo are quitting because of restarts it’s gonna be hard to enjoy a game that forced all my friends to quit. It’s impossible for new players to accept a formula that’s been rejected by all modern games. Blizzard needs to cater to it’s new player base - not veterans who want to be isolated. If people want to experience restarts and nostalgia they should go play Diablo 2 and 3.

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Not gonna happen, nor should it.

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I think everyone can have their cake and eat it to, though the Seasonal enthusiasts don’t seem to want that…from what I’ve seen. Which doesn’t really work out for anyone, in the long-run…as it likely means Diablo IV will, ultimately, become Diablo: Immortal in all the worst ways.

Don’t see why not, as it doesn’t affect Seasons.

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Well, starting with a cloned character on what is supposed to be an economically reset season wouldn’t work. Ruins any kind of trade economy right from the get-go. And this is a big reason why people enjoy seasons.

It’s going to be impossible to please everyone, so what they should do is simply stick to the same format most ARPGs and Diablo have been using for a long time. It works very well. If somebody isn’t used to it and doesn’t like it, then they should simply play another game. Not every game should be catered to whatever they like with everybody else’s form of enjoyment tossed into the trash can. Variety exists in games for a reason.

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Just won’t work.

There isn’t that much to do after you hit max level.

If you don’t want to do a new character or a new class, just don’t play seasons.

I don’t understand why this is such a difficult concept to grasp.

There will be new content added the Eternal realm regularly if that’s what you’re worried about.

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This is another good point. I think these ideas are coming from people that just aren’t used to how ARPG loot hunters work. Once you have a geared out character, there isn’t really anything else to do even if there’s new content. The new content isn’t upgraded level caps or uncapped skill powers. It doesn’t work in a game like this. Obsoleting your previous gear in a loot hunter wouldn’t make sense.

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You’re misunderstanding what I meant.

Basically,

You DO start over…but instead of your Seasonal character becoming an Eternal character, it’s cannibalized by the Eternal character it was cloned from. The potential lore for this is explained in the OP.

The Season itself would be exactly as intended, it’s only when the Season ends that there’s a difference between a Fresh and Cloned Season character.

  • Fresh would become an Eternal character.
  • Cloned would be cannibalized by the eternal character you cloned it from.

Both start and experience the Season in the same, exact, way. This way, people who have no interest in Seasons are still working on their Eternal character indirectly, as those Seasonal characters they make are cannibalized by their Eternal character at the end of the season.

Sure, but the end result of that is a massive die-off from a huge volume of people who really have no interest in Seasons.

We know Blizzard isn’t above predatory monetization systems. If they don’t reach their financial goals of the live-service, it’ll either devolve into predatory practices or be abandoned.

I’m not looking to ruin the sanctity of Seasons, just give those who aren’t enthusiastic about them a reason to engage.

Pretty sure we can all have our cake here and eat it too.

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Well, I’m personally unconcerned with what happens on the eternal realm. That could be anything you want and I have no problem with it

From my perspective it’s just a graveyard to give players a psychological illusion that their characters aren’t just deleted at the end of a season. That they can still go back to them if they want.

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This thread is an example of why I wish this forum had downvotes.

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they killed d2’s replayability before releasing d3. its essentially gone, and d2r remastered the dead d2 version thats crap instead of any of the good versions. D2 before LOD was still better than v1.11

so we cant go enjoy either of those games because they arent what we bought to begin with because blizzard wanted to make sure d3 was successful so they first killed d2.

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You’re certainly right, but that’s an issue they need to address…if they want the live-service to last. There’s no end-game and all their game-loops are extremely underwhelming. Most of my threads are divided up to address specific things individually, with the ultimate aim of fixing that exact issue.

If I would have put everything into a single thread, well…people would have glazed out trying to read it all.

There’s nothing to stay for.

Like you said, there’s nothing after you hit max level to retain interest. Hell, there’s nothing after you finish the story to retain interest…as all the other mechanics are so lackluster that the story is really the only interesting part of the game right now.

Seasons bring minute volumes of new content, and people want that content…but not at the cost of going through the same lackluster content as a fresh character, so it needs to somehow be more enticing.

The Eternal realm gets things after the Seasons conclude, and the bulk of content via expansions. The time it takes won’t be enough to retain those players…as, like you pointed out, there’s nothing engaging to do.

…and if they rush it, the content we get will be just as lackluster as what we’ve got now, a product of them being rushed and crunched to begin with.

It’s coming from a combination.

That said, of course it can work. You just need actual gameplay loops that are fun and exciting. Look at the Helltide event, overwhelmingly simplistic and underwhelming…when it could be a fun gameplay loop. The events themselves, the little social events, could evolve and change depending on how players respond to them.

There’s a LOT you can do to keep people at the end of a game’s progression engaged in fun ways.

…they just didn’t bother and went for the lowest bar possible.

What they seem to be rushing to do is make a Rogue-light with none of the enjoyment of a Rogue-light, as the game is too overwhelmingly dull to replay…unless each Season brings expansion level content drops, which it’s not.

Yeah,

This wouldn’t affect how the Seasons function at all. Fresh or Cloned, the Seasonal characters would go through the Season the exact same way, in the process I described above.

The only difference is what happens after, in the Eternal Realm.

Like I said, I’m trying to suggest changes that work for everyone, I can understand why people like Seasons and how they simply do not work if they allowed for what some others have suggested, Eternal characters being able to run through them.

I get that.

The whole thread?! Everyone seems to be going back and forth in ways better than most threads go…

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If they follow the D3 seasonal model, Eternal will get new content when Seasons do.

They just won’t get the seasonal theme and Season specific content that is for the theme.

The end game in D4 right now is the grind from 70 to 100 as far as I can tell. If you don’t want to grind from 70 to 100, there isn’t much for you to do.

Your only options are try higher NMD or see if you can kill Lilith quicker.

Either way, sticking around on your max level characters will get old and get old fast.

Don’t play seasons. Just take the generic new content. Min Max your existing character for a weekend, and disappear for 3 months. It’s the exact same thing you would do if there was no Seasonal reset. Don’t kid yourself.

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I’m not sure that they’re going to do it that way this time around, in an effort to incentivize for monetary reasons.

…but yeah, the point of this is to encourage people like myself to engage in the Seasons to get what remains within the Seasons themselves. If you can encourage people like me to participate in Seasons, as they’re intended to be played, while still getting what we want…then you’ve won the game of pleasing the most players possible.

It then also offers them more opportunity to monetize without trying to force participation.

Win/Win/Win.

That’s what I like, everyone getting what they want. I like sharing my cake.

Sadly, yes…you’re absolutely right.

I have other threads seeking to address that, and more to come.

Every “Improving” thread I’m making is part of an overarching idea on how I feel the game could be improved at a foundational level, it’s just that I can’t put them all in one thread…or people’s eyes would bleed.

Myself included.

The game has the potential, it just wasn’t baked long enough…

In its current state, yeah…

Like I said, I agree with you completely that the game has zero to do after the story, but that’s what I’m looking to see changed.

Otherwise, well…there’s a LOT better Rogue-lights out there…which is basically what this game REALLY is, without a good foundational core and an just an emphasis on rushed Seasons.

Unless, like I said before, the Seasons bring expansion level content…but, come on…we all know that’s not going to happen…and even if it did, the ideal would still be to have both great Seasons and a great Eternal realm working in unison to compliment one another.

Which I think is perfectly reasonable to expect from a AAA dev studio nearly owned by one of the worlds wealthiest megacorporations when they’re fishing for a live service, rather than us just shrugging and embracing the bare minimum.