I hope disabling trading teaches you how frustrating Tempering is

PC General Discussion
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So… trading is disabled (temporarily), “forcing” many to farm their own items before tempering…

I love Loot reborn… except for when an item with the correct stats doesn’t receive the correct tempering.

And I’m not talking about perfect stats or GA, just correct stats.

Yes, I’m casual, tempering it’s something important to me but I have no problem with restarting a Masterworking. I like farming games.

But I don’t like it when the game tells you: Not only do you have to do this again, but you have to do the previous thing again.

So a message for all those who like “failing” a Tempering:

Play HC while connecting to a mobile WIFI. I’m sure you’ll enjoy it.
Do you have to do it from scratch because you are unlucky and you just got lag when you were facing a boss? too bad, this is how RNG works, just play more, eventually you’ll get there.

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Also the abysmal boss mat drops this season.

The response is always “Just buy them”

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Oh, since I’m casual I haven’t experienced it yet…

What are they for?
Are they just hard to get or do they make you lose your progress if you fail?

I like farming, so as long as they don’t make me lose my progress, I don’t care if it’s difficult… I’m casual, but I know that a casual can’t expect to get everything.

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The problem is that mats have to come from somewhere, even if you are buying them.

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Umm my guy is geared out the teeth just fine without trading. Took me 3 days to get all my Ubers from just helping people carrying tormented bosses. This game is so easy, idk how some of y’all struggle. Go help people and actually be nice, stop being weird.

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Masterworking is worse. I have to spend 5 million to reset masterworking because the game wants me to have a crit on Poison resistance.

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GA and Crit on all resistance on Tyrael’s Might. :smiling_face_with_tear:

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And don’t even get me started on Enchanting. I spend 1bil+ a lot of the time just trying to get a second passive stat on an amulet. Which is also probably the rarest item to just naturally drop.

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At least you don’t lose the item.

Masterworking would be at the same level as Tempering if failing masterworking would cause you to lose tempering (Forcing you to temper again).

Same with Enchantment. You are forced to enchant again, but not to find the item again or temper again.

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Yeah, I agree, bricking perfect item during tempering is just meh.

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It sounds like you’re ok with doing the previous thing again when it comes to masterworking since you have to go back and farm gold and mats again. What I’m trying to say is that people have different levels of enjoying redoing/doing the previous thing again. So while you’re only fine with redoing masterworking, others are fine with tempering. Also, I’m sure there are people who don’t even like redoing masterworking and have complained about that as well. Its all on a spectrum.

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Yes and no.

Imagine that this is a staircase with steps and efforts to climb each step.

The first step is to find an item and the effort is to kill mobs. You can “fail the effort” and not find the item, and that is ok. You just kill more mobs

Masterworking is also a step and to achieve it you must make pits. You can fail the masterworking and this is ok. You just do more pits.

With tempering the effort is to get the materials and the gold, as in Masterworking, but if you fail the attempt, you go back to the step of finding an item.

This is why I compare it to HC with a bad internet. Your bad luck forces you to take a step back and do it again.

I believe that we must increase the effort necessary to do tempering, but at the same time, eliminate this “step backwards”.

Yes, sure, there are those who complain about not being level 100 in 10 seconds. You can never make everyone happy, but you can make a large majority happy, and I think Tempering affects enough players to make it worth checking out.

I thought I was the only one who thought it was a problem. If that were the case, I wouldn’t be talking about this. I’m not an unreasonable person.

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From bots. These mats are organic and no real human was hurt!

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tempering isnt frustrating. if you fail to get what you want, try a new item. its quite easy to farm items.

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Failing in itself is frustrating, so what you’re saying doesn’t make any sense.

You literally need training to know how to approach failure.

You can’t expect that from someone who is trying to relax after “failing” in real life.

Now, there is a certain amount of failure that is bearable… Tempering is very much on the line between what is bearable and what is not.

Remember that we are here to have fun.

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Its what I meant by degree. Some people are fine with going back further. That’s why some people really love HC. If they lose their character not only do they have to go back and farm to get the item back, but have to remake a character and all gear. Some people will even risk playing with crappy wifi because thats all they have access to (whether its a financial reason or a situational one like at a hotel vacationing).

From what I’ve seen in various outlets, opinion on tempering is split 50/50. So its hard to argue that most people like tempering or dislike it. Removing tempering is not guaranteed to please most players and neither will keeping it. I think most people will agree that it can be modified and improved even without removing the “bricking” aspect of it. How to improve it is very hard to answer.

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I know, but where you draw the line is important.

A person of millions who complains is not a problem… hundreds, thousands? maybe it is.

I think that if it really was 50/50 then it is unjustifiable, it should be immediately changed.

You can ignore one Karen, but not half your clients.

Now, to be honest, I think it’s actually 80/20, with “the 20” being the ones complaining about Tempering. And I think that is enough for a change to be necessary. (91/9 is where I draw my line)

As for whether it should be eliminated, I have never said that.

What’s more, the developers have said that the limit must exist, but there are simple ways to solve this without removing the limit or redesigning the entire system.

My personal favorite is to create a very expensive alternative. One that allows you to choose the stats you want and never be able to change it again.
Basically, brick in the direction you want in exchange for farming. It’s basically the same in terms of time, but without the failing part.

And the best thing is that you create the relationship of having a high-risk, high-profit system versus a low-risk, low-profit system, where what you gain is time, something very important in a farming game.

In fact, both systems would be used constantly, because at the beginning you don’t have as many materials nor can you farm as fast, so it is something that benefits Endgame more than Earlygame.

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I think we are on the same page in regards to changing tempering. Actually even Blizzard is on the same page since they have said on multiple occasions they are working on changing the system. Their problem is figuring out how to change it.

I’m not understanding how this works. Maybe go through a step by step or something would help.

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Imagine that when selecting tempering it gives you two options: risky tempering or safe tempering (Once one is selected, it cannot be changed).

The risky one means that the weapon has a temper limit, but it is economical and fast (As it is currently, without any changes. Literally: no change).

The safe method allows you to select exactly the stats you want, but it costs a lot of materials and gold (It’s literally “pay more to get what you want”. No RNG). Additionally, once a stat is selected, it cannot be changed. It is permanent. (Obviously, you need to have found the recipes).

Both methods create items that cannot be modified after a certain point (which is what the developers want). Both methods can give you very good results and both methods use exactly the same stats.
Also, on average, both methods should be equally fast in giving you a perfect GA3.

How to do it

What you have to do to implement the system is: first make a window to select the type of tempering when an item is selected. One button that takes you to the current tempering and another to the alternative. (Also add a brief explanation, just in case). The alternative requires a new interface to select the stat.

After that, programming the alternative code should not be complicated, since it is recycling much of the tempering code.

An item with safe tempering would be considered without extra attempts and would only allow the first tempering for each category (something that already exists in the code). The new interface would tell the code what stats to add and would have to have different material costs (So it’s basically copy and paste).

The most difficult thing would be to work on the ID of the item, to detect what type of tempering has been applied so that it cannot be changed.

The only thing different is how they feel.
Tempering have a “feeling bad” problem and not a “time” problem.
Frustration is just a feeling. It’s not logical. It motivates you to not fail again… but if you can’t avoid failing, it becomes a problem.

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As someone who farmed all my own mats last season to grind ubers and doing it again this season, they are definitely reduced. So it’s maddening when people who don’t even farm their own stuff come and tell me that the drops haven’t been altered or I’m just “doing too much infernal hoard which doesn’t drop them”. I’ve done like 90 minutes of hoard total.

The NMDs in particular this season, something is wrong with them. I’m coming out with like 3 items total and the XP gain was worse than S4 by a lot.

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