I just use it as an example because it currently is the only real end game content. If they are close there then they are likely close everywhere else too.
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While I very much agree on the need for a baseline:
Take all the builds above F tier (or whatever is lowest) and bring everyone done to that lvl.
Better yet, just take all builds and nerf them by 90%+. The higher tier, the larger nerf above 90%. After that, do the above.
Yeah, the game very much should create a baseline. But the power creep has already been so absurd, that they have to go far far down to find it.
Maybe a bit more, so you can a sensible amount of materials per run.
Tbh, they should simply cap the rewards from Pit at for example tier 100, and then make that the balance goal for Pit. If a build cant do Pit 100, try to buff it. If a build completely demolishes 100 and above, nerf it. Anything above tier 100 is for people who like to see how far they can go, and nothing else.
Of course builds should also be reasonably balanced for all other content, and all other content should offer difficulty similar to Pit, the whole idea of just having one endgame activity above the others is nonsense.
Also remove 90% of the Pit lvls. Just have Pit 1-20, where 20 is what 200 was before. Do the same for NMDs.
Do the same for Helltides too; you start in Helltide tier 1, and can use those new potions to increase the tier by 1, and they can stack 9 times.
Make another potion like that for non-Helltide overworld too.
Overall, make all endgame activities follow the same difficulty scaling system (can vary a bit in how they scale, due to different activity rules, like NMDs having their modifiers for example, and differ in how you access the tiers in each activity).
Wait a sec! I do agree in general that D4 has a class balance issue, but your definition of class balance is kind of off. Yes, in order to have a good class balance it means that each class should have at least one build that performs very good and that is within +/-5 Pit tier range compared to the other classesâs best builds.
However, when referring to a single class, you do not necessarily need to have all builds perform in the same range. In fact, I donât think you want that at all. That is what makes the difference and you got S to F tier builds for each class. Sure it is nice to have 2 (even 3 but that is already a lot for top tier builds) builds in S tier for each class, but more is bit bleah.
What need to happen is Bliz follow their own approach they laid out in Rule of Cool.
Here is how to do this:
1] Announce sweeping overhaul to every single hero in passives, skills, paragon, ect. Everything will get a new baseline.
2] Make the damage everyone is going for just 50-75% that much damage in the skill to begin with. This gives you a nice baseline and easier to balance. No more zillion damage multipliers to go for. All everyone is doing is just piling up multipliers and making damage numbers go up. What if most the damage numbers were already up? Aspects mostly changed other things like fire skills to cold or added cool effects like Channeling incinerate you can summon fire elementals or Barrage could sometimes cast pierce shot as well. Cool stuff. Everything doesnt have to be % damage if the skills just do 50-75% much damage to begin with. There still could be some damage stuff but it could be funner like instead of damage while you have a barrier it could be a low chance to cast three times while u have a barrier. Super fun.
3] Give heroes identies. This always helped the MTG designers. Each hero could get rated in single target damage, multiplayer damage, life, defense, ect. These changes dont have to be drastic. Say mage is good at aoe damage. He could be rated great at in and say necromancer is rated bad. This would still only be a say 25% difference from great to bad. But then necro would be rated a bit higher in life and defense.
Heroes with identities are easier to design and give direction.
4] After all of this is done there will be some inbalance but because of mostly number 1] and 2] the changes will be much easier to figure out. Just tweak some skill numbers and you are mostly done because you dont have a zillion aspects making numbers go Boom.
Now you can employ the rule of cool and just buff other heroes to get to a new baseline.
Thoughts?
Please say what u think as I think this is the right approach!
I agree, nerf barb, buff everyone else.
They have been doing this forever. They donât want people playing one build one class all the time. Itâs like changing the dog food to see if the dog will eat it or not. And if your not sure how any new buffs or nerfs will affect you or how you should play them, Well donât worry youtube and other streamers have got you covered. The theory crafting extends beyond Blizzards walls.
This is bad. I will not even bother to give reasons why is bad cause i would have to write a too long post and I donât see any reason why I should convince you that is bad. But I will say one thing to not leave you completely in the dark. Reseting and overworking passives, skills, paragon, ect. as you say means to create the game all over again.
I sure as hell do want that. I think an ice sorc build should do as well as a lightning build and a fire build. Why should one of those be intentionally superior?
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I dont agree at all. People want to play the skills they want to play, not the skills they have to play. There will always be meta and tier builds. That doesnt mean the other builds cant be close to that. My goal would be within 10 tiers.
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Same, I just want play WW every season, all season. Itâs been many many months until it was playable againâŚand nowâŚitâs gone againâŚwith what balance changes have been revealed thus far.
That is a recipe to kill a game btw
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FYI WWDD will likely be one of the strongest builds for barb next season
clever lead devs wonât balance their subject matter to perfection.
if the pay is good and the opportunity is there (to unbalance things), why not not to exploit it to ensure consistent wave of fixes to rollout every season in order to emphasize the importance of their existence to the wellbeing of the product, hence increase job security in this ongoing wave of layoffs.
devs need this job to feed their family and themselves; players donât need diablo 4 to settle their financial commitments.
Not really. Everyone is different. People like me hate this swing meta crap. I want to play what I want to play. What kills a game for me is when I canât.
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oh way to balance is set everyone the same and put the stats and abilities on gears. That way our characters still feel like they always do (aka not nerfâd) but the gear they use can be regulated and changed depending on the âsetsâ without impacting skill tree/nodes
just slap a pay2win armor/weapon set in the store let is buy it for a dollar and win! (kidding of course)
Here is a hint. When everything is equally strong, it gets boring very fast because of the simple fact that it doesnât matter what build you play.
You can always play what you want, I always play WW every single season, the times I played it the most was when it was weak even.
The only way the game can be 100% balanced is when everything is solved, if everything is solved people will not play it for over a 1 week since it wonât be fun.
Like if you enjoy something just play it and make it work and have fun.
If all builds are able to do equally well, then I can play the build thatâs the most fun for me to play. If the game were balanced, do you think every player would enjoy every class equally?
For example, Iâve never played a rogue. I just donât like their play style. Itâs irrelevant to me how strong they are.
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I donât need a hint. Iâve been playing video games since Pac-Man in a real arcade. I know what I like.
Iâll give you a hint. It does not get boring. Most people like to play what they want and make multiple builds per season. Other arpgs have tons of build variety and people love them for it.
This game has only a couple builds per class at best and it can take upwards of a year for some builds to become viable. Most people hate that.
It doesnât get boring because they are all different playstyles. What gets boring is being forced into a playstyle you donât like and having not much else.
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i feel the same way about necromancers, i just cant get into that creepy dead class