Double Swing, Help pretty please :)

Barbarian
1

so im running a double swing (Rank 9) thorns barb, and i breeze through 60+ nmds because of my thorns and i dont even have razorplate and i use rubys in my gear… However…

in my tooltip Double swings is supposed to deal 10k with each Blade to enemies caught in the center? i only deal like 40-50 crits wich makes zero sense. is this core skill bugged somehow?

just to showcase some of my multipliers:

50% dmg while having an active barrier
30% dmg while standing still
50% dmg to unstoppeable targets

284% dmg while berserking
217% dmg on critical hits
202% dmg to close targets
142% dmg to bleeding targets
135% dmg physical

so i need help in understanding why my DS crits are only around 40k average. it takes forever to take down objects/walls.

p.s when a nmd have that perk where non bosses heals for 1.5% of their maximum health, i might aswell just give up, leave and find another nmd because i cant kill objects that heals. thats how bad the DS damage is.

2

You should maybe read the giant Double Swing thread?

2 Likes
3

what is your damage to vulnerable targets? That + Crit Damage are the two big ones that factor into getting the big numbers. after that comes Core and Close then everything else.

4

im trying to understand why my built dosent increase the effectiveness of DS. i know there is guides on how to build characters and exploit bugs.

but iam seeking help in understanding why those multipliers i have posted dosent do more for my DS, when it makes my Thorns (without razor) kill everything in lvl 60 nmds.

5

Because you’re lacking all the multipliers that make it better. Check the thread, homie.

6

hey bro thanks for the link to the thread and yes iam aware that iam lacking the stuff that makes DS better.

i have done everything i can to buff my thorns, i only use DS to make Berserker permanent.

my question was just why these multipliers dosent work on DS.

but ill find another forum, see you bro

7

They do buff DS but to get the big numbers the two most important things are +vuln and +crit damage. Those are the stats that matter most.

8

OP can’t scroll or read well. Seems mad.

2 Likes
9

He’s just asking a question and hasn’t responded in a malicious manner whatsoever. It’s incredible how terrible a lot of you are at reading a room. Who knew autism could show up on a forum?

1 Like
10

His responses were pretty dramatic and weird. The biggest thread in the Barb forums is a Double Swing thread with tons of info, and is very easily found by scrolling, if it isn’t at the top, as it usually is.

Trendy interwebz buzzwords like “autism” suggests you are young.

11
  • Your damage sources are multiplicative, not additive. Vulnerable and Crit have the highest scaling coefficients for Damage by a long mile. It isn’t that your other buckets are not helping, they just give you diminishing returns. Basically, move the decimal over 2 spots and that is what they are doing for you. That is just how badly designed damage is, and it is hidden. You as the player would never know from tool-tips. Remember also, even Crit Damage is a little lackluster unless you have high crit chance. Before Elixir and Skills, you should be well over 50%.
  • The Damage to Unstoppable only works when you see the Chains above an enemy’s head. NMD that have Unstoppable enemies are great for damage, but you lose all the other damage from CC, so meh. It is a pretty bad Aspect. Bosses do not count as Unstoppable innately.
  • Conceited does not seem to be working properly. I honestly don’t think it works at all. You are better off putting something else in its place.
12

You are missing vulnerable. You could slap on 100% vulnerable dmg and you’ll see a noticeable increase in your dmg. Every 100% is multiplying your dmg by another one. So vuln 100% = x2 200% = 3 300% = 4, etc.

So essentially, what makes double swing so good is having perma vuln on a target. I too used to use the berserk buff and couldn’t beleive how much better the vuln buff was. Granted, there are other ways to apply vuln like the talent that gives core skills up to 30% or the bleed basic attack has a 15% chance, but DS is the most reliable.

The shear strength of vuln is exactly why I hate the stat so much. It’s basically required to have which means if you don’t have it, or have a reliable way to apply it then your dmg is pooh pooh level.

13

I am also running DS in my build and what helped me do alot more damage was to understand the damage bucket system there is in D4. I think Rhykker explains it quite well here (Major Shift in Diablo 4 Damage Bucket Theory: Introducing Damage Decks! - YouTube)

Basically there are 5 buckets;

  • Crit damage.
  • Vul damage.
  • Core stat (Strength for barb).
  • [x] % damage from either skill tree, legendary aspects and paragon board (you can see the
    [x] if you enable “advanced tooltip information” in gameplay settings).
  • and the big bucket with all the (damage to X, damage while Y, damage when Z … ect)

you should aim to have the same (high) amount in each.

In your case all the multipliers (except crit damage) you mention are in the same damage bucket and, as already mentioned, some are not even “active” in the damage calculation in some situations (f.x. damage to unstoppable targets). Try getting more in the other damage buckets. Also try getting as many of the “Damage while/on/to” that are “always active” for your build where you can. For my barb this would be “while berserking”, “to bleeding”, “to close targets”, “while fortified” - but not as much “to stunned” because mobs are not always stunned.

Hope it make sense :slight_smile:

14

Calls them likes I sees them.

15

Guys - OP asked a question. We can help him abit with his specific build whilst pointing him to the wider double swing thread (really good resource).

To your specific build

  • Barrier aspect bonus is inconsistent. The only way for barbs to have consistent barrier is Termity and that is not a great one
  • Standing still is ok but double swing requires quite alot of movement as it does not have the HOTA quake AOE aspect.
  • Damage to unstoppable targets is highly unreliable. It only happens when they have the broken chains above their heads and that occurs when they have been chainstunned / cc for too long

In short your choice of damage aspects is suboptimal. Personally I would go for

  • Edgemasters (20%)
  • Limitless Rage (30%)
  • Retribution (40%)
  • Accelerating Aspect (25% attack speed)

Above figures are for 1h so double the bonus for 2H.

Lastly the reason why you take forever to takedown walls is because you cannot stun it and get back fury. We are very reliant on stuns to obtain fury back to spam and we cannot stun walls.

16

This needs to go up, plus what’s your vulnerable damage %?

17

Exploiter’s works on objectives.

18

Hey guys, thanks for trying to help, i fixed it by going over my talents really. And the reason why my DS was low, was a missing talent. I guess you all know wich one was missing. My DS crits went from 40k to 200k crits with each blade by 1 talent :rofl: still got zero vcd. But i can speedrun 70+ nmds and objects are fine now.

Though i dont really feel anyone has a good answer as to why all these other modifiers dosent matter? Wich was the thing i was trying to understand to begin with (why they work so well on thorns, but not ds). I knew from start the most optimal damage modifiers was chd and vcd for ds cause i follow alot of content creators.

But i was trying to create my own passive damage build (pure thorns damage) that would flatline people in pvp instead of copying others homework. I hope this also explains the 50% barrier damage and the 50% damage to unstoppable? I was relying on people killing themselves without me needing to hit them (because other thorn barbs hurt alot) thats why i didnt want to invest in vcd. But the 320% berserker damage works really well now after the patch.

Anyways to sum it up. For pvp I used to pop wrath of the berserker + 3 shouts + iron skin for the damage reduction and barrier effect, i dont use those bad pants. (And stupid as i was i used same rotation in nmds because iam apparently a slave to habits) even though iam used to switch DS for rend when there is another good barb.

I just replaced wotb with ur and DS works fine in NMDs now.