It seems to be a frequent statement of malcontent among pretty much anyone. Just wondering if there’s anyone that actually enjoys it? With all the negative feedback on this mechanic why did they stick to it?
Edit:
Some feel the implementation of it is what is flawed rather than it existing, especially the lack of resources. D2 had an early resource problem with low stamina in the start, or sorc with no mana and guzzling potions non stop. Except you can’t use a mana potion or stamina potion now. There’s nothing like runewords with auras to fix this early either. In Diablo IV it’s like those early struggles are all game long and baked into the game. You have to get GG gear and even then you prob have resource issues.
I’m still loving this game but I think this is such a universal criticism that maybe something should be done.
Because they are stupid and they never play their own games.
I mean, for crying out loud, they copy/pasted entire classes & skill trees from a 23yo fossil of a game instead of coming up with new classes or improved versions at least. All this time on their hands and this is the crap they came up with. Copy/paste.
Builder-spender isn’t inherently bad but the damage and gameplay is shifted way too much in favor of the spender which makes the builder feel bad. There’s a reason the meta builds are the meta for WT3+. They basically just use a cooldown and pop a few groups at once before they go out of resource, then wait. Pack to pack fighting feels bad because you spend most of your gameplay spamming a zero damage generator.
The main issue is viewing the system as “builder + spender”.
The basic sets things up. Rogue combo points is the most blatant and obvious.
Instead of viewing the basic as a “whatever” or throwaway skill to avoid because it doesn’t do the damage of a core spammable, view it as a utility skill to weave into your rotation.
As a ranged rogue, using a builder with combo points is somewhat rewarding, but you need two legendary aspects to capitalize on it (increased damage for the next core skill + attack speed for basic attacks), you cannot boost builder damage in any meaningful way, the base damage is low, the only affix for it is just increased, you get hundreds of that.
Also the two ranged builder skills are too slow, even with some attack speed, you need also a bow to not feels it totally sucks to build the three combo points.
That might be a way to make it feel less bad to use builders
I mean rotating in the system is something you do sure, the question is if it’s enjoyable or not. Also what about the times where the optimal rotation isn’t possible due to whatever situation. You have to carefully group enemies and engage in ways that let you do your rotation and the idea of a rotation is kind of, idk. Anti fun in some ways. You have all these cool things and if you don’t use them in a certain way repeatedly then it’s less good.
Right now I build up 3 combo points and a group of enemies, camo + imbue, twisted 2x and get one of them to be a guaranteed crit, dash through as many as I can, and do a twisted for clean up and teleport on the other side again with my back stab. Then I repeat.
I want to play sorc but i hear horror storries about mana issues and using 2x mana bars to clear a trash group.
level 56 frost sorc here and its a pooshow…pop nova spam shards wait pop nova spam shards wait pop nova spam shards wait. pretty boring…no ones using basic in wt3 they dont generate mana the cooldown basic got nerfed to oblivion the animation is the exact same for all three types and it becomes super annoying to even use it after a while I would rather run around waiting on cooldowns than touch a basic skill…thankfully the build does melt the tiny mobs we face
Not at all. bLizard be like “We think mana potions are dumb, get rid of them!” since D3. Meanwhile mana pots still worked fine in PoE, or at least till we build enough regen to stop using them
Tbh, resource regen is a whole can of worms. To create unique class diversity they made some classes build their resource while some regen by themselves. End up having this issue with the former being a pain to play.
The issue lies with mob design. If they don’t do so much CC every 3 secs or constantly running away resource building wouldn’t be a huge issue especially for melee classes
That is where I start. Blade Shift for Daze or defense? Invigorating Strike for Lucky Hit or Vulnerability?
Blade Shifting for the Daze would allow you to occasionally utilize “Aspect of Uncanny Treachery” for a free Stealth if you Shadow Step the same target. Or hit it with Dash.
After all, Blade Shift is a basic, but it doesn’t affect the resource at all.
Because we have a glaring lack of damager variety & interesting legendary powers that change how a skill works. No skill runes, no alternate element versions, nothing. Everything plays the same.
And it’s all the same crap from D2 that we’ve all already played to death. Which is why it all feels like “been there done that”.
Stupid idiots actually thought giving us LESS skills to choose from is a good idea. Then again they also thought copy/pasting classes & all skills from a 23yo fossil was also a good idea…I rest my case.
Builder+Spender used to be the Barb’s unique mechanic. Not sure who at the design table said “We should make all classes like that!”, but they should’ve been thrown out the door.
Correct. But not for every class in every game. Which is how it is here.
It CAN add complexity. It’s not doing that in D4, though.
It’s awful. The generator to spender ratio is way off too. They also never intended you to not take a generator because there are no passives in the tree.
The point though of this post was " Does anyone like builder + spender playstyle?".
The complaint should not be about liking build+spend, which many people do in fact like, the real complaint and discussion should be instead how to fix the build/spend balance rather than just complain that build+spend sucks, which just shows either ignorance of what build+spend is, or a laziness on complainers part… meaning not taking the effort to actually focus on the real problem just ranting about the end affect.
