This is my second post on the forum, although I have not shared my disagreement with the direction in which the game is going on the forum like many others, it is certainly frustrating.
Diablo 4, when you compare it with other games of the genre, has many flaws, although it also has things that others don’t (although they are not things that make a positive difference in the gameplay).
Since the game came out, the developers have insisted on buffing certain skills and nerfing all the others, which creates a very clear ‘‘meta’’ in each season and when you compare it with other games of the same type, it lacks variety.
Comparison:
Diablo4: A simple skill tree, builds hard meta if you want to do all the content. Items modification? poor. Unique? With the meta so marked in this game, the number of uniques within the meta are not much.
Path of Exile: Hundreds of build variables, although there is something like a micro meta you can really make up all the content with an impressive variety of builds. This is actually because in POE the skills are not locked by classes and the modification of items with dozens of different editing variables and forms, where you can basically create the perfect item for you.
Last Epoch: like Diablo4, it has a skill tree, but the modification of the skills is amazing, since each skill has its own internal skill tree, which allows you to even change the element of a skill without external items. The items are good.
Torchlight Infinite: Similar to POE, there is no fixed skill tree, rather the classes are distinguished by their passive abilities, a wide variety of unique items, and a good level of item modification. You can make all the content with a wide variety of builds.
I’m sure there are more to compare but I don’t have the time to play all the games on the market in depth.
Recapitulating: I am a big fan of the genre and I play it every time I have time and it is a little frustrating that in Diablo 4 I am almost forced to do 1 of the meta builds if I want to play well and have fun. That, in addition to the bad decisions regarding gameplay and the poor content, gives me a very bad feeling when I think about the future of the Diablo franchise.
I think that Blizzard could do better, they are letting themselves be beaten by games that were created inspired by their game.
PS: I know that many will not agree with my comparison, for them I want to say that my intention is not to contradict whatever you believe or make you change your mind, I simply want to let this out of my chest.
All the best.
4 Likes
I kind of am just looking at the whole genre as sus… It has barely evolved in something like 24 years and it’s pretty scarily stagnant. ARPGs have variations in skill systems and how items are handled, but aside from that are really kind of lacking a ton of distinction.
I hoped they would try something different with D4 and it actually was more promising (to me personally) at beta and launch than it is now because it’s starting to feel less and less distinct from D3. Honestly D3 had a lot of great ideas like “usable user interface that showed you potential outcomes before you enchanted” and “ability to experiment with builds and extend replayability” but the combat is worn out for me.
I think the future for basically all of these games as long as they keep chasing each other is to be a little niche in a pond for players who like mashing buttons, picking up stuff and grinding away. That’s fine, I still enjoy this as kind of a guilty pleasure.
The pupil is supposed to surpass the master, not imitate them for the rest of their lives though.
I’m not honestly looking forward to any ARPG coming out compared to what’s coming out for other action genres. I want a Darktide expansion (congratulations on finishing the game a year late now give me more), more Cyberpunk, more Witcher. I’d like more narrative freedom and passion like Baldur’s Gate and please keep the indie games with unbelievable gameplay rolling, because the last few years of indie games have been amazing.
With ARPG, I’d like the genre to maybe show me it’s actually still alive at this point.
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this is something i don’t understand. I haven’t followed meta ever, and i have had fun and played with minimal struggle. The only struggle is the absurd time it takes to get gear that is not trash or materials to refine gear. So luck of rng can hold me back at the endgame push. So idk i don’t 100% follow your logic here. Even to make a meta build with bis gear i need streamer level hours and grind with some rng luck to make it happen.
So while D4 i agree has flaws i am not so sure i see the comparison.
Skill tree might be simple but we have boards and glyphs and i feel the exploration there is pretty good for out the box thinking builds.
My issue with D4 is like D3 the grind is OTT time consuming wise, D2’s magic find would help so much, with out it , it just feels like gambling and i hated that about D3.
If they fixed this, the game imo would be much better. I felt like a hoarding trash sorter in D3 endgame and same with D4 and it’s not a fun system. D4 is better for me, because at least there is more interest in build creation through theory crafting and not sets.
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I would say the majority on these forums argue all the time about class balancing. We all know about the charge barb this season, and the HOtA barb last season, LB sorc, Tibault Rogues, S1 bone spear Necros, etc. It’s always a work in progress and it’ll be a while before we see any real balance.
We’ll see what changes in S4, no doubt a few more broken builds will rise, then S5, then S6, and then the expansion. Or maybe the expansion after S5, who knows, regardless you’re going to be waiting a while for balance changes.
That being said you can play a number of various builds that can clear NMD 100 quite easily. The ultimate meta builds you find on various sites are usually also inaccurate. There’s a really fun Bone Spear/Spirit build going around that’s been hilariously fun, but trying to find it on any “meta” site will show you a half-baked bone spirit build instead. Build what you want, if it works great, if it doesn’t, look for alternatives.
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You are absolutely not forced to.
I have played every season with my own builds and don’t cheapen the game by looking up guides. Why would you pay $100 to watch some nerd with a webcam play your game for you? That is a self inflicted problem. Every build I have made is viable, even strong, and if it isn’t I figure out why it isn’t and rework it. That is how these games are meant to be played.
The game has issues beyond that for sure.
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No, the developers say that only meta builds work well in end game dungeon content and it’s a thing i tests all the necro build in the game and no one it’s better that bone spear build.
With sorcerer, although in the case of sorceress the meta changes with each season. First ice build, then in second season electrics. If you compare it with any other build, the difference is abysmal in dps.
I don’t think i need to say something of the barbarian has much to say with how broken the current meta is.
I haven’t used druid this season but in the previous one the Earth element was the meta I tried everything yes and definitely the most dominant among all.
Rogue, the truth is, I’ve barely tried it so I don’t have an idea.
How would they know they play in WT1.
What do you mean by end game AoZ? or NM100? AoZ was supposedly made for the broken builds.
lol dude says ARPG’s are dead and sus but spends a MASSIVE amount of time defending literally the worst iteration of the genre…
Make this make sense 
Where did I defend it? ^^;
Learn to read please lol
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Oh and this is why the forums are the true d4 endgame. Laughed so hard at this 
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I agree you’re not forced to play a meta build, but it tends to turn out that way for most people. They start experimenting with their character, realize there’s maybe 4-5 ways to play it and then start gearing towards one play style- totally unaware they’re playing 95% the same as some meta-build guide they’ve never read.
2 Likes
I did it too for AoZ. Not meta build, but I avoided BL all season, then after NM100 I added the skill into my build for the additional damage.
I usually play what I find fun to 100 then tweak for power without destroying the build synergy completely.
Or else you never find new things. Like this season, I am playing a build no one else is, on theory alone it was funny, and it is actually effective too.
I agree in terms of the skill tree, customization, and build variety. D4 can do better. They can improve if they want to.
One thing I like about D4 compared to LE and PoE (I played all 3 but I had most time investment in D4 so far) is the animation, graphics, and console support. These are better in D4. But are these enough? Nope, I want more.
I agree with this. I see a lot of posts on various forums, and even chat in the game, by people who just play the game without following build guides and they are confused about why they are dying a lot and not doing much damage. The reply is almost always, “What build are you using? Which guide did you follow? Go to Maxroll”
I know that is just the world we live in where everyone has to get their opinion or choices from other people but it is a real issue with the game.
