Barbarian Paragon Board is Trash!

PC General Discussion
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I have been looking at datamined barbarian paragon boards and they look very interesting, however, some of their legendary nodes are very bad! Here are my thoughts on them, hope it helps!

Blood Rage legendary node triggers with 10% chance on killing a bleeding enemy and gives you 5 seconds of beserking. Wont that feel bad and unusable when it will really matter the most because on kill effects in general feel really bad and unreliable? Can we instead have 1-2 seconds of beserking and have it proc with 20-30% chance on a lucky hit on a bleeding enemy? Goal would be to replace relentless beserking aspect at endgame, which will otherwise every barbarian build need use to maintain dmg on bosses, which would in return make this legendary node useless. I dont think its a good design to have main passive class feature ability uptime be managed mainly by legendary aspect, and I dont think it would feel good looking at ur aspects late game to see that either.

Another legendary node I have issues with is Decimator. It has 8% chance to make an enemy vulnerable for 2 seconds with 2 handed weapon slashing attacks on a lucky hit. I feel thats quite underpowered. In case you are using a core skill, which on most barb builds will be most of the time, skill “Pressure Point” at lvl 1 will actually outperform Decimator, as it has 10%, and then 30% at level 3, to make enemy vulnerable for 2 seconds when hit with core skills on lucky hit. I think it make sense that legendary paragon node outperforms at least 1.5 to 3 points put in skill tree? For the record, Pressure Point is quite unreliable way of applying vulnerability already, so nerfing it to make legendary node feel better would not be the right call I think. Can we instead have it buffed to 20-30%?

I think rest of legendary nodes are really good (Weapon Master does look underwhelming). Considering glyphs:

I think Mortal Draw is far 2 strong. Nerf it, both passives. Swapping weapons crit chance to maximum of 10%, and skill that swap to a different weapon at lvl 20 should give a maximum of 5% increased dmg per bonus 5 dex, probably less, if it scales the way I think it does. (I think it adds on All damage scaling, therefore I think its a multiplicative scaling which is already very op, of course if thats the case).

Rare glyph Seething, second passive, while wielding a sword, you get 3 fury if u kill an enemy. Nobody is ever going to pick that glyph, even if your build needs fury. This is not a reliable enough generator and it feels really bad. As previously mentioned, on kill effects in general feel really bad and unreliable. maybe add a lucky hit mechanic that generates fury on hit or just straight up give us fury on hit instead. Gain 1 fury on lucky hit with sword, 2 fury if enemy was bleeding, would be really good way to go about it.

Most of other glyphs look fine. Hope this helps!

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I haven’t really looked into Barb ones, but sorcerer ones are mostly nice, but nothing super amazing except a couple. I think the legendary powers are meant to be a legitimate choice and it may be worth investing more in glyphs and skipping the powers for some builds.

On the one hand, it would be nice if legendary powers were super OP, but then that means they are a must have, which can get boring. For my build, legendary powers will be for as my character gears up, but I may drop them in favor of glyphs down the road once i’ve leveled then in nightmare dungeons because they have better scaling.

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If this was the case it’ll be godlike! It’s a 10% chance to get Berserking if you kill a bleeding enemy. If they make a “one hit” effect that legendary would be far to strong to not take it even if they reduce the Berserking time to 1 second.

having a 30% and a 10% chance to trigger vulnerable isn’t that bad after all. If they make it more powerfull noone would spend skillpoints on Preassure Point.

The legendary is trash if you don’t play a swapping build what is a possibility but niche. Then again the board has some of the best rare nodes in it so it’s very epic by itself.

The barbs legendary nodes are underwhelming if you compare it to other classes options BUT I’m happy with it. Less incetive to waste paragon points into useless crap nodes opens up more room for very good glyphs. To me this sounds like more freedom then wasting 10 points each board to get to all the “must have” legendary nodes.

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I feel like the paragon boards overall are trying to be more complex than they are. In the end, are just simple multipliers.

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The effects are relatively simple to understand, but that’s probably a good thing since the decision making is daunting. Even if you had a guide to the optimal board, playing to the optimal end game build/gear isn’t necessarily the best path while leveling and gearing up a character.

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Nearly all of the paragon boards are trash because of how the game is designed.

Every build is going to rely on chasing similar multipliers if you want to do big damage. Most builds won’t be viable at all unless they gain a big power boost from a legendary or unique item.

The first talent tree for every class is also way too simple and lacks meaningful choices because most of the options are really quite bad.

The game is going to be a mess on launch and players looking for build diversity are going to be very disappointed when they see very class is using the same exact multipliers to boost their damage profiles.

It’s amazing that they could release the game like this, but it’ll sell on brand name alone while they spend several years trying to make builds interesting and fun to play.

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Personally, I thought there would be more variety with the legendary nodes. But I guess these are the ones we got for now. Paragon boards are not build defining. They’re build locking. You choose one and that’s your playstyle forever. Here’s hoping we have options to splash legendary aspect to conpensate for the lack of build diversity.

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While you are probably right with everyone using similar glyphs and certain aspects to boost multipliers (Aspect of control probably heading toward a nerf), complaining about legendaries/uniques making builds viable seems like an odd complaint. That’s pretty much modern ARPGs.

When I was playing D2R, the character sucked until you got basic rune words. If you are going to play in higher difficulties, you need gear. In D2, you had to get enough +resist to even survive nightmare/hell. At least having to get legendary powers is more fun that getting +resist all.

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I’m just going to wait until we actually get our hands on it and make judgements then. Actual data will always be better than theorizing.

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Its not 30% and 10% (actually 8%). This comment makes me think u dont know how lucky hit works. So let me explain. On all core skills its effectively between 5% and 15% and then 1.5% and 4%. I will give u ww case, since its the one I am going to play. It has 25% lucky hit chance base. So there is effectively 7.5% and 2% to trigger 30% chance on lucky hit and 8$ chance on lucky hit effects, so if it works additively, which is a better scenario, u have less than 10% chance per hit to apply vulnerability. So ur statement is not true at all. If they make it 30%, u would end up having 15% chance per hit to apply vuln with ww, counting its added additively, which is again, a better scenario, otherwise its like 12%. U can get this number higher if u invest in lucky hit mechanic, but lets be honest, at endgame u probably wont have more than 20-30% of it even if u invest of it… which would make the number 20%-30% bigger which would still be less than 20% per hit. so even if u take both, at endgame, once ur builds are fully maxed, u would not be able to keep enemy under vuln effect for more than 80% of time efficiently even if u take both “pressure points” and upgraded “decimator”. Do you not understand why effectively 2% chance to make enemies vulnerable is not good enough for a legendary node?

my bad, I forgot to mention 10% chance part. I will edit that now.
I am not saying make it on hit. I am saying make it trigger with lets say 20-30% chance on LUCKY hit for 1-2s, I think 1.5s would be ideal myself, which is actually around as much beserk duration on mobs, maybe a bit less on average, but lets u make use of this node on bosses, 2. On ww, with 30% chance, that would be every 12-13th attack on average, going all the way down to 10th at pure endgame.

Main reason why I am using ww as example is because a) as I said already, I plan on playing it b) It is most reliable lucky hit chance applies on barb. So everything else will feel even worse.

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I don’t know wtf you’re looking at. The barb paragon tree is easily the most interesting to me, and by a huge amount.

I seriously question the theory crafting ability of some of you. I’ve been geeking out on the barb’s paragon board constantly, and the synergies between paragon, skills, and gear is incredible. I honestly think you can get more specific with the barb’s build than any other, although I haven’t looked into the other boards nearly as extensively.

There are barb builds that are seemingly unbeatable only 3 paragon pages in. Granted, I’m thinking about PVP, but what’s the point in making a character insane at PVM when you can’t even trade?

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Oh no, rares and stuff is amazing, title is a clickbait, I just want them to do smth with those legendary nodes that feel less valuable than magic nodes, let alone rare ones. U would have probably noticed that if you read the post…

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Ah, that makes more sense, lol.

I get that, honestly. I was thinking I wouldn’t go any further than 3-4 pages in because the rares are incredible and the legendaries basically run out pretty rapidly.

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d4builds.gg/builds/cd9d95b5-266b-4b8d-a58b-bbbd7f61838d heres my build, I think its pretty minmaxed. If they dont change blood rage passive at all, u might wanna drop that and get “craving” rare node on blood rage board as well as “beserking” on carnage board, but thats basically it… Hoping they do smth about that so u get to replace relentless beserking aspect with aspect of disobedience or aspect of numbing wrath. In case u would be feeling like u need more dmg, u can move movement aspect to boots, current boots aspect to now free chest and then use amulet for a damage aspect, or even put a defensive one there. I feel like I want my movement with 50% bonuses there myself

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You just miss one “important” rare node. “Hunter Killer” in the “Weapon Master” board offers a whooping 16% dmg vs elites and another 16% on top if you have enough dex and it’s reachable for 10 points while the magic nodes of the cluster offers even 25.5% more dmg to elites for 2 point investment more. 57.5% more dmg vs Elites is a lot to pass on for 12 points if the node makes it to the live version without beeing nerfed.

On top of that I would use skulls rather then diamonds in the jewelery because half of your armor gets translated to all resi anyway and at least in the tests this yieled a better reward after all because so far we haven’t only taking pure elemental dmg so far outside of Ashava maybe where a pure poison resi build helped a lot. Then again this is something to look at in a few days when everyone is level 100 and we know the scaling better.

BTW I’ll never theory craft a buildwith uniques. I keep them in mind and only add legys because if anything is true about the low drop rates Blizz will go for 4 uiniques in one build is a bit much :smiley: . Then again if you feel lucky more power to you.

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maybe you just lack imagination and creativity.

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You gotta make a TL DR buddy, no one is going to read all of this. Its a wild rant.

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As I’ve been saying for a long time, this is just wrong info. The game is all about conditionals. Find the conditionals that work with your build, use the paragon board to found things out. For instance, a build with double swing that has plenty of ability to keep up berserk has no use for that legendary node that adds berserk, whereas other damage skills that struggle to gain berserk may find it very useful.

You’re responding to the trolliest of trolls on here. He will claim that since everyone will take something that says +damage, they’re all the same. It’s not an honest attempt at a discussion, none of his posts ever are.

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if u r not interested in reading posts, why are u even on forums?

If damage categories are the way content creators are saying they are, and my assumption is that exploit gylph counts towards the same category (damage to/damage vs), and not towards vulnerable dmg category, it would not be even 4% more dmg to elite mobs, so it would not be worth taking. but we will see tmr when they bring out their findings and Ima update my paragon accordingly.

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Loving my Rend barb build, currently lvl 57 and theory crafted lvl 100.

I like the feel of my build and do agree, I am passing up on 4 or 5 of the 6 legendary nodes that I could obtain. I feel the nodes are underwhelming compared to glyphs and rare nodes.