4 Devs, 5 Classes

Sorcerer
1

Obviously there’s more Developers behind the scenes, but I think a MAJOR issue with the campfire is there was no Developer to represent Sorcerer, the most useless class in D4 at the moment.

We needed a class developer up there detailing just how they’re going to fix this trash can tier class. The only class that has no synergy among uniques, no survivability, no builds above B tier, and worst of all, the class that has to wait for cooldowns while everyone else can stomp their way through everything.

11 Likes
2

And don’t forget the non existent resource generation.

The whole class is based around constantly smashing 4 defensive cooldowns just to survive and spamming the same boring spender, Ice Shards, because it’s the only one that has synergy with the rest of the toolkit. It’s not even ridiculous, it’s pathetic.

13 Likes
3

Have people tried other builds? The game’s been out two weeks. Charged Bolt, for example, was fun in D2. Haven’t even seen the spell mentioned let alone seen a build around it. Is it really completely inviable?

I’m still levelling in WT2, Act 3 level 50, but having no mana issues with Ice build. I barely use ice shards - blizzard seems to get the job done (I got lucky to get the +1 Avalanche aspect).

I did try fire and it was garbage though.

1 Like
4

It’s not like there are many skills to begin with, so yes, people have collectively tried everything. Sorc has precisely one viable build, one viable strategy, and even that does at least 10x less damage than other classes at endgame, and can’t solo clear endgame content like they can.

As far as charged bolt, what made it fun in D2 was that you could pump loads of skill points into it and it kept on scaling both its damage and number of projectiles. Blizzard seem to have become allergic to scaling in D4, at least as far as the player is concerned, they seem very happy to let the monsters scale up and get continuously stronger.

3 Likes
5

I’ve tried nothing but other builds. I have not once played an Ice Shards build because I can’t stand the skill, visually or mechanically. Problem is they are all virtually untenable once you hit T4. Of course at that point everything is because Sorcerers are so squishy you HAVE to take all 4 defensive abilities which leaves no room for any actual builds. You just have one free slot and by far the best thing that you can pick for it is Ice Shards.

1 Like
6

Nope.

They say they have, and they might have switched some skills, but they didn’t bother trying.

Just hit WT4 at level 63, with an Incinerate fire build. Minimum enemy level is 73, which is 10 levels higher.

I can’t facetank as much and I do less damage, but I am also still 10 levels lower AND haven’t upgraded to Ancestral gear yet. But I am still leveling in WT4 because it’s faster right now.

7

Basically all the damage legendaries you can get work off of having a barrier or a barrier and some condition

Devs just need to sit down and play all the classes / builds on nm 100 solo

2 Likes
8

Mate…
You barely touched down on the endgame. killing 10lvl higher mobs is not an achivement. You are still extremly far off of the place, where a mob just needs to look in your general direction and your character turns into past-tense.

2 Likes
9

The fourth is Fire Shield? I’m getting by fine with Blizzard but then again I’m very early game.

So you run TP, FN, Ice Shield, Fire Shield, Ice Shards and Frost Bolt? Surely you have to have a basic skill due to mana issues?

10

“Incinerate is bad even in WT1”
“It’s worthless in WT2”
“Yeah, you may be able to use it in WT3, but WT4 will show you!”
“It may work in WT4, but you just barely touched the endgame…”

The point I am making is that you guys are absolutely clueless. Go back to your Ice Shard build. I’ll let you guys know when I ACTUALLY hit a wall.

11

Tbh, I don’t see there being a situation where Sorc doesn’t have a dev. It was so well designed in the closed betas, but then they took a nerf hammer and it just feels clunky.

What I felt was more damning was that the director only plays on console. That does explain the game missing a lot of QoL on PC. And some hilarious things like mouse range affecting mount speed.

1 Like
12

I’ve seen you involved in a few discussions, and I agree with the general feeling that the goalpost keeps getting moved.
For one, I’ll agree that most skills are viable for WT3, maybe even early WT4.
Some will require more precise building / itemization than others in order to simply clear the content, but that’s to be expected I guess.

That said, I’ve got a level 80 sorc, and things are definitely complicated if you wish to experiment with different builds.
In D2, you have to be precise because respeccing is very limited.
Here you get the sense that you can respec, but honestly just skipping the campaign and starting over so you get the opportunity to level glyphs / upgrade gear / get a feeling for your new build seems like a better approach.

The issue is that the difficulty floor keeps getting raised as you level up, so not gaining power on a level-up is actually losing power. And no, a travel node on a paragon board is not exactly a power-up.

The above is true for all classes of course. It’s simply underwhelming to raise a skill’s level to +12 and have trash mobs completely shrug it off because you haven’t devoted 100% of your build to it. Maybe it’s simply having wrong expectations, but I think the point about the difficulty floor doesn’t help.

One small question: how did you solve mana for incinerate ?
I’ve tried a few things, but save for rolling +mana on gear, +50 elixir and stacking %lucky to restore XX% of primary resource and %generation, I don’t see how that can be done.
Maybe you don’t actually need infinite mana just yet though.

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There is no concern or representation because sorcerers are fine for regular content.

In my experience, almost any build is viable in WT4 (equal-level content) IF you have good gear. Even NM sigils 3 levels above your character are doable without much difficulty. In fact yesterday I took all points out of ice shards, put them into charged bolt, and ran a sigil 5 levels above me and finished it in like 8 minutes (It was a Tier 43, Maulwood). I put no skill points in any other lightning skills and didn’t touch my paragon board, which does not even include a lightning board.

You could run helltides and world content all day with pretty much any build. But if you start talking about pushing high tier NM, there is one viable sorcerer build and it is leagues behind other classes in terms of DPS and survivability.

1 Like
14

I believe the classes need to be balanced. I also believe we need to give Blizzard REAL information. The blanket whining in every thread is pretty much worthless, as is calling every skill pointless without any real testing. People want Sorc balanced, but they haven’t given Blizzard any real information to work with.

People confuse Incinerate with Disintegrate. The only similarity they have is being a channel. Incinerate is a burn multiplier, not a skill you just channel on everything until you run out of mana.

Aspect of Conflagration is important. The codex version is the same as if the Capstone was working and everything had 5 unique burns. 20% to all your burning damage while channeling, including incinerate damage itself, regardless of whether Incinerate is hitting it or not.

Since incinerate is a burn itself, so it also procs the Fire Wall enchant. Incinerate is also far larger and easier to direct against groups of enemies, so proccing even more fire walls is easy.

As for the mana cost itself, you only need a bit of reduction from gear. Fire passive gives you 15% off when standing still, which you have to do anyway. If something dies by burning, it’s 30% more mana per second with another passive, or 3 mana per second. iirc, I am at 18 mana per second, while base regen is 10 per second, so I am only really losing 8 mana per second of channeling.

I use “Assimilation Aspect” which gives 8% chance to dodge, when I dodge I get 6 mana (5-10). I’m at 10% dodge with it and I facetank, so it helps.

But then again, I also toss out a couple fire walls and fire bolts (Level 5 is a 53% burn over 8 seconds) to round things up before I channel.

I will be honest though. WT4 has reduced my mana regen significantly. I can’t face tank as much and basic enemies aren’t burning to death as fast, so my mana regen is choking. I expect it to get back up to normal when I upgrade to Ancestral.

15

Drop the basic for the ice ultimate. Basic does such piss damage and by then barely tickles the mana issue. Plus you don’t have time to cast a basic, that hits 1 enemy, when you’re being swarmed by faster and smarter AI.

16

sorc is great until you get to high tier nm dungeons or uber lilith. aka actual hard content.

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They had 9 class designer which a mention in the epilog with name.

1 team leader, and 8 person who designed the classes.

The question is, if this 8 person only designed current 5 classes, or if they already designed class 6-8 for DLC.

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Again, I don’t run the Ice Shards build but for the record it consists of all 4 defensives, IS, and a single flex slot which either goes to an ultimate (the Frost or Fire ones depending on whether or not you have the unique chest) or Meteor so you can proc paralyze and burn on demand. It does not use a basic skill because with enough mana cost reduction rolls on your gear Ice Shards can be spammed indefinitely; or otherwise by running the Avalanche passive.

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So basically, you are running your own variation of an incinerate build, just hit WT4 and called everyone else clueless earlier in this thread. Grats on running your own build, but you aren’t even in the realm of discussion here in regards to whats being discussed, which is sorc endgame viability.

Feel free however to think folks haven’t tried incinerate variations on actual endgame content and been unable to get it to be feasible in the realm of what it should be verse what it should do.

1 Like
21

I’m currently clearing nightmare 45 pretty easy, not even drinking potions. Obv I’ve build and yes super squishy but kill everything before it touches you is how it goes.

I agree that I wish I could use fireball for pvp or any other skills besides ice. Please do not nerf ice shards but instead buff fireball

Edit to add I’m lvl 86 and also I didn’t mean healing pots. I meant precision elixirs. I was using them but realized I only need to pop it when I’m struggling in a dungeon and not every single one