Thank you all for your help. Frozenhero1, your explanation that Taeguk’s damage multiplies, rather than adds, pretty well answers my question. I have switched over to Taeguk. All of the other replies were also helpful.
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It’s only good if you constantly use a channeling move and that armor is a really nice plus,not to mention easier to get higher percentage power than the bane of trapped.
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Please note that Taeguk’s damage bonus is additive. That means it combines additively with all other additive damage bonuses, and that total amount is then applied as a multiplier to your weapon damage.
There are two types of damage bonuses in D3: additive and multiplicative.
Generally, multiplicative sources of damage (known as multipliers) are separate and do not add together; they multiply the sum total of the previous multiplier, hence why they’re so strong and valuable. And generally, the more additive bonuses available to a build, the less valuable other additive sources (such as Taeguk) will be.
Since Taeguk’s bonus is additive, it’s generally less valuable than, say, the multiplier offered by Bane of the Trapped. But certain builds, mostly those that channel their skills such as Zodiac Rend or Firebird’s, can greatly benefit from Taeguk’s bonus. What gems you use will depend on your build, so check the relevant build guide for specific details regarding gem selection.
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I don’t believe this is accurate. Taeguk is only additive with +skill dam affixes on gear. It doesn’t get included with other additive bonuses (like +elemental dam). So while it is technically additive if you have +skill affixes, after that additive equation it multiplies your damage just like any other damaging legendary gem (or anything else that isn’t included in your sheet damage).
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Targuk is additive not only to + skills but also:
- Toxin Gem
- Strongarm bracer
- Odyssey’s End
- Falter
It is a good solo gem but heavily diminished with zdh + zbarb where both supports brings 260+ DIBS bonuses to grp making taeguk return = 4.3/3.6 = 19% return (assuming 150 gem) w/o considering +skills. While its a good solo gem, its very weak in grps with dedicated supports. Its benefits in those grps is +20% armor.
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Wrong…elemental damage is multiplicative and Taeguk is absolutely additive just like DIBS (eg: increases Multishot (or Hydra, Heaven’s Fury, etc.) by 15%).
See this excellent rework by Iria of the Additive vs Multiplicative Damage post from the OG forums :
And while it’s a DH perspective, the base information is valid for any class.
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Um, that guide states elemental damage is additive.
I’m not sure what you mean by “+elemental damage,” but the elemental damage % found on bracers and amulets is multiplicative. Taeguk is additive and its total amount is added into the dibs category of damage bonuses for your total additive damage multiplier.
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I’ve never seen a Teaguk.
It’s all multiplicative, it’s just that some things are added together before their multiplication occurs. +elemental damage (amulet, bracers, etc.) is additive, in other words multiple sources of it are added together before they multiply. When that adding process occurs, there is diminished returns.
Then there are things that are exclusive multipliers, which are never added to anything else or diminished.
Exclusive Multipliers are:
Passive Skills
Legendary Bonuses
Set Bonuses
certain Legendary Gems
Additive Multipliers are:
+Elemental Damage affix
+Elite Damage affix
+Skill Damage affix
Resource Cost Reduction
Reduced Cooldown
That’s what I said in my original post:
Incorrect. The elemental % damage bonuses on bracers and amulets are multiplicative.
For more information, see this video by Wudijo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndtvFZXIF7E
See also the [gem entry on Maxroll (emphasis mine):
Mechanics
Gain 2% additive damage for 1.5 seconds when you spend resources with a channeling skill. This effect stacks up to 10 times. You can level this Gem all the way up to rank 150. Every upgrade will increase the additive damage by another 0.04% per stack up to a maximum of 8% total. Furthermore the rank 25 bonus increases your Armor by 2% for each stack. At max rank and stacks this Gem provides a whopping 80% additive damage increase as well as a 20% Armor buff.
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True, elemental damage is added up but then it’s multiplied (one doesn’t add Taeguk to elemental damage).
Also true depending on the context. I think Free means that the elemental damage multiplier is exclusive to other buffs (after you add it up).
This isn’t quite right. The first 2 are additive to themselves but then multiplicative. The +skill damage is in the DIBS category is additive with a lot of other things, so I agree with that one.
The last two reductions are not damage multipliers but rather follow a separate reduction formula (e.g. two items with 10% reduction each combine to make 19% reduction, not 20%). And when using Captain Crimson’s set, since cooldown reduction already has a multiplicative reduction formula, the damage bonus has double diminishing returns. On the other hand, resource cost reduction for toughness has no diminishing returns because of a cancellation effect.
This is the main reason I don’t like the term “additive” since there is some confusion in cases where you stack the same affix before multiplying (hence getting diminishing returns).
One prime example is the Unhallowed Essence 6-piece bonus in that the damage multiplier is multiplicative with all other sources of damage for Multishot and the other relevant skills. However, one must add up all the discipline before multiplying the bonus to your damage.
As long as buffs are in different buckets, then they are multiplied together, and you just need to add things in the right buckets. The most prominent bucket is the “DIBS” bucket (damage increased by skills) since a lot of modifiers are in it.
All of the following contribute to the DIBS category: buffs that increase DIBS in sheet details (and hence increase sheet DPS), skill modifiers like “Hungering Arrow damage increased by 15%” written in blue text on relevant items like belts/pants/quivers, and monster debuffs (e.g. Strongarm’s Bracers, Toxin gem, etc.).
To answer the original OP, the Taeguk bonus is in this DIBS category so it encounters a lot of diminishing returns, especially if combined with a zDH in the group providing a massive +150% from Odyssey’s End.
As a quick exception, while monster debuffs are additive with the DIBS category, they are multiplicative when dealing with thorns damage for some reason; this is why I distinguish Type B modifiers in my guide separately.
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Sorry to correct you even further, but that’s not true for all passive skills. Examples are Archery (8% DIBS category) or “Big Bad Voodoo” (also DIBS).
That’s also not true for all legendary bonuses, for example
For example: If you knockback an enemy wearing Strongarms (30% more damage), and hit it with 30 stacks of Wojahnni (3000% more damage), you’ll deal 3030% more damage. These two bonuses are added together (making Strongarms useless in this scenario), not multiplied.
Back to topic: Taeguk is a strong gem for many channeling builds, unless you use e.g. Rapid Fire which uses another huge additive bonus on a key item for that build. The effect ist also much lower than expected in combination with a zDH using Odysseys (additive as well).
It’s something that’s only available in the British localisation of Diablo III.
At Rank 25 it gains the +Earl Grey, Hot, Black, Sugar, Slice of Lemon aura
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Also note that the description says when you spend resource whit the chaneling skill, otherwise it won’t proc. If i remember correctly.
When I make a barb for wastes, I will usually go gems that are, Taeguk, Goguk, and bane of stricken ^
Trapped is generally better than Gogok for that build.
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Gogok for toughness, traped for dmg.
One can actually see the Taeguk increasing your sheet damage while channeling, if you’ll (press c, by default) or open and then channel. Very handy, if you’re playing a build with a lot of sheet damage and/or you’re just a very high paragon level.
If you have 1kk damage and have a rank 150 taeguk, you’ll have 1.8kk damage sheet damage at 10 stacks. Not that amazing. However,
if you have 5kk sheet damage, with 10 stacks of rank 150 taeguk, it’ll be 9kk while channeling.
if you have 10kk sheet damage, it’ll be 18kk with that taeguk buff.
Plus, obviously an armor buff, that helps certain classes, like DH and Wizard a lot in higher GRs.
So, to simplify, if you do 100 damage, and 20% on bracer and 20% on amulet:
Additive means 100 * 1.4 = 140
Multiplicative means (100 * 1.2) * 1.2 = 144
Is that right?