The Future Of Diablo

[clueso-2790]

@Kilometer-11340

Because unlike most of the trash unique from D2, D3 legendary with legendary power > item with raw stat ala rare item.

It is not just legendaries in D3 being a bit better than rares, legendaries in D3 are being ridiculously and unnecessarily powerful.

Rare and magic items should be powerful and imo also BiS items in certain slots (not in every inventory slot, but in some), at least after they have been upgraded with a cube recipe that adds stuff to them.

I talk about this idea of rares and magic items being BiS in various posts that I left in this thread here, if you wanna check it out - which you don’t have to, it is just for reference.

[D4 Itemization] the more, the merrier? not always

while i really like the idea of giving many different stats and affixes to items to give the players a lot of different build choices, i think that it’s the wrong way of “balancing” something that was caused by something else, to increase the number of affixes on all those items ik, some people like the idea of legendary consumables but they DO cause a problem when it comes to memorability of items and rarities the problem they tried to solve: legendary powers are too strong and outpower other…

Rare and magic items being useful was for me and other players one of the more exiting things in D2, since it made these items actually have a use and worth looking for.

@Kilometer-11340

In D3, when you do not were a specific item, your build is totally non-competitive, while in D2, even if you do not were the best items, you build still can keep up with others (for the most part).

How is that a problem?

For various reasons:

• there are not several BiS items for each build in D3, which significantly reduced choice and customization options
• when you do not wear the right one and only legendary for a specific skill, then your char totally sucks, while in D2, even if you did not wear the BiS item, your build was not falling being much.
• the hunt for the BiS items actually took time and didn’t rain from the sky like legendaries in D3, …
• …which also ties in the fact that item progression was much more incremental in D2 than in D3.
• and maybe a few other reasons that I currently don’t think of.

@Kilometer-11340

D3 legendary is designed to be a powerful and build changer.

@Kilometer-11340

You don’t really expect that you should clear a harder content with trash or weaker gear, right?

Maybe it should be able to clear the same content, just slower.

It is good that legendaries are powerful, that is cool, but but they should not be so powerful that there is only one right legendary for each main skill - aka Skill X deals 800% increased damage - and these kind of special affixes are also really, really, boring.

@Kilometer-11340

Also, single element build is kinda unplayable if you don’t have Infinity in D2.

I totally agree with that. Monster Immunities were a bad design. High Monster Resistances would have been much better, because you still could deal at least a bit damage against enemies with just 75% [single resistance] than to an enemy that is completely immune to your damage type.

Having High Monster Resistances instead of Monster Immunities also opens up new ways of dealing with them and new gearing and character building options.

@Kilometer-11340

Isn’t this is the same for D3 as well? You started the game with blue, then you go for rare, and then you use any legendary available for you, and starting to aim for your class legendary item,

Not exactly.

• in D3 a legendary of the same level is basically by default better than a rare of the same level, because it rolls automatically with higher stats.
• in D2 magic items were also useful and powerful because although they rolled less affixes than magic items, they could roll with stronger affixes.
• In D2 a rare item could be better than a unique item of the same level (in specific slots, like boots, gloves, rings, etc) (for some builds) which made rare items at least worth taking a look at.

@Kilometer-11340

I don’t want an item with 10 filler stats like (+10 STR, +10 DEX). More stats don’t mean good.

There is a middle ground (as it is in almost everything).
Too much is not good, but neither is too little.
6 main affixes is fine for rares.

Also, D3’s main stats shouldn’t exist in the first place.
And in D2, what you call “filler stats”, like single resistances, where actually useful.

@Kilometer-11340

In D3, the Crit Chance + Crit Damage combo is way to prevalent.

Not true because CDR and IAS are important as well. Most of the time you will find yourself sacrificing CC or CHD for CDR or vice versa because finding a perfect jewelry that will roll CDR, CHD, CC and Socket is extremely difficult.

Sure the combo of crit damage of crit chance is way too prevalent. You basically can’t get enough of these and if it would roll on more slots you probably would take them there as well, while CDR (which also is too prevalent) you get as much as you need at a certain point, so even if you wanted more it will not have much of an effect.

One reason for why CDR is so prevalent is that self buffs like Wrath of the Berserker or Ignore Pain do not start their cooldown first once their effects have expired. This is already a feature on skills like Seven Sided Strike, Smoke Screen or Spirit Walk. If WotB, Ignore pain, Vengeance and other self buffs would have this feature as well, CDR would not be a must have affix, but rather one out of many choices.

LotD is a bit different due to mechanical reasons, but LotD probably should never have been in the game in the first place.

@Kilometer-11340

D3’s legendaries are skill specific, while uniques and RW’s in D2 where more generic, as in ‘benefiting various skills and builds’.

That is what making D3 legendary a legendary. Except for Enigma and Infinity and few powerful unique and RW, I probably don’t remember most of the unique names because they are so bland.

‘generic’ in this context is not equivalent to bland, but rather refers to ‘being useful for various builds and skills’.

You know, if you are a Hammer of the Ancients Barbarian, would you rather have the choice between

A: D3’s current legendaries

• Bastions Revered (more Frenzy stacks and hits + Frenzy AoE damage)
• Gavel of Judgement (800% increased damage to Hammer of the Ancients)
• Fury of the Vanished Peak (500% increased damage to Seismic Slam)
• Bul-Katho’s Sword Set (massive damage bonus to Whirlwind)

Or B: something like these:

• https://imgur.com/YOaPXLC
• https://imgur.com/iCLIWdW
• https://imgur.com/VdcXh9B
• https://imgur.com/JrrPyIx
• https://imgur.com/BTEz3jA

Sure, you may not like that these items have so many sockets (imagine the sockets away if you want, since they are besides the point) and the numbers on them might not be balanced too well and that there maybe be a bit too many affixes on them for your taste, but the point is that with these legendaries you actually have a choice for your HotA Barb and all of them would be viable.

Also, I would say that these legendaries might be lot, but definitely not bland.
Legendaries having a broader use for various builds and skills does not make them bland.

@Kilometer-11340

There is nothing wrong with maxing out everything as long as it is useful stat.

But if you have enough points to max out everything, then there isn’t really a choice.

@Kilometer-11340

If I don’t put the STR for the item I need to wear, I can’t wear it, thus my character can’t progress further. And after I invested enough STR, I can’t continue to dump it because this will lead to a brick character ala 99 STR for a Frozen Orb Sorc.

As I said, the Attribute System should have gotten a major overhaul in D3, instead of being replaced by the mainstat sytem.

Items should have no Attribute Requirements and attributes should have been more universally useful.

This here for example or something similar would have been a much better Attribute System:
https://imgur.com/yzDooUH

@Kilometer-11340

I don’t think he is suggesting to bring the flaws over to the next game, but rather to improve upon systems that had flaws instead of completely getting rid of them.

He outright saying that D2 endgame is better in his post. How is that an improvement upon system from his part? He just want D4 to be D2 HD.

I don’t speak for him, but I think that there are things that D2 did better than D3 and that there are also things that D3 did better than D2 and I personally would like to se D4 go in some ways more into a direction D2 (and also improve upone these) and in other ways more into a direction of D3.

I don’t think nvvr also does not want a 100% copy of D2, but just like many other D2 players who were disappointed by D3, he wanted to have a game that improves upon D2 and fixes its flaws instead of a D3 that removed a lot of the things that made D2 great.

@Steve-6849

So what is the max points for main stat and vitality?

You basically have an unlimited supply of points, while in D2 you only had a limited amount of attribute points and therefore the fact that VIT and mainstat being uncapped is irrelevant in this context.