Returning classes and gender

Lore & Story
1

It’s good news about the Zann Esu coming back for D4, but about the gender this would be a problem regarding the lore as the member of this clan are female only.
From what I know the Visjerei clan is in good term with the Zann Esu, at least Valthek liked Isandra (even if she died from the hand of a Viz-Jaq’ taar, the goal of Valthek wasn’t to see his friend get killed)
The thing is I don’t know what Blizzard intend to do about genders and classes, a male Sorcerer from the Visjerei clan would make sense, the skills and talents wouldn’t be very different from the Sorceress.
But about the Askari, Eastgate isn’t that far from the Dreadlands, so the Sightless Eye could have recruited some Demon-Hunters… But I can’t see how and why the Amazons would want train their males in combat.

Any thoughts anyone?

2

Actually their skills and talents wouldn’t have to be any different from their female counterparts.

Now regarding a bow class (assuming that’s the next class-type to be revealed), I can see a hunter or ranger archetype coming into play. That said I don’t see a problem with the Askari (amazon) making a comeback as there’s nothing within the lore (as far as I’m aware of) that suggests their men can’t fight.

3

I’m all for having gender exclusive classes again. It actually adds to the lore and world building by limiting what genders can do. And normal people won’t complain. Girls don’t care that they can’t play as a girl in Zelda and boys don’t care that they can’t play as a guy in Metroid. People play games to escape reality and be someone other than themself. Doesn’t matter the gender.

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4

Just like Diablo 3, classes in Diablo 4 won’t be gender exclusive.

5

It was confirmed months ago that the classes in D4 will not be gender-locked…

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6

That said I don’t see a problem with the Askari (amazon) making a comeback as there’s nothing within the lore (as far as I’m aware of) that suggests their men can’t fight

The only information we did have on Amazons directly prevents the idea of them training their men.

“In the Amazon culture, only the women serve as warriors, their intrinsic superior dexterity and lithe body structures are better suited to combat in the dense rainforest environs of the islands. Their society is far from stratified, however, as men are responsible for any number of positions in the community, government, and clergy, as well as merchant and agricultural occupations.”

Of course, the writers could have the Amazons do whatever they want. They could have them start training their men to fight. They could also have them put down their bows and spears and start becoming demon-worshiping witches. That doesn’t mean whatever they do will be consistent and faithful to the pre-established lore.

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7

That’s only saying that the Askari men don’t fight; not that they can’t, which is two different things.

8

Which the final paragraph in my post covered. The writers can have the characters do whatever they want. That is the nature of writing, but that doesn’t mean it will be consistent with the lore.

That said, the Amazon lore does say their fighting style was designed specifically around their female’s body structure, and, that the male’s body structure isn’t suited for it. So, in that sense, their men can’t be trained as Amazons.

9

If they did have male Askari fighting, then it wouldn’t exactly be inconsistent with the lore as it was never stated that their men can’t fight.

In Askari culture, only women serve as warriors, as their lithe bodies and superior dexterity are better suited than men for the dense jungles of their homeland.

Their women are better suited doesn’t mean that the men aren’t suited at all. Also that seems to pertain to only jungles like the ones within their homeland, the world of Sanctuary is vast, and there is more to the world than just jungle, meaning that the added capability due to the enviroment isn’t absolute.

Now if there was somewhere within the lore that stated that their men can’t fight or that only their women could utilize key Askari techniques that were essential for battle. Then I would definitely say Amazons as a playable class shouldn’t be added to the game without being genderlocked to female only. But as far as I’m aware of, there is no such info; as such having the Askari men able to fight wouldn’t really be going against the lore. In my opinion that is.

10

You’re being purposely obtuse. Of course, the men can fight. A paraplegic can be trained as an Amazon. That doesn’t mean it would be feasible. And the reason males being trained as Amazons isn’t feasible is because the lore established a specific body type for the fighting style.

11

And as I’ve already stated, that body type was only advantageous within certain areas (for example, jungles).

12

The only fighting style they have is the one they learned to use in the jungles. The men can’t use that fighting style in other environments if they’re unable to learn it in the first place. Any fighting style the men use would be an inherently different style or class than the Amazon. Unless, of course, Blizzard chooses to throw the lore out the window, which they probably will.

13

Considering that the Askari also happen to make journeys across the sea and are highly sought for as mercenaries due to them being incredibly cunning and skilled combatants, their fighting style definitely isn’t just apt to jungles. The jungles are certainly where they’re taught to fight and hunt, but that doesn’t make up their entire fighting style.

If blizzard decided on having the Amazon with both male and female choices, then that wouldn’t be throwing the lore out the window, because the lore never stated that their men couldn’t fight or couldn’t learn to fight; only that they don’t. That said, I doubt we’ll see the Amazon make a return, I believe we may see a Hunter or Rogue class instead.

14

I will guess the bow class will be some kind of Zakarum Ranger or something… I actually don’t want Blizzard to have too many nostalgia about old Diablo 2 (or 1) thingings.

15

LGBTQ. That’s the reason. I don’t mind uniqueness like Amazon’s. Yet wonder woman gets away with it cause women empowerment movement. Lots of double standards in society. Would really feel weird playing a Male Amazon. My opinion of course.

16

The main thing is that I wouldn’t want Blizz to screw up the lore, the Zann Esu & the Askari could train males but I would like to see many good reasons behind it.

i.e.
-The Rogues could have begun accept DH among them, the cloister is female only not the whole Eastgate.
The Rogues are a monastic administation loosely organised, we know that they have priestress, rangers, scouts, at least one blacksmith (Charsi) but we don’t know if their entire culture is based on female > male

-Seeing the female necromancer doing as good as their male counterpart, the Zann Esu could have started to look upon males who have the required potential.

These are just ideas which came from what I know about Sanctuary lore and not suggestions

17

A more than good enough reason can be made just by looking at the events of Diablo 3 RoS.

At the start of RoS, Malthael had sent his reapers to attack and destroy a great number of cities within Sanctuary; many people died during these events and had their souls harvested. Now keep in mind that this was going on continuously throughout the entire Act 5 campaign.

There’s also the possibility that Skovos Isles (The Amazon’s home) was also attacked by reapers. If such a thing did happen then there was no way they came out of it unscathed and as such could’ve lost a considerable bulk of their fighting force (which is once again composed of women only).

To make matters worse, near the end of the campaign, Malthael was using the black soulstone in an attempt to eradicate the rest of humanity (the black soulstone would absorb the demonic essence from people, tearing their bodies apart in the process), and while we indeed destroyed Malthael, we couldn’t stop him from murdering a horrifically large number of people with his usage of the black soulstone.

So in short, at great catastrophe would be more than enough reason (in my opinion anyway) for the many clans or groups to change how they handle things. For example, the Askari (Amazon) fighting force consisted of only women; that would mean that if the reapers did attack Skovos Isles, then the ones who fought against them were mostly women. And as I said earlier, there was no way the Askari would be able to fight the reapers without sustaining casualties, and most of those casualties mostly women.

Then during all the chaos, Malthael’s usage of the black soulstone also killed people numbering on a global scale, with Askari being affected by this as well; as such they lost even more people. After those events, the Askari (along with various other clans and/or groups) had lost a great number of their people (most of whom we could assume to be women, considering they fought the reapers).

So for them to begin training their men alongside their women for battle wouldn’t be that far stretch considering they had suffered a catastrophe and hope to prevent another one from happening again. Their oracles could even foresee a looming disaster that’s waiting to happen and come to a decision that their current military won’t be enough, hence the training of their men.

With all that said, I have to add that while I enjoyed the amazon in Diablo 2; I’m not really expecting nor overly hoping to see the class return for Diablo 4. My points were that if the amazon does return, then it wouldn’t be a blasphemy to the lore if a male variant was included to the class considering that the lore itself never stated that their men couldn’t fight or utilize their people’s techniques; and the Askari deciding to train their men in light of Diablo 3 RoS would be a reasonable change in my eyes.

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18

I’d prefer they keep the classes more generic at this point and not link them to particular organizations. More player creative liberties, more creative agency for the player to decide what they’re making, and more opportunity to keep the lore things, well, lore, particularly in terms of societies with a gender bias such as the amazons.

19

In the bounties Tyreal is talking to the new Horadium guy {can’t remember his name at the moment} and mentions that they have not heard from their agents in the Skavos Isle and he fears the wrost. The HG answers they knew the risk when going there.