PSA, Charm inventory and you

oh god here we go again… i really didn’t want to have to do this but apparently this is needed as well.

since literally every person who havd played in a mod with a charm inventory does not know what this means. we’ll just go over it here.

since im going to make this a big long threads with a ton of details and descriptions and i know none of you are going to read it… i’ll TLDR this


so yes the name “charm inventory” may sound like we are adding new space for charms" when in fact its just the opposite… we are adding new space for NON-charms.
therefore removing the horrific design of preventing you from picking up items if are are al max build.
the reason its called a “charm inventory” is because its the section of your inventory that charms still work in. the original 4x10 space we always had.


here is a picture from path of diablo

this mod choose to add a 5x10 space above the normal inventory
the old normal inventory is the bottom 4x10 space this is what we call a “charm inventory” because its its the section of the inventory charms still work in

the entire concept was because people wanted to be able to pick up more stuff… not have to go back to town as often… not have to go through the hassle of using a cube to store items with max build…
but if one simply added more inventory space… then it wouldn’t fix anything… that new space would just be filled with charms accomplishing nothing and ruining balance
so what was done is the charms in the top space get their level req raised by 100 in the new section thereby preventing them from working. in the new added space.

this way we can have our new inventory space to pick up items and not affect balance by not changing the amount of charms any person could use. thus allowing the new inventory space to actually be used as an inventory as was intended


Arguments Against:
yes there have been countless people arguing against this screaming “oh it’ll affect balance” which is laughable because the entire premise behind it was to add more inventory space without affecting balance… that’s the entire point.

i her people say " oh well your supposed to trade power for quality of life"
to which i respond… no… no your not, what was the most duped item in the game… so much so blizzard had to literlly make a server event designed to get rid of millions of them?
the soj obvoiusly.

if u take a look at most charms… they are all " +life, + stats+ resists + AR + def

these are all things you use when you dont have a piece of gear and u need to top something off. they arent supposed to be thing you keep in your inventory forever.

and then we have skillers… the issue that caused this problem…
these things for w/e reason were added. and this threw any hope of balance out the window entirely…

there is no more holding stuff in your inventory until u get a better peice of gear… its " oh i can add 8 skillers and get a +8 to my entire freaking skill tree.

so no… blizzard didnt “think this through” they didnt “balance around qol vs power”
stop kidding yourself

people were never supposed to be running around with 8 skillers and a cube and a torch…

now here is the issue… one might thinking that " oh they have a smaller inventory… “its less efficient”. or oh getting items in and out of the game makes it less efficient… and yeah its a complete pain… they have to go back to town more often. but the +8 are literally SOOO much of a huge boost in power… that’s all the minor inefficiencies and annoyances of using cube are mince meat in comparison to astronomical clear speed increase certain builds get.

any “intended” use of how charms were supposed to be used is irrelevant … what matters is how they ARE used. how they will always be used… and who we can address a needless annoying of the game and give basic qol increase the game deserves.

also to those who say it “affects balance”
no it doesn’t
by far the biggest change in balance anyone is ever likely to notice is at the first start of hell because u can use use some resists charms before u get better gear to help deal with those negative resists from massive jump form -40 to -100 on all resists

beyond that there is really nothing

now you could argue that yes… for pvm chars there is the added skiller from 8 to 9, and yes thats true, but that is a minor buff by comparison to the huge QOL you are giving everyone.

now some of you might be thinking… well what about all the trash builds no one ever uses… wont charm inventory make them more viable?

to which is say… YES IT WILL,
a completely unintended consequence of charm inventory is that while the best builds in the game only get a QOL improvement. a tons more trash fun build you might never think to try can now suddenly at lead make some headway into hell, they;re going to be slow… and painful and laughable compared to real builds… but this give a massive amount of skills that were never viable at least a chance.
you are increasing build variety… something d2 can most definitely use after 20 years

yet another complaint i see against it is " but people will prebuff for duels"
come on people when has dueling in d2 ever been anything but honor code based.

we rely on people not to NK, not to use pots during duels.
all of these rules are set in game and are agreed upon.
if u want a no prebuff duel… just say that…

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Already a thread about this. No charm inventory.

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This has been discussed to death all ready.
Charm inventory is bad, makes game more easy having access to more prebuff items, not just for pvp but pvm, and having access to more potions making game much more easy. Game is a PvP game having PKers come into a game with full inventory of charms + full inventory of rejuvs just be dumb.

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Charm Inventory = Space exclusively for Charms Items
Quest Item Inventory = Space exclusively for Quest items
Consumable Inventory = Space exclusively for Consumables

There are more games than D2 that use inventory concepts.

Charms within D2 at the moment are very poorly designed. They add nothing unqiue you wouldn’t achieve on equipment and they also detract from the equipment mechanics. They allow way too much freedom when it comes to equipping your character.

It also doesn’t help that there aren’t that many equipment modifiers already. People general stack skill points and resistance with a few additions. The core foundation of the system is good, but the choices we have are really poorly implemented.

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except charm inventory exists in every d2 mod and functions as certain way… and that’s what were asking for.

the reason why it even became known as a charm inventory was by the time u finished hell it was pretty much just charms down there. so people started calling it that.

what it is… its implementation how it works… even how its coded has been solved years ago.

its a clearly defined thing.

how much new space non-charm space added will vary between mods, pod has a 5x10

but its not a "exclusive inventory for charms… there isn’t anything stopping you from not using any charms and storing items down there this is what generally happens until nm because norm charms are worthless. and like i said it not normally until after hell that you are mostly filled… and its usually just terrible resists charms before u get normal hell item from a few mf runs

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The way D2 handles charms is stupid. Period.

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the way d2 handed charms would be fine if they didnt make skillers… thats the main issue… and since u cant remove them with one of the biggest balance change ever… iuts best to just minimize the damage they do by stopping them from blocking your entire inventory… hence adding new space charms cant be used in

You also use them to stack resistances. Which is dumb.
You also use them to stack Faster Run/Walk. Which is dumb.
You also use them to stack Health. Which is dumb.

They’re dumb. Period. Nothing about them is unqiue. They literally detract from equipment builds and the game is balanced around you stacking the same things. We can literally stack more skill points than you can invest on your character. WTF?

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I like charms in diablo 2 personally. I like the trade of inventory for power.

I get some people dont.

But I do, I think its a cool idea, to trade QoL looting space in a loot game for optional character power.

If you dont like the charms dont you use them.

The cost of charms is character level and inventory space. Dont like the cost dont use them, but dont pretend removing/altering one of the costs doesnt affect the feel or function of the charm system.

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Your inventory space is part of your characters strength, so changing anything about inventory is not a QoL change. How much potions and prebuff items you can hold in your inventory will effect the game play in terms of making game more easy or not.

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Farming for charms is comparable to D3 Paragon Grinding. The same people who like these things, probably also play or would be hooked on freemium games. These systems make you farm, for the sake of farming…

if the charm system was more unique this might be different… but it’s not…

the balance change of pots is completely negligible, the hell do u need more than 16 pots for…

i’ve already went over prebuff… pvp is all honor based anyways, there is no sorb, no pots.

" no prebuff" isn’t any different

Unlike D3, D2 does not have a endless dungeon type system where game keeps getting harder and harder. So making game more easy on a game where there is only 3 difficulties and can not change how hard it is like you can in MODS don’t help the game.
Which is why I suggested if such a thing were to exist to limit the amount of charms you can have to a 4x4 area instead of a 10x4.

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the point is to not change balance… your complaining about balance effects of pots are prebuffs and u want to knock off 6 skiller’s of pvp?

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They don’t need to minimize anything. Charm inventory is fine the way it is. If charms are blocking your entire inventory, then remove some so you can pick up items.

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A 4x4 area would be more balanced. But the charms could also be unique.

Stacking +29 skill points is ridiculous. You can only invest 20 points on your character.

You can use them to NOT equip certain gear, detracts form those gear choices.

As I said prebuffs used for PvM not just PvP… Yah potions do make difference having bunch of psn resist and cold resist potions in inventory to get rid of psn and cold effects and to increase psn and cold resistance and to have rejuves or tons of mana potions and not have to ever worry about mana regen… how do you not see this as not being balance issues…
You have to understand this is a game where players can go hostile on each other in random games and kill, and you gonna make it very easy for them to do it with having full skill charms and full inventory of rejuvs and what not.

If they removed charms from the game, all players who do PvP would have the same restriction placed on them. At the moment you literally need a full inventory for PVP, one that focuses entirely on stacking power.

That’s not even interesting…

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Classic doesn’t have charms. We can experience this anytime.

Charms are here to add to your item choice by removing some of the requirements you need for certain builds and not the other way around, the fact that most of you just stack skillers with your builds just shows the build you are using

I like to go hybrid kick sin and she usually does not require any skillers because shes a hybrid and I can get more by just getting resist,FRW or damage from charms instead

This argument keeps going on and on because people keep saying adding more space is considered a buff, well it is for people like sclLama which uses a full inventory of potions right?, wrong, even though it does help him a lot and may very well be a game changer charms are not there to circumvent potion use, it was there just as additional system added to the game for you shape your character

and I am sure not one person here is willing to empty his charm space just for ease of life and will still play that way, I know I wont empty my inventory of charms that I worked so hard to get

adding more space is just to make the experience less of hassle and more streamlined, going back to town is a mechanic which suppose to take you out of the action once in a while to reset your engagement levels, I don’t know how many of you had to deal with game development, but this is a very important issue, one that Torchlight devs have been hating intensely because they used a pet system which basically sells everything for you and you never actually get to go back to town and have your “downtime” that donwtime is very important to your experience

on Diablo 2 we see a different issue that was introduced with charms added into the game, you go back to often, cutting your experience short, making it into work instead of fun and not letting you offset properly

having the inventory as it is right now is wrong in more ways then one

so I understand the people afraid of change and I was there too, but I tested it and its a good solution to a very important issue, please don’t be stubborn give it good chance to happen because it will do wonders to your gameplay, wont affect balancing and make the game better as a whole

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