The game producer posted in December that their plan is to balance the top clears around GR 141 or close rift. New leadership wants to improve game balance.
1 Like
Iād rather have balance in everyday gameplay, rather than balance around people who play this game like itās their job. We can agree to disagree thoughā¦
2 Likes
In general, the differences at top player GRs are recapitulated for players at lower paragons between classes.
Balance in everyday gameplay? What does that mean exactly?
whoopty dooā¦
Will that make the game more fun? Will that make all the classes viable in groups? Hopefully, each class will have a solo speed run specā¦that would be good.
There is also a post from several years ago that they wanted all classes around 2-3 GRs in separation. Howād that work out for them? Iāll believe it when I see it. I mean if thatās their plan they are off to an incredible startā¦they really nailed balance with the Sader. Believe what you want. Maybe it will only take them 7 seasons to achieve the balanceā¦
Asking for nerfs is not the way to go. Blizz will tune the specs if they need to or want to. Ask for buffs for the lower performing classes and specs. Just all around better approach.
2 Likes
A well balanced game is fun for me.
Blizz has already announced that both nerfs and buffs will be used to improve game balance.
Crusaders were buffed in patch 2.6.6.
Crusaders were nerfed in patch 2.6.7a.
When the first crusader in patch 2.6.7a cleared GR 146 in non-season, the game producer said that crusaders were significantly out of balance and a change likely would be coming.
These are not my opinion but a reflection of events.
4 Likes
Ideally it means each class has a comparable solo speed run spec and that the off metas using different classes is comparable to the meta as well.
Letās say I wanted to play WD next season, Iād like to have a solo speed build on par or near the top solo speed spec and Iād like to be able to play the WD in meta or at the very least off meta groups that may not be as efficient but near that efficiency. That would be more appealing to me then having all the classes balanced at the top end.
If it somehow gives people comfort knowing that itās balanced at the top, then more power to them. But, I donāt see how that brings any more enjoyment to the game. Balance guys always say āI want a balanced game (at the top)ā. How does that bring you more enjoyment??
Everyday gameplay is about grouping, either level gems, or paragon farming. Thatās what you do most of time. It would be great that no matter which class you chose you could efficiently paragon farm or level gems. I think that kind of balance would be way more beneficial.
1 Like
Did the enjoyment of playing barbs increase when they were buffed?
1 Like
If you mean barbsā¦yeah why wouldnāt it?? I havenāt been able to play barb in group speed runs or solo speed runs since season 3 or 4ā¦itās been great not to have to roll a wiz for the upteenth time in a row 
5 Likes
They really donāt get it, Shark. Youāre wasting your breath.
1 Like
I agree with you. I prefer maximum options. I dislike the idea that my preferred class is weak or excluded from group meta runs. In a well-balanced game, power differences are closer and their is more acceptance of class diversity.
1 Like
Well balanced, doesnāt necessarily mean balanced at the top end. Letās say they choose to make the DH Rapid fire spec the top build and get in within their desired range. Does that really help the class out as a whole. The rapid fire build is mainly for pushing solo and doesnāt offer much if any utility. Also, when you balance at the high end, many of the builds that push the highest require AD or grouping to accomplish the clear and that wonāt necessarily matriculate down to a good speed run build for solo or group or a meta build. Balance at the top may not translate to inter or intra class balance across the spectrum.
1 Like
And this is best achieved by balancing topend down. I donāt ask Blizzard to balance after my 8y/o cousins suboptimal gameplay because that would make zero sense. You have to look at how a build performs optimally and then balance it accordingly, if your goal is to have players clear similar GR level that is.
If your goal as a dev is to have a clear and defined meta then by all means let certain classes do 2 or 3x more dmg than others.
5 Likes
Iāve said my piece, if you guys believe balancing top end down will soothe all the problems, your welcome to that opinion. It will help in certain areas but it is by no means a cure all that will allow diversity in groups and on par solo play.
Maybe if they only buffed utility builds to that level then you could get something that resembles overall balance or if they buff all builds to that level, but my guess is they are likely only going to do 1-2/class if they even get that farā¦
Nobody said that. This game has issues no amount of balancing can fix.
1 Like
You will get no argument from me on the above statement.
It was more of an over exaggeration, Iām more or less talking about group diversity (speed and meta) and on par solo play. I think people should be advocating more for this type of balance rather than top end balance. If we have group diversity and on par solo play between classesā¦I donāt think the top end balance will matter much. Being able to play your desired class in every day game play without feeling disadvantaged, at least to me, is more important than having top end balance.
I agree with you. One difficulty in thinking about balance is it is easier for most players to see the top clears on the leaderboard and assess relative power. I think that Prokahn and I are the two people recently who are most likely to present data analysis of the top 1000 per leaderboard using Blizzard API downloads on this forum. He recently posted that he is uninstalling the game.
There are exceptions (thorns necromancers and DH rapid fire builds) that have odd top end characteristics that skew the results; however, in general the top end clears do reflect power of builds for low paragon players.
Although you have a negative opinion of my posts, I think we agree on fundamental issues like what you just posted. I tend to be a numbers/facts/analytical guy. We philosophically disagree on how to achieve balance. I prefer a combination of nerfs and buffs while you do not. My views are class agnostic. I play most historically DH. When marauders DH ruled in season 1 & 2, I advocated for their nerf. I did this because I knew some people preferred to play other classes and due to the huge difference in power often felt compelled not to play their favorite class. You have acknowledged something very similar about not wanting to feel compelled to play wizards to be accepted into groups.
1 Like
I am only a mid-level player more for time reasons than anything else. Because I have played this for many years, the advantage is I can tell if a build will taper off or if I had a lot of time, be competitive.
I think you have pretty much nailed it and not just this game but any decent game. It should be fun or it is not a game if itās serious.
So it is a joy to play a class that you know can keep developing towards higher rifts proportionally with the time invested in it. For me, that is balance but others may not agree.
3 Likes
Generally speaking this is true, however ii is a bit of a narrow view and doesnāt take into account HOW the build accomplishes the clear. Some builds that require massive grouping and AD (as major source of damage) at the highest level donāt necessarily translate to good builds at low paragon. Also, some builds are just good for pushing and have very little utility.
So yes, they will be powerful at low paragon but may lack utility to be useful for farming or for group compositions. If the build can only be used for solo it doesnāt help much for balance in every day game play. Yeah itās powerful but how useful is it really? So you can have that balance on the top end but the result can be a build that is great for solo and thatās about it while other classes could have builds that fit into the meta or are really good speed farmersā¦not exactly balance in my opinion. There are more factors to consider besides how high a build can clear. I think if people really cared about balance these types of things need to be considered.
2 Likes
if each class can do:
- speed 90-110ās
- speed split bounties at t16
- speed rifts at t16
- solo t16 mathael / diablo / uzrael / hellfire bosses
Then I think thatās 99 percent of all the balancing they need to do.
The top end clear isnāt so important to me.
top end clears are all about collecting tons of trash mobs and creating area damage mechanics to kill everything. Itās tedious and completely different than the speed builds we have at 110 or less.
4 Likes