The green new deal proposed within ten years “Meeting 100 percent of the power demand in the United States through clean, renewable, and zero-emission energy sources.”
You got a plan? Because you have eight years left. I suppose we can let it slide a few decades.
It’s common knowledge if its commonly known. It’s not required that villagers in Bhutan know it.
All people can do that care is do their bit to lower their footprint. Governments and corporations, now that’s another thing… They know about it and it’s up to them to make changes.
I can tell no country in the world has money or means to go 100% green renewable energy, I doubt there would be consequences when they don’t either. So please go back to the main subject.
coughs in Icelandic
In 2015, the total electricity consumption in Iceland was 18,798 GWh. Renewable energy provided almost 100% of electricity production, with about 73% coming from hydropower and 27% from geothermal power. Most of the hydropower plants are owned by Landsvirkjun (the National Power Company) which is the main supplier of electricity in Iceland. Iceland is the world’s largest green energy producer per capita and largest electricity producer per capita, with approximately 55,000 kWh per person per year. In comparison, the EU average is less than 6,000 kWh.
The funny thing about deals is that they actually require an agreement to be struck in order for either side to be beholden to the terms. To say we only have 8 years left is folly when the GND was never put into practice as presented, nor does AOC have the power the right consistently fearmongers others into believing she has.
At present, she is merely a representative of ideals they find scary, but make no mistake, she’s also not where she is because the establishment left wants her there. They tried to primary her similarly to how the DNC maneuvered to consolidate votes away from Sanders by getting and Buttigieg and Klobuchar to drop out of the primary for their boy Biden. Only they failed in her case, in part because she understood differences in the world they do not, or refuse to acknowledge. Which is another way of saying people in her district want her to represent them, just as more across the country would hope for similar candidates and policy. Actual leftists are tired of the moderate and right-of-center merry-go-round of “the left” that’s got us here where we have to tolerate claims like Joe Manchin being the most powerful man in the Senate just because of his history of being a republican with a D next to his name. We’re not ignorant of the shameless begging to vote for Biden, only to be spurned when we asked for more policy than “He’s not as bad as Trump!” And sure, pandemic response has had its share of priority since coming into office, but seeing some promises walked back on does us no favors.
The phrase “The Dems eat their own!” is perhaps one people have seen over the years, and that’s a result of things like the above paired with a foolish belief we can negotiate with people who don’t want to negotiate a la McConnel’s promise to sabotage any and all Obama proposals. As a result, when we actually get a true leftist in a position to try things, they’re shot down because they’re not the status quo or lack the seniority to make calls. Our so-called biased left-wing media has its own habits of villifying leftists, including generous misuse of the s-word because McCarthyism has still indoctrinated our older generations. Voter disenfranchisement magnifies because we’re once more denied requested change, which the right tends to capitalize on by squeaking out wins in swing states and then doing whatever they can to make it even harder for leftists to win through voter suppression, gerrymandering, attempts at census flubbing, and so on. The cycle repeats. The only winners are the already wealthy as their lobbying does its thing.
In the end, it’s not just “for the sake of change” that we want stuff done. It’s because we’ve been calling out systemic rot for decades, watching as our global status declines, watching as we hop into yet more ceaseless wars, watching as we’re told there’s just not enough money for things while bloating military budgets without batting an eye. Some of us remember that the government is actually supposed to be for the people. Not people over a certain financial value. Not people who were lucky enough to be born white. Not just people who were fortunate enough to be born here. The events of January 6th aren’t worrying enough people like they should be. Racists being able to march through Charlottesville, subsequently murdering a girl, and then being called fine people should be making people angry. Militarizing the police in opposition of BLM and then acting shocked when the oppressed react should be yet another warning sign not all is right in the nation. It’s certainly easy for some to say I’m just grandstanding, virtue signaling, being a keyboard SJW, or whatever, but there’s not a whole lot I can do beyond voting for people who don’t want things like the above happening again and taking the steps to make sure they won’t, as well as hoping those who aren’t too far into the fascist kool-aid stop to reconsider. There’s a lot of needless suffering going on that shouldn’t be happening out there. We’re a better species than that.
Yeah, I think we need some kind of source for such a claim 
Not sure how that is relevant in any way?
To be fair, electricity consumption is not the same as a countries energy consumption. You still need fuel, mostly for transportation. Electric cars will help, but probably not 100% in 10 years. And air travel remains unsolved (especially relevant for Iceland I would assume). Shipping might start to be solved, but likewise not anywhere close to 100% in 10 years.
No country probably can reach 100% in 10 years. But it is also another strawman argument from the climate deniers, since nobody is saying we have to reach 100% in 10 years.
At this point there is likely no way that we can reach the goal set by the Paris accord. We are just way too late. Which unsurprisingly turns the climate deniers fatalistic. But of course the whole thing is not either/or.
Getting 99% of the way is better than 98%. 70% is also better than 20%
Heck, even if we reached 100% of the goal, much damage already has been done.
Okay, whoah.
Just for the record, Iceland is pretty small compared to giant countries like United States, Russia and China. Whole country is pretty suitable for green energy as it’s an island where water is a requirement of sorts but I would never guess 100%.
Seems that way.
Let’s continue with the thread.
Agreed, Iceland was the first to resolve Covid as well (but not that hard if your population is like ±10 inhabitants a square kilometer, or something 
)
About the renewables, isn’t THAT bad as I initially thought actually, even some more populated countires (like India for example) have done a significant jump at ±30% rate… I mean sure there’s an easy “jumpstart” for those countries with already well-established hydro-capacity, but still…
Though it’s a really long way from having operating “carbon neutral economies”, it’s still quite a jump for those that invested already, most ranging between 20 and 40% of what’s required for usage…
Edit: actually nvm, (who’d have thought :P), Scandianvian countries are at a rate of 70%+ (mostly hydroplants) already…
And the bad faith orator hits another bad faith argument out of the park.
1, no deal was struck. You know that. The fact you wrote what you did proves even further you have no intent to have a discussion based un reality and facts.
2, I knew the tweet before you linked that article and no one outside of the right even though she was saying the world was going to actually end in 12 years. As it was hyperbole to stress thus is a ticking timebomb and cingress is only worried about money rather than the actual impact.
But again you knew that and no, as someone aware of the political sphere I figured you’d post something legit if you were being faithful. But keep on posting bad faith arguments and we will be tight behind to call them out for what they are.
That’s a smart analysis of things. Earlier, someone mentioned that Bernie Sanders was a leftist, which I find a bit comical. In many European countries, people like him and AOC would fit in with moderate centrists. The United States has never had a legitimate left wing. And we are so far beyond due for that.
People been saying the world will end for ages.
Hopefully it’s quick. Oh how lucky us disgusting humans would be heh?
Got to play D4 before that please please please! I’ll have to get a new computer at this rate.
What she is referring to is that based on our current understanding if we don’t address the issue by 2030 we will cross a tipping point where it will be impossible to deal with and we will not be able to reverse course outside of something extremely drastic and risky like geo-engineering.
Will the world literally end on 2030? Of course not but it will force us in to a situation where our quality of life will drastically change eg. extreme pressures on food networks. That is why it is important to address the issue now since once we cross that threshold there is no turning back
It’s a resolution introduced into Congress but keep pretending it wasn’t openly proposed. The title of the document was The Green New Deal. I didn’t pick the name Congressman Markey did. Of course no one is going to strike a deal on that basis. It’s not even a starting point for a serious discussion. These aren’t serious people. If we want a better world we need some serious people.
See above. Most of the rest I substantially agree with but Trump never called racists fine people. He called some of the people marching who were not racists, there were many, fine people. I don’t worry about riots as a single event like January 6th. They’re how angry people react without reason. When the Puerto Rican nationalists shot up Congress in 1954 that was worth worrying about. On the other hand the months of riots in major cities the news media called peaceful protests caused serious damage and many deaths.
What she was spindling folding an mutilating is based on unscientific fear mongering nonsense.
You fail to really understand Zymu.
The Earth goes through cycles. Warm, cold, warm, cold. We have been warming since the end of the last ice age. During that short period humans have flourished, greatly multiplied, and spread across the planet. We invented some cool stuff too!
Warming will happen with or without us given the normal cycles. Some things can accelerate that, or even reverse that. Emissions from massive volcanic eruptions, hitting the earth with a big meteor and raising massive dust clouds, etc. World wide burning of fossil fuels. Some of those are natural, some are not.
The only thing up for debate is how MUCH humans contribute, not that the fact the the Earth is warming - and will continue to. We can’t stop it.
Maybe we can slow it by removing the portions that humans contribute? Maybe?
Regardless, it WILL happen just like it has been happening since the last ice age ended. Then what?
-Changes to weather patterns. While overall warming is the average trend, changes to ocean currents, rainfall, etc can create weather extremes. Super cold spots and super warm spots. Intense rain, intense storms, etc. We have seen that. IMPACT - critical infrastructure, military, ports, transportation, and populations need to build and plan based on resilience to extreme weather. Some people will have to move.
Rise of sea levels. IMPACT - again, ports, military, major cities, housing centers, transportation (locations of airports, trains etc), need to adjust - or plan ahead. Don’t waste money on building something in an area that will be flooded in 30 years.
Impact on growing conditions. Crops in some places will fail. Others will become fantastic farming areas. This is quite critical - food drives economies, stability, and population movement.
Secondary to that - water. As climate patterns change access to water will remain critical - and places that depend on it now won’t have it. Again, this will result in strife and population movement. Just like it has for thousands of years.
The issue is not that the Earth is warming. YES it is and has been for thousands of years. The part humans need to care about is - how fast, how can we adapt our critical infrastructure and resources, and is there anything we can do to slow it down and buy time to make those changes.
No, the Earth is not going anywhere. How happy humans are on it though is an open question. Dinosaurs had a good run too, until they didn’t.
No I get it. We’re in a normal cycle right now and it’s completely normal. We need to adapt to the normal cycles of climate like we have for as long at there has been civilization. It’s not a crisis we don’t need to man the life boats and move to Mars. We need to be smarter about our resources and throwing tons of them into landfills when they wear out after only a few years is bad. We don’t recycle solar cells and most batteries and they contain irreplaceable minerals. Unfortunately the Government is hung up on stupidity like carbon offsets.
I’d argue putting yourself in the public spotlight for the degree of harassment and threats to push the platform people like AOC have endured constitutes as being serious.
Now, it’s one thing to not like the GND in its entirety. Part of the process is to iterate and improve, and that helps when all parties are actually willing to sit at the table. Not liking the idea should otherwise not discredit the intentions behind it, and this is generally where myself and others would gawk at the assertion they’re not serious.
Getting a bit personal here, I have strong ties within OH and WV. We had a power plant a few miles down the road because Ohio Edison decided it was more profitable to close it up than to conform to Obama era regulations. I could’ve easily hopped in the car and taken pictures of how gross our river water looks, and quite honestly still does due to other facilities upstream also associated with coal and steel. We were pretty much urged to never eat any fish we caught if we tried, and the old Simpson’s gag of Blinky the Three-Eyed fish was accurate for our region. For the past decade, there’ve been constant whispers of another energy group moving in on that land, but it always seems to fall through as they ultimately deem our area not worth it.
Natural Gas and frakking has otherwise taken root, and not only have these activities destroyed a good bit of land around here, the trucks and other heavy machinery have utterly decimated our roads. My oldest sister’s house is currently sliding off its foundation due to nearby digging, but she’s also fallen down the same right-wing rabbit hole where no degree of logic or reasoning will convince her that she’s voting for people who are actively hurting her life. And I emphasize this because she also has a rare cancer and has suddenly started having difficulty getting the care she needed once the right started its death by a thousand cuts approach to Obamacare.
I also brought up Manchin earlier due to him being a WV senator voted in on the Dem platform, but has a record consistently siding with Republicans on major issues. I should also bring up Jim Justice, who ran as a D for the governorship of WV, and then changed his party affiliation mid-term. This sort of wishy-washy deceptive political chicanery has done its damage to the state, where if you don’t live in Charleston (the capitol) or Morgantown (home of the WVU party school cash cow), you may as well not exist in what has otherwise been a right-leaning state. So, imagine when you get characters like these maneuvering more to preserve their office than to actually help the people they’re leaving languish who voted them in under premises they took seriously. Quite bluntly, what I want to say is not forum appropriate.
Why are we talking about climactic changes anyway? In case you wanna say something be direct instead of blame deflecting or open whole another thread about it. This thread is not for conspiracy theories or for discussing future through a glass ball like you know better. Please. Put the politics out of this too.
How Blizzard Entertainment’s work ethics and climate change can be correlated? It’s because of their name? How long will this thing go? 
This thread is a fascinating discussion of the broader economic factors that drive corporate culture - then the factors that drive economies. Including unionization, political and social issues, etc.
Climate change is part of that - in the social, political, and economic impact driven by major disruption to various countries, including the US.
My parents have “joked” for almost 50 years that CA will fall off the US due to earth quakes, fires, etc. (No, it won’t).
But examining all the driving factors that play into corporations (many of them) allowing this, promoting this - is important. It is not a simple thing to stamp it out and it takes societal change, not just a change in a few managers - although that is a good start!
Blockquote > Blockquote [quote=“Bodach-1471, post:697, topic:37149”]
Yeah pretty much exactly how the germans vilified the jews. There’s nothing new about this.
Free wrote: That you would make this comparison is horrific. You’re wrong, but I doubt that matters to you. Abhorrent post
[/quote]
This is a very educational post because it is an example of that Kevin Samuels calls “the SIGN” language. When they can’t win an argument, they resort to 1) shaming the opponent, 2) insulting them, 3) guilting them (you are a racist if you disagree, etc) and 4) having the need to be right. Thus, not acknowledging their opponent’s argument.
This is why, on this topic, we went form employee harassment, to capitalism, to Marx, to hating Whites, to global warming later known as “climate change.”
As somebody who is both W and J, I see substantial similarities already and can give you a whole class in support of what Bodach wrote. Recently, I had a phone conversation with a close friend whose parents survived the H in Poland and he later got decorated for his military service in Israel. The gist of the discussion was “in light for that is happening now in the US, is it time for the American J community to start panicking.”
But I don’t want to add new twist to the already twisted-many-times thread, so I will stop here. Suffice to say, that similar forms of propaganda and hatred have happened in multiple other countries, affecting numerous and different vilified peoples, and the end results were always bad for both perpetrators and victims.
And comparing others (or the thing they are talking about) to 1930s germany is not shaming, insulting, guilting?
Right…
I think we can all agree about that danger. Although probably for very different reasons. Not a good time to be a minority in the US (if there ever was a good time).
Yeah, I have to say, never understood why the name changed. Global warming was more descriptive.