Now they are being sued by California

Of course nothing is perfect. I agree with whoever said though that unions and corporations should not be able to hide political contributions and lobbying behind secret orgs and PACs.

It ends up being a way to influence labor laws - from the corporate side, that benefit the employer over the worker with no transparency.

I really dislike that they brought in that union busting outside firm for Blizzard.

3 Likes

This is why you only make contracts whit independent organisations. It’s hard to find, but not imposible.

I considered Brandy a friend of sorts–I didn’t know her as well as you, I’m sure, but we talked often via email, and she was instrumental in helping me and other members of the Barb community get through to developers. She also set up my NDA with Blizzard, which they have since broken (surprise, surprise). Sometimes, we talked shop; she never disclosed anything that compromised her work or the work of colleagues, but I always had the distinct feeling that she was working twice as hard as most everyone around her, and working smarter, and that her ideas (which were very good) were completely ignored.

Seems that feeling was spot on.

Every once in a while, I sat there thinking about what she’d told me, and I tried putting the pieces together. I wanted to know why things were the way they were over there, and why they stayed that way. I talked to another ex-Blizzard employee who said similar things, and eventually, a picture formed. Certain people protected, certain people discarded.

I’m so incredibly sorry that she had to go through that kind of BS, and I’m doubly sorry that other people at Blizzard had it way, way worse. There’s no excuse for any of this.

Like you (and many others), I’m proud of her for speaking up. I’m also angry that an intelligent, capable, talented, and hard-working person was passed over for no good reason.

Here’s a good response:

Yup.

The Cosby Suite is just . . . you know what? I can’t articulate how disgusting the whole thing is.

It’s very true. Very, very few unions exist for folks in the game development and publishing industry, and that’s a major problem. Organized labor is a great start to fixing these kinds of workplace culture problems. Saidosha makes a very good point here:

“Right to work” is a major part of why unions aren’t stronger in the US, and a major part of why big business and fat-cat corporations can get away with so much–that and the incredibly lax US tax laws on capital gains and such. On paper, the idea behind “right to work” isn’t necessarily bad–a worker has the right to work somewhere and may freely leave anytime in order to seek better employment. The flip side, of course, is that companies are often able to fire employees for bogus reasons–or no reason at all.

It’s a complicated topic, and I don’t want to do it disservice by reducing it to a binary (good vs bad). There should, however, be a greater emphasis on organized labor at all levels of the US (and global) labor force. Unions aren’t perfect, of course, as several posters have nicely pointed out, but neither is a free market in which corporations like Blizzard are free to create the kinds of abusive, predatory work environments they’ve been creating for years.

5 Likes

So basicly the government and corporations miss lead and miss inform people about unions, so they can’t have back up, and workers are in a vulnerable situation. Why don’t people see thru all this? Also you are not forced in to a union, it’s optial. And the fee thay ask is so little, it’s a joke even here, but the benefit is huge.

1 Like

It’s the wrong approach, “patching” society in “rotation” isn’t a solution, take for example last year:

March: The month of teachers (or whatever)
April: The month of women
June: The month of lgbt
July: Black lives matter



November: Asian lives matter

Whoa wait, what happened ?, yeah, THAT is a problem, mustn’t allow polititians and society to “rotate” stuff in a semi/round-robin fashion… And the reason why it really happens is a thing I’d like to call “overmanagement”, and when things are overmanaged, then they’re 1000% mishandled (not only one mistake or overreaction leads to another, but also one mistake forces others to make up for it)

It’s simple guys, whilest it’s hard to “overgeneralize” stuff, it kinda boils down to few more general problems:

1 - no taxation on the rich, whilest it’s not the “magic wand” that will solve everything, (with time) will end up being the case
2 - “over/policing” mood and judging people by their behavior (as opposed to their action),… Here’s the very important part to understand: not everyone is born on a bed of roses, and more importantly - no matter what happens some will NEVER reach that, and the ironic part is that the very first step of fixing the problem is let those that suffer accept their suffer and stop preaching it, and EVEN MORE IRONICALLY, it’s what even started the whole notion of “PC culture” lol (and then later women organisations and other similar “victimised subgroups” abused it)

Whilest this is also what you don’t want to hear about, it’s a very necessary step to stop being manipulated by “breaking news” or “mood breakers”, and would probably focus on questioning on “was it right where we just went” as opposed to focusing/questioning on “where are we going” all the time… The sad part is that analysing and drawing conclusions, yet alone decisionmaking, becomes harder and harder… It takes one second to tell a lie, and about 30 to tell 5 of them, whilest may take days (or even months) to debunk them, hence why it’s VERY IMPORTANT to slow down everything and more analyse instead of “add up” on daily basis, and to add “insult to injury” media becomes more and more opinionated

3 - kinda related to the 2nd point but, again, my personal definition of politeness may kinda circle things up in a whole:

Politeness = ABSCENCE OF ACTION, where the only/most-obvious course to take is to claim superior victimhood or reaffirm superiority over the other

IDK if it’s the pessimist/cynic in me or whatever the issue, but really skeptical towards “movements for change” being pushed/powered by corporations and have all that “campaigned” in droves tbh… Just doesn’t feel right, it’s fake, no defence is (kinda) better than having a fake defence

So again, instead of “targeting” drunk workers that were probably/obviously overworked for their hours cause some section of that workforce suffered, perhaps better make a better research on what went wrong in a more general/generic matter

Again the point of: “rotating” society and/or “victim groups” in “patches”, will never solve things, whilst may or may not be late, “minimising focus on small changes and focus on causality” is always/usually the right take (which can be achieved if things aren’t all the time rushed)… Kinda feels like the good ol’ “if you bark on every tree on the road you’ll never get anywhere” is truer/holier than ever

Focusing on different societal groups are not the same as rotating focus though? You can consider them all, all the time. Every month should be the ‘month of women’ and all other groups where society needs to change (which probably is most/all groups, in different ways)
I agree that rotating focus is not ever going to solve much. That behavior is probably more about pretending to cater to a single group for some gain.

Ok, I guess I should probably bottom-line my point (and my hypothesis/fear at the same time)

Feel like this will be abused to “investigate” (and punish) other/more companies in the business (instead of keeping it as what is, a lawsuit against a one particular company that apparently mishandled things or their management caused for things to get to this phase)

That’s what I’m talking about, keep it as a lawsuit vs Acti/Blizz management, not as a “let’s open investigation vs game developers” broad/general case :thinking: (and sadly have a gut feeling that what will happen is the latter instead)

As I said before, this is the eventual result of 40-some years of declining education quality on the k-12 level, then it growing increasingly out of reach in cost beyond that. Throw in a spritz of tribalism and scare tactics (See the perversion of the BLM movement, allusions to socialism in leftist policies, current anti-science stances a la vaccinations, climate change, and more, etc.) suddenly the country is running on two sets of truths. Those with the wealth and power benefit most from everyone else being poor and ignorant, and have been taking advantage of that to rewrite rules or steer narratives away from the legitimate truths.

It’s not like people don’t see what’s wrong with the country, though. They just can’t individually do anything about it and sometimes this leads to apathy and disconnecting from needed causes. The Electoral College is a hot button issue for this reason alone, as we’re constantly told that if it’s removed, it’ll just be the liberal cities determining the presidency and overall direction of the country via simple rule of majority. They assume that the midwest will be forgotten, but at the same time, keep voting in do-nothings that habitually hurt them. Just look to Texas and the recent power grid freeze. The problem was known, they chose to do nothing, the citizens paid for it. Their damage control was the fallacious claim that wind farms were the cause, thus green energy bad, don’t listen to the dems ever. The aforementioned tribalism kicks in, it’s taken as gospel, and everyone with a brain between their ears is left standing there wondering how so many people can be so gullible or willfully ignorant.

The funny part, though, is the same sorts defending the EC are usually the same ones crowing about American exceptionalism and how if you basically build it, it will come. The midwest actually does not want to change itself to become a more viable entity socially and politically. As more things shift to digital and tech, the needs of yesteryear aren’t the same. More companies can take a page out of Google’s book like how they set up in Kansas. There’s some growth here and there in Texas relative to this principle, and it shouldn’t be surprising that it’s also started trending purple and may at some point become blue. But there’s still a whole lot of real estate where it’s just more of the same people repeatedly banging their heads in the insane notion that not evolving will somehow save them from themselves. It’s why I hate where I live and would 100% move when the opportunity presents itself. Our roads are garbage. Our internet is trash. Entertainment options are minimal. Food culture is lacking variety. The racism is very much real. Then they wondering why younger people move out and never come back, steadily leading to a rise of the average age of the population (Over 51 last I checked my town).

Change can be scary, I get that much, but digging our heels in and accepting the status quo hasn’t helped.

1 Like

That would seem like a really good thing? Most of them in all likelihood suffers from this same issues. Hopefully not all to such an extreme degree, but we already know that Riot and Ubisoft had similar (or worse) issues.

I mean, state investigations should not even be needed. Every single one of these gaming companies should probably hire external investigators (and lets not choose the Union busters…), to figure out how bad things are for them, before things explode as they have for Blizzard.

Yeaaah, not entirely sure about that… Even if it’s an issue, should be done in a clearly separate and not-related manner… I guess “external investigators” is one way to do it, but also kinda sounds controll-y from outside tbh

IMO the appeal of mobbing/victimisation PER INDIVIDUAL (i.e. the state-unions, if that’s what they are doing) should probably be the ones responsible to fix it… But since not sure how they work, and how the rights of a worker are (if at all) dealt-with/protected, then the other option is sadly the more probable solution (but on a longer run can make that make process even more politicised, i.e. greater damage)

Overall just as mentioned above, to prevent an “overswing” on the other direction it’s important to keep these kinds of things/cases as individual as possible and not having made a bunch of “ongoing trends” out of them, if that happens things will get really bad

Personally, I prefer sober/clear-minded company to inebriated/incapacitated company, but that’s me.

I wouldn’t mind womanizers so much, if only they were willing to be there when their now-women need them the most, instead of promptly seeking-out additional would-be women to subsequently abandon in favor of additional girls, etc., etc.

As they are, CAST them to the stygian abyss, where I hope the crazy-cat-ladies that they helped co-create latch onto them and suck them dry like so many male anglers.

Having said all this…

Seems like the role of “company cheerleader” is in demand at Blizz HQ. Obfuscating the role with titles like “assistant curator”, instead of absolutely owning it, implies that it is a shameful or undignified role…but I ask, What is an orc army without its kodo beasts/war drums?

It’s important to not worship idols of clay, but it’s also important to not dismiss beauty altogether. Beauty isn’t everything but it isn’t nothing, either. To some, it can be an inspiration, or an effective antidepressant. It’s therapeutic. Sure, it doesn’t last forever, but neither do lots of nice things.

Being deceived from youth into believing that any expression of affection is invariably an ignoble dickhead move, tends to produce strange, perverse, and/or outright destructive behavior. All expression needs an outlet!

Hitting on someone else’s wife is pretty gross, though.

Prospective employees ought to be encouraged to B.Y.O.H. (Bring Your Own Hype) instead of looking to everyone else to leech off of. If you need a ready supply of groupies/“Blizzard babes” to enjoy your occupation, get lost!

Two cents.

1 Like

As soon as I hit the post button, I knew I was going to have to clarify.

I’m not against unions in theory. Unions provide for safe working conditions, fair wages, appropriate working hours, and more recently, for environmental protections and sustainability of the industry (see energy industry unions). These are all good things, but they’re expensive things. And in practice, we may end up with autocratic structures that take over whole industries, force workers to pay dues as a barrier to entry, and use the money to support the political interests and personal comfort of union bosses instead of the workers - like many of our current unions today.

Historically, there was absolutely a need for unions. Upton Sinclair’s The Jungle is the classic it is because it told that tale in the meatpacking industry. That experience was hardly unique across all of America’s industries coming out of what I call the Robber Baron era (post-Reconstruction to WWI-ish). Railroad work was another infamously dangerous line of work. I could give a long history lesson here.

Unions were needed. Why? Because of the massive power differential. Anytime there is a huge power differential, those who have the power will be tempted to exploit it. The more power, the greater the temptation to exploit it, and we inevitably get corruption and abuse. Balance of power is a critical concept in all human systems, which is why it’s a core part of the US Constitution’s structure. And corporate power is every bit as much of a threat as government power, the power of the historical Catholic Church, or any other human social structure.

But, we have to understand these are trade-offs. That Robber Baron era is what turned the US from a backwater that just burned half its country to the ground in a bloody civil war into one of the world’s great industrial powerhouses. Railroads, the steel industry, the oil industry, shipping, mass production of hundreds of products. All of that economic prosperity resulted because corporations had minimal barriers to build and develop capital. Our university and hospital systems developed out of the philanthropy from these mega-millionaires - the Jeff Bezos’ and Bill Gates’ of their era. They were able to build all of this because labor was cheap, replaceable, and they could drive people hard. Collectively, the nation benefited.

The tech industry is very similar to the Robber Baron industrial expansion. We have minimal regulation. Our anti-competitive regulation and anti-trust laws are barely enforced. The big companies own hundreds of politicians and buy what they want from the people who are supposed to hold them accountable. In exchange for minimal regulation, we get the big tech revolution that’s remaking our society, making our country rich, and frankly helping billions around the world to live better lives. And the cost for this world-changing growth includes the programmers and workers who are getting “less than ideal” (politely put) working conditions.

And we should be honest about the situation. These people are highly paid white collar workers making well above what the average Joe out in my rural neck of the woods brings in. Our labor laws both federally and in the State of California (Silicon Valley) could hardly be described as exploitative. I think it’s clear that the issues we’re seeing today exist in spite of equal pay laws, in spite of anti-harassment laws, etc. The laws we have are being selectively enforced for myriad reasons, and to me that’s the elephant in the room and the obvious place to start. The employees using the lawsuit is a perfect example of this. I also think workers throughout the industry are going to see this and use it as inspiration to create their own local pressure for changing within their own companies. A good thing. They may be able to get results without forming a formal union.

Historically, the number I’ve read is that after they get nationalized, it’s 80% Democrat, which is why they get support from that party on an issue that would seem to be a Republican issue: cheap labor for big business interests. For me the bigger issue with H1Bs is pricing Americans with American university student loan debit out of the market.

1 Like

Friend, I couldn’t agree more. I just want to point out that things are getting worse.

The current attack on critical race theory is an attempt to supplant critical theory (and thinking) for conservative revisionist ideology and propaganda. Even historically liberal universities are grappling with this, doubly so due to the financial impacts of Covid-19.

I agree, and I really like your take on this. I’ll only add that traditionally conservative middle- or lower-class voters historically vote against their best interests. Why? That’s a more complicated question. Religion, yes, particularly in areas where fundamentalism thrives. Poor education? Check. Less diversity? Check.

There’s a reason larger cities tend to be more liberal, and it’s not coincidence. Not that (neo)liberals are saints–they’re not.

But abolishing the Electoral College and giving more power to more demographically diverse, more educated, more dense areas of the country? I’m 100% on board with this.

What is this horrifically sexist screed? What did you post? Why did you post this?

2 Likes

Is there evidence to support this assertion?

Similar statements have been said for the last 250 years about the American education system. If true consistently over this time, we would be illiterate as a society without math skills.

I think it was Socrates that said something along the lines of A democracy is only as good as the education system that surrounds it and I think I’m actually starting to see his point…

3 Likes

I’m talking about the point I made directly after that:

It’s worth noting that the recent attacks on critical race theory are serious. Critical race theory is, at its core, theory designed to examine the discourse of race in a society, and to question assumptions about equity, justice, and discrimination. Its applications outside the legal field have been invaluable in generating critical discourse about art, culture, and politics and race.

1 Like

I think that would be a difficult correlation/causation to establish.

Edii: I may be confused are you trying to link educational decline with the attacks.

What would?

Are you suggesting that CRT is not under attack or . . . ?

I may be confused are you trying to link educational decline with the attacks. That was the focus of my comment.

Rich people already pay less taxes by percentage compared to their income. It doesn’t make them magically hire more workforce and I doubt it’s any related to the subject here.