Looking for tips on dealing with upper torment levels

Always glad to help :slight_smile:

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No it’s not work so

Static is just a term to emphasize the fact that fully dynamic separate damage multipliers like Convention of Elements don’t work.

It works by making the damage of one element apply to every other element at the same time. Pro players would not be using it if the numbers were not accurate.

But the element of the main damage skill is still single element. If for example the skill is fire and CoE rotates through fire, cold, lightning and physical, you still have the CoE buff up only 25% of the time. SoJ makes no difference in that.

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SoJ takes the highest elemental bonus and applies it to every element. So as the damage rotates SoJ applies it to all elements including the one you use for damage.

Honestly I rarely use CoE cuz I hate that rotational nonsense myself. But certainly Maxroll wouldn’t be using them paired if it wasn’t functional.

I don’t have both rings on any of my accounts to verify it, and maybe they use it for some other reason.

The ring is sometimes used in speed builds. Kirottu is right. There is nothing extra “magic” about it. It’s just an easy damage boost for your main elemental damage skill in builds that are meant to fly through content.
Feel free to correct me on this.

But the skill still uses only one element at a time, meaning CoE is buffing the skill 25% of the time. SoJ does not change that. The “damage window” of CoE remains unaffected, whether you use SoJ or not.

What SoJ does is allowing to roll different element buffs to your gear than what your skill uses. For example if push variant uses physical but speed GR variant uses fire, you don’t have to swap gear pieces rolled with physical to ones rolled with fire.

Since I can’t test it myself without farming up both rings I will take your word for it, the confusing bit is that Maxroll uses the paired rings for push. For speed they use unity and zodiak.

Interesting. What build? Just so I won’t have to look through them all.

Patterns of Justice Monk. I actually favor SoJ and Obsidian Ring of the Zodiac over Convention of Elements, but it works somewhat too. Just you can’t spam Serenity and Epiphany as much with CoE and may have to shove Lefebvre’s in the Cube instead of Mantle of Channeling.

I don’t like CoE on Monk overall as you have five available elementals that translates to one peak cycle and following fours, where you just do almost nothing. However, PoJ is the only build where SoJ seem to be the best option. Stone of Jordan for other classes are only meant for Nephalem Rift or Speed builds and most well known here would be Vyr’s or Firebird Wizard. Wizards have options to utilize SoJ, say; Gesture of Orpheus or Firebird’s Eye off-hand but since CoE works just fine it doesn’t quite worth the effort.

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The same build we have been talking about all along. Monk PoJ TR.

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My bad then. I was, mistakenly, under the impression that the discussion had moved in a more general direction.

PoJ TR likely uses SoJ because Won Khim Lau always rolls with lightning damage buff. By making all elemental damage rolls lightning and then equipping SoJ you can then use any rune with Tempest Rush, including Flurry for pushing.

Otherwise you’d have a completely useless affix on the weapon doing nothing and your total elemental damage would be lower.

Edit:

Looking at the Maxroll guide it literally says what I said, although much more briefly.

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Just a follow up, after following suggestions on here, finding a Balance and MoC, and a few tweaks to existing gear, I am handling torment 16 easily & GR80 fairly easily (finishing in around 3 to 3.5 minutes usually).

Thanks :slight_smile:

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Very nice improvement, wearing all the right gear for the right modifiers. Just quickly looking as you get your ancient gear pieces I’d drop the habit of rolling secondary stats, that should be one of the last things you do, you want to make sure to get optimized Primary stats which a lot of your gear is still missing albeit having the right legendary modifiers and gear selection.

Besides more gem leveling and augmenting that should be it, you’re well on your way :+1:

Thanks,
I usually look to get rid of the most pointless (IMO) stats, like more gold or bigger gold P/U radius, or even more exp per kill, in favor of something that actually helps. I hadn’t really thought about it beyond that. Out of the 13 pieces, I have 5 that have secondary stats rolled (not counting when needed for sockets). I will work on replacing those.

The min-maxing portion is all about figuring out what makes your build work, and getting specific breakpoints and such so that you can make it function the best. That sometimes translates into wanting to DROP a main stat roll, ironically. Especially if you have tons of paragons or high augments.

Like, let’s say the build you want scales really well with attack speed for example. And you’re one or two IAS rolls from reaching another breakpoint. It could theoretically be better to roll a socket or a mainstat OFF a gear piece, in favor of IAS, then recoup the difference via augments or re-structuring your paragon distribution.

Main stats are usually one of the most valuable, so this doesn’t happen often. I’m just mentioning it because it’s easy to fall into the trap of “well I HAVE to get sockets on this otherwise beast mode off-hand item because otherwise I miss the Royal gem’s worth of main stat” when the actual best move might be to make it roll + damage to your main nuke skill. Stuff like that.

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Thanks, I was just about to post, when rolling how do you decide between (for example) +Vit or +%Sweeping wind damage. So different, it’s hard to figure out the best way to go. I guess just what works better for you.

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:point_up: That right there is the true god-tier advice.

If you want to go all-out min-max, there is concrete math that tells us what the optimal roll is in any given situation. But, since we’re not robots, there’s going to be human variance to it in the execution step.

For instance, Squirt’s necklace has looooong been the staple “GR pushing” meta neck for literally any class that can afford to wear it. I never wear it. Why? Because I’m rather awful at that kind of micro-positioning. I get hit by stuff a lot, which means I lose the buff a lot, so I’d rather put something else in there.

Does my damage go down? Yes, but I survive and I have fun. End of the day, you gotta do what works for you, as you said.

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Squirt’s buff can indeed be maintained either by avoiding being hit or using shields (on classes that have them) but the main benefit of it when GR pushing is when the hero picks up a Shield pylon which gives them damage immunity for 1 minute (2 minutes if Flavor of Time emanated by follower). This means the hero cannot take damage, so they cannot lose the buff, so they effectively get 2 minutes of double damage. If you can manage to combine that with a Power pylon, it’s game on.

I used it on a WW/Rend Barb that’s getting hit in the face all the time, i.e. he never has the buff active until/unless he gets a shield pylon. The chance of two minutes of double damage is worth the necklace not really doing much at other times.

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