The Crusader Invoker set should not be class restricted. The invoker should be all classes so all classes can have a thorns build.
It used to be, almost NO ONE played Invoker when it was not class restricted.
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Is that because almost no classes have thorns-related abilities? Barbarian and necromancer are the only ones I can think of. But I honestly haven’t really looked into it.
Crusader has more skills that affect it, though, so that could be a reason.
Changing the Invoker set to be usable for all classes would mean that the Crusader would have only 4 class-specific sets, instead of 5, like the other classes have. That would require the developers to create a new class set for the Crusaders in order to keep them even with the other classes.
And demon hunters shouldn’t be the only class that uses bows and crossbows
Each class has 5 class specific set. The Crusader sets are Roland’s, Invokers, Aegis of Valor, Seeker of the Light and Akkhan.
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Whoops, completely blocked out the new sets. Thanks for the correction.
Yes but no.
Demon’s Hide Set have fire thorns but not a single class can utilize it. Not even Firebird Wizards. Since Sets came into the game and stabilized their place, the passive abilities determine your playstyle more than active skills. Mind you, not many of classes have thorns related passives.
Witch Docs once had one but it’s turned into something else. Half of the classes don’t even benefit from bearing a shield to block damage or having to stack thorns. Crusaders and perhaps Necromancers fit the motive here only. Back a few seasons everything was about area damage and clone based builds weren’t even slightly part of the game. It came along with massive influence and repetitive fan feedback. My hopes that they listen more feedback and integrate some Nephalem Glory related bonuses as much as thorns or shields.
Barbarians once had a LoN build for thorns (Frenzy Thorns), but it got replaced by the H90 set. Thorns became moot.
Thanks for all the great opinions!
I still want the thorn’s set for my barbarian. I don’t play cursed-sader any more - too weak to me. As for the 5 set per class, they could make a set for the cursed sader that doesn’t focus around the justice skill and just maybe I might play the class again. I am a melee orientated player which is why i suck at playing the demon hunter, witch doctor, and wizard.
Ah, well, i know it’s wishful thinking!
This was almost a decent idea. Almost. Nephalem Glory shouldn’t be a thorns-only gimmick, because that makes Neph Glory useless for over half the classes. This is what I mean when I say your posts show a surprising lack of game knowledge. Neph Glory is, as I recall, actually powerful on console.
You were right that Thorns power should probably be tied to passive skills.
If they want to fix thorns, places to look are “Hack” and Sanguinary Bracers, and perhaps Deathwatch Mantle.
Fixings D3’s terrible itemization can basically be summed up as “take items that suck, like Hack and Sanguinary, and make them NOT suck.”
Invoker needs a proper weapon and shield…
Norvald seems like one, but to use that set need to use a passive the reduces damage.
I definitely would like more thorns type builds, at least for melee
characters.
Number one, make it so.
No. This is a shockingly bad suggestion. But agree about needing the proper weapon. The DR thing is easy to fix. I could fix it in 10 minutes.
You figure out how much thorns a build could conceivably get, and then you figure out a multiplier that reads like “Reduces damage taken by X% of your total Thorns damage” and slap it on the Invoker four piece.
Boom. Suddenly the Thorns set is about THORNS and you can play the build the way you want without being tied to Bombardment.
Sanguinary Bracers would read something like "Every second deal X% of your thorns damage to enemies within 16 yards."
Hack would do something like "Increase your thorns damage by a multiplier, eg 300%)
Then you just plug in the numbers and build the set.
You took out the important part of what I wrote:
Norvald seems like one, but to use that set need to use a passive the reduces damage.
totally different from
Norvald seems like one.
No, it’s not. Using Norvald’s is using Norvald’s, with or without a DR passive.
I suggest you to read it again. I clearly said “as much as” there and I replied to someone who mentioned all classes which isn’t entirely related to the Crusader only. I’m not trying to tie Nephalem Glory to be a thorns gimmick. Nor I ever mentioned them together only in the phrase as you completely glossed over the word: shields. I thought it was pretty straight forward and clear expression. Appears I was wrong there only.
If it’s anything it’s your own bad idea. It’s beyond me how you concluded that to be the case. I just want those traits to be a part of different builds and different characters, I’m not talking about tying them together if it wasn’t clear before.
Also to note, Crusaders first released with a Nephalem Glory based passive ability, which is related to the thread and yes, it was on PC too; that passive later replaced by Fanaticism. Now same Crusaders have thorns related abilities emphasized both PC and on consoles because updates always match. For the record, Crusaders never did have a mish mash of “thorns but only when glory active” passive either; they never did.
Why are you so stuck on details and criticizing my game knowledge every time? What are you exactly trying to measure or prove? So far in this thread two people, including me, said you’re taking things out of context. If you can not comprehend what you read, I have the right to question how come you made that connection from a very straight forward phrase.
I just want other characters to have the luxury of bearing a shield to enjoy block rate, neph glory or thorns, yet still be somewhat effective with it when they use a build to fully commit to combat. It was supposed to be a side discussion and you just leapt in.
I hope you quit it instead of not reading anything to criticize people out of nowhere.
“My hopes that they listen more feedback and integrate some Nephalem Glory related bonuses as much as thorns and shields”
If I meant what you said, I’d directly type it.
I apologize. I did not understand your wording. It is not as clear as you think it was. I read it (and frankly, STILL read it) as “Nephalem Glory should affect thorns and shields”