Try it first Arch. I am sure your opinion will change. In this build, we are fighting in 16-20 yard range. And it is killing trash much faster than LeapQuake. Enemy cap is a handicap for sure, but we are compensating this by slamming from appropriate locations and distances.
Try first man. You will love it. And as Felix pointed out, you can replace EW with FoT and CoE. It will definitely help a lot.
You just need to manage fury when CoA and WotB is down, which is about 5 sec with about 60% CdR.
CdR>AD>IAS is the stat priority.
IP with IB is crucial as there is no other LpF needed elsewhere.
This is not going to out dps Fire Zeis Leapquake in density
Not even close
The math is not comparable due to the bracer limitation and the item slots this needs (either COE or Crimson)
Set bonus 20,000 x 2.25 x Zeis X COE X Belt (x3.5) X Tribes Uncapped
Vs
20,000 x 2 x Zeis x Capped Bracer x FOTVP
I strongly disagree with anyone saying this is the same as Leapquake on a push map
There is 60% multi from CC2P. And 30% multi from no escape. Dont forget these. Also we use oculus rings more effectively.
Okay so I’m doing slightly below Fire EQ damage to 5 targets at a time?
How is that good?
Occulus usage is not relevant, both builds have Leap and can go to Oculus
Perfafrost procs trapped even when the target is at 50 yards away. Leap is only effective with trapped around the player.
We did dps simulations before. In this build bloodshed procs and All the ranged multi items interact in a way thar maximizes tge damage between 15 snd 20 yards.
I initially had no idea how good it would be. My estimates were it would be a bit behind IK HotA. I was wrong.
Sometimes you just have a play a build to see its true potential which is what I do.
You could be correct you may find it inferior to Leap Quake or R6 Hota. That is what we would like to know if it is or isn’t for a high paragon player. Thanks for taking the time to consider running the build and tell us what you think.
2 Likes
Besides what Prokahn mentioned with respect to CC and no escape, there is also attack speed and skill modifier.
I am not good at leap quake so I cannot make the direct correlation but I think after you run the set for a while you will be surprised at how much dps this turns out.
2 Likes
Well, all builds for Barb have Skill modifier that’s why I didn’t include it.
I’ll give it a shot on 132s, which is where I’m doing all my comparisons right now.
I know WW, Fire EQ, R6, and Vile Charge are all capable of 132.
I’m 50% positive Vile Charge and WW can do 134.
I’m 100% positive Fire EQ and R6 can do 134.
Based on trash pulls + boss HP
1 Like
Did a quick test on 130 + 132
Huge trash pull on Fester for all tests
Trash overwhelms this build on big pulls (meaning eventually it’s all DR’ed and walks right up to you through Permafrosts) and nothing is dying at all because you lose Zeis + Ranged passive
Mechanics change high up when stuff survives multiple attacks
;/
Earthquake would have gotten huge leads on these pulls, can’t even progress with SS
Also Bloodshed only hits stuff 20 yards around me, when I’m trying to stay AWAY from the density to Zeis it to death, Bloodshed is useless and not connecting against the packs
On proper pulls Bloodshed is uselss here
Unless I’m missing something major here, this build is nowhere close to Fire EQ on very high tiers
And yes I have good gear / paragon / gems for SS
1 Like
Thanks for taking a quick peek.
Right now I am doing GR120 and I have had several close calls on it without a really good level. When I have had good levels the mobs aren’t great, and when the mobs are good I don’t have pylons. Just a matter of time before I close it out.
If I got really good levels back to back I think I can do GR122 at 2.4k. I have always estimated that I would be around 10 GR behind you because of paragon and gems. Maybe I am closing the gap a bit.
I don’t doubt that you have the gear, if I have it I am sure you have it. Could you post a video of one of your tests? Just want to see which build you are running, I am assuming Storms correct? Thanks Arch.
This is one of Prokahns key points in the guide. The magic distance to stay away from mobs is 15-20 yards. This way you get Zeis, bloodshed and No escape. Pain in the a$$ but when you get it in a occulus ring it is really good.
When in doubt, just stay in the occulus ring.
One last thing, I am clearing GR110 in the 8-10 minute range. How fast can you clear GR120 (this is jut any generic rift)?
Trying to micro a precise distance of 20 yards just so you hit stuff on the edge of your Bloodshed, a low % Zeis bonus, and a 30% Passive is really bad in terms of optimizing damage on a push map
Max distance Zeis and No Escape is much better than having Bloodshed on the bar at all
In reality what happens in a 130 is that everything is alive for several minutes and walks right up to you, Permafrost “knockup” stops working eventually
I haven’t tried SS in speed 120s, should I? 110 aren’t exactly 130s.
I don’t care what builds can do in the 110 range… even LON WW smokes 110s
Don’t bother with anything below GR120. I am under the impression that speed GR110 for me would be equivalent to speed GR120 for you. If you cannot do GR120 in the 8-10 minute time frame I wouldn’t expect you to complete a GR130. Much less tactics involved in the speed runs. Just find an elite and mow them down by using the occulus ring and proper spacing if allowed.
For me in a GR120, (I am approximating your GR130) things don’t die immediately. I engage and then I jump back to get some range along the path that I want to go. Rinse repeat until I get a pack of around 3 elite mobs where I will spend more time in the occulus rings. Once the trash thins out I proceed to drag the elites again.
Seems to me the undead mobs are best for this type of action, they follow slow so its not terrible to get distance. I also like the bees.
I am not at the perfect spacing all the time, you just have to remember what it is and try and take advantage of it when you can.
Right now I only need to get ahead of the timer by 3 minutes to take out the RG. Not sure how far ahead of the timer you need to be on leap quake.
You can’t approximate that way, because GR doesn’t scale the same way paragon and gems do.
So you can’t say “I think GR 110 is like 120 for you”. The build is very important. What it can and can’t do won’t be magically changed by paragon. Even many tens of thousands of Paragon (which no one has) – 20,000 or 30,000 Paragon won’t put a bad build on the same playing field as another.
It sounds to me more like this build’s push range is in the mid 120’s range, which is why you’re starting to struggle on 120-122, and someone with 8000+ Paragon can crank it up a few levels higher. But not 10 levels higher. 10 is a lot.
Doesn’t mean max para / gems will make this build good in 130s.
Paragon and gems won’t necessarily give me 10 GR levels on speeds with this build. The build has to have a damage baseline.
I tried to make the comparison based on the extra damage from your gems and strength.
My strength is 23k, at 9k paragon you should be around 55-60k? That would more than double your damage compared to me. Also your gems are 150 compared to my 118-120 so I approximated another couple of GRs for your gems.
Everything else should be approximately equal.
How many more GR would you equate to increasing your damage by 200% provided that you can handle the incoming damage? Myself as well as others have shown that a 50% increase in damage will get you an extra 3-4 GRs.
1 Like
No, I’m definitely not running with 60k strength LOL, where are you getting that number from?
If you’re fishing for a GR 122 or whatever, someone with p8000+ and maxed out gems is going to be fishing for a 126-128, not a 132.
You are severely overestimating the contributing factor of paragon on a build that is capped at 5 targets.
You can do the math if you want but what I am reporting here is what I saw in-game, as people requested.
I will record videos for these. What do you want me to test? 120s 130s? A basic, poorly played trash pull with Fire EQ compared to a basic- poorly played trash pull with this build looks COMPLETELY different progression-wise, and that’s bad.
My first impression of the build is that it needs to fish a lot just like WW, and when it gets a push-worthy map, it cannot take advantage of it at all like WW or EQ can.
Not even close.
The GR increase you’re seeing is likely because rhis build is less demanding than pure DPS EQ, and you can survive huge pulls with this at your paragon.
But damage wise this build does not touch Fire EQ with COE. Remember I am comparing this to push-tier Earthquake with full damage, not the gimped version with Band of Might.
For every level of GR, the monster’s blood volume increases by 17%; therefore, under the same conditions , each 17% increase in damage can raise a layer of GR;
For me, there are several ways to improve my damage:
- Upgrade the gem level;
At present, my gem level is 120, if all are upgraded to 150; the damage is increased to:
(1+(180-168)/168) * (1+(160-151)/151) * 1.03=1.17
Description:
The first bracket is the increase of Zei’s;
The second bracket is the increase of Trapped;
The third is the increase of Stricken . It is difficult to calculate quantitatively, just take a rough value.
- Improve paragon;
At present, my paragon is 2300 and the Strength is 22000. If I raise my paragon to 9000, Strength can be increased (9000-2300)*5=33500; the damage is increased to:
(33500+22000)/22000=2.52
3.If I get 9000+ paragon,I will get a lot of toughness because of the buff of leap.So I will give up ignor pain instead of Overpower (which could increase 8% CHC).Meanwhile I use Frostburn or Leoric’s Crown in Cube.This change would increase the damage to about 1.25;
- Have better gear;
If my weapons, necklaces, BOM and gloves reach perfect quality, I guess I can get one more GR;
In summary, we can roughly calculate:
1.17 * 2.52 * 1.25=3.68
1.17^8=3.51
Both are roughly equivalent
So by the improvement of the gem level and paragon, I should be able to improve 8 GRs;
I can improve 1 GR by upgrading the gear;
At present, it is not difficult for me to pass the 122 GR (requires a little good luck), so my assessment is that if I have 9000 paragon, the gems of 150, the better gear, my upper limit is 122+8+1=131 ;
1 Like
Ok
I will be using this build for the videos
https: //us.diablo3.com/en/profile/storm-15829/hero/109143965
Trash pull on 130s
1 Like
Make sure you have plenty of AD and CdR man. And maybe 1×7% IAS (not a must)
Good luck.
O_O
I have GG Earth gear man, including Quad gloves, primal amulet / rings / bracer / trifecta dmg / AD / 10 CDR Istvans weapons
the gear isn’t the problem, it’s the build
Barbarians have no damage so they must rely on AD and massive pulls to let them get into higher tears. When you cap a build at 5 targets it limits what you can do with big pulls, therefor killing its scaling potential compared to WW, EQ, and Charge